Michael Dorosh Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Originally posted by Sgt. Emren: I wonder how many of the scenario designers tried to email El_Cid to complain off-line and asked to have their scenarios removed, before jumping in on this thread to stomp him? He did what some of you wanted to, didn't he (in fact he did more, 'cause he took ALL the packs offline)? What's wrong with sending an email saying: "Hey, you're a d***nose for no having asked my permission first. Now give me an apology, and you may keep my scenarios in your pack". When it comes to emailing people directly, most of us can be awfully lazy...I emailed him directly and made my displeasure known, and to his credit, he returned my email. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Tom, ...(being that they are available for anyone to download for free) the suggestion could me made the the designers of those scenarios have then lost all copyright and claim to them "IF" they are infact in the public domain.This is not legally correct. By default Copyright exists unless the author SPECIFICALLY states that he wiaves his rights or assigns conditions for use that are different from the norm. That is how the law works and that is how it should work. If someone wants to waive their rights, it is simple enough to do. In their scenario file they can simply state: "This sceario may be distributed freely and without the author's direct permission" Or he could write something more detailed: "This sceario may be distributed freely and without the author's direct permission unless distributed from Tom's website, because he is Canadian and I don't like the thought of Canadians getting their hockey sweat and beer breath anywhere near my work" Of course some want there to be no restrictions. Fine. But it is not for them to decided. The only person that can decided that is the person who made it. Plain and simple. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwxspoon Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Um.... I think maybe this has gone too far already, but since I can't stop reading this thread I would like to introduce the concept of "In The "Public Domain" and "Fair Use". I am not an Intellectual Proterty rights lawyer but in would kindly suggest that such an individual might reasonably ask the question "Were the scenarios in question in the Public Domain?" If the answer to that question is yes (being that they are available for anyone to download for free) the suggestion could me made the the designers of those scenarios have then lost all copyright and claim to them "IF" they are infact in the public domain. Now if the entire site at the Scenario Depo has Copyright signs written all over it, (and I don't know the answer to that) it could be reasonably argued that the scenario's are NOT in the Public Domain and thus the designer have not lost their intellectual property rights claim to them. It should be noted IIRC that once a work has been given away as a promotional piece to the media for unlimited distribution it is then in the public domain and I beleive the author has lost claim to it (I think?) I am NOT saying anyone here is RIGHT or anyone else is wrong. I am just posting hopeing that an Intellectual property rights lawyer will show up and help us determine if the scenarios in question were or were not in fact in the Public Domain? remember.... "It takes a village" Tom- I must say something in response to your post. I think if you read back on my other posts in this thread you will see I have not really had a problem with any of my scenarios being used in El Cid's packs. BUT, I must tell you that I completely disagree with your idea that my work becomes public domain after I allow others to play it. If I honestly felt that were the case, I would cease designing scenarios for public distribution until such time as I felt that my creations were recognized as solely my own property. I don't mind at all if folks want to post my work all over as long as credit is given, but I would never release another scenario if my creation was no longer deemed my own intellectual property. Anyway, I hope El Cid reconsiders, picks the scenarios he wants for his packs, gets permission from the designers, and posts them. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agua Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: Given that 700+ people can download a scenario and only three will be bothered to review it at the Depot . . . I realize this is somewhat off the point of this thread, but Mike's comment has provided a vehicle to make a comment I have wanted to communicate to the authors for a while now. I imagine my comments would be echoed by a lot of folks who use the depot. I have played an obscene number of scenarios. I have downloaded numerous scenarios that I have never gotten around to playing. I have, however, only reviewed, probably, somewhere around 25 - 35 of them. The reason is I REALLY try to only provide reviews for scenarios that truly *impress* me in a positive way. It is difficult to determine how an author will react to negative comments, or even ho-hum comments, so, in general, unless the author is someone whom I've worked with before, I don't provide a review that would leave a bad impression of the effort for the public to view. Now, there is an exception here and there, but this is done when I find a scenario that has a lot of promise, that displays a good bit of raw talent, but for some reason, be it the briefing, the number of turns, what have you, the scenario just falls short. In the case of a really bad scenario, I have e-mailed the author and provided a private critique that, I hope, was constructively received. My point here is, the consuming public appreciates the authors' scenarios; GREATLY appreciates those efforts. However, I venture a guess that a lot of folks take the same approach and simply do not provide feedback for anything they cannot *honestly* provide a very positive review. The direct point I'm getting to here, or trying to make, is that I hope the authors understand that lack of feedback in the form of a review at the depot should, in many cases, be taken as politeness, or courtesy, rather than selfishness or a lack of appreciation. [Edited to lower the estimated number of reviews identified in the second paragraph of my comment] [ January 07, 2003, 12:37 PM: Message edited by: Agua ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desim8 Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Originally posted by rune: But in coding Linux, anything released with someone else's code, the author of the code is given credit, and is asked if the code can be used. Yep credit is given. I'm not sure about the asking though, the License says you can redistro and modify. However it would IMHO be best to contact the author on a practical level they may have knowledge/experience that you don't have. Say for instance I create a historical map for a historical battle, unfortunately my sources for the OB's are somewhat lacking. It would be best use of time if someone else with that knowledge could use my map to improve on my scenario. Could be years after I loose interest in the game! The community benefits and I won't come along at a later date demanding that 12 different versions all using my map get taken down. Note; It is as BFC say - your work, you can restrict how you like - I was mearly pointing out a very cheep/successful way of developing. There are others that the Linux community uses. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hortlund Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 If you guys want to get all legal about this, which I think is the wrong way to approach the problem (check my profession in my profile if you want), I'll give you something to chew on. What law is applicable to files found on, and downloaded from the internet? Basically it all boils down to this one question: Where is the server located and what does the laws of that nation say about the specific file? There you have it, the legal aspect of it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hortlund Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 Originally posted by Andreas: Well, I found your post pretty insulting. You can pull an ASL Vet of course and try to hide behind your low-level sarcasm. How about this - if you don't have to add anything to the topic, which you clearly don't, since you busy yourself with sniping, just stay out of it?Now I know that English is not my first language and all, but what does "pull an ASL vet of cource and try to hide beind your low level sarcasm" mean? As for my participation in this thread, and your objections to me posting here. Would that be another example of how someone (me apparently...simply by posting here) has violated commonly held conventions established by this community? [ January 07, 2003, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: Leutnant Hortlund ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dullard aka flyingcursor Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 I would have thought that since the game itself belongs to the publisher then any scenarios would also be property of the publisher. In fact this came up on another game forum once and it was made clear that nobody but the publisher owned anything associated with the game including user made scenarios. Now Steve implies that the creator of a scenario has an implicit copyright. Amazing. Anyway I always ask first just out of courtesy and I prefer to be asked. However I haven't uploaded any scenarios yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmatt Posted January 7, 2003 Share Posted January 7, 2003 THe files have been removed and El-Cid has retired from the forum, I assume, because of transpired after his initial post. I am locking this thread up. Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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