Nabla Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 We know that CM1 is pretty much finished now, and BTS is starting to work with CM2. While the development of CM1 was still on its way, from the development point of view the role of this bulletin board and the ideas, test reports, bug reports and other forms of input from the enthusiastic user groups were to improve CM1. While following discussions I've become convinced that users of this (words fail me) game are extremely willing to contribute to the development of the game. I also think that the ideas, tests etc. are a valuable asset for BTS. Based on my experience I would say that users will keep developing the ideas as long as they know that their contribution are being considered and can make a difference. In practical terms this means that there has to be an active feedback system, which for CM1 was implemented by both discussion threads and new release versions. However, for CM2 the situation is not that simple, and I think that lately I have been seeing a lot of threads with good ideas, and faily little feedback from BTS. So two questions come up naturally: 1) How does BTS see the role of these this bulleting board in the development of CM2? 2) Have you thought about the problem of giving feedback on the ideas about CM2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goofy Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 I'm also willing to show my support and belief in the product by pre-ordering as I did with CMBO! Any idea when that will start? ------------------ Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of elderberries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabla Posted January 17, 2001 Author Share Posted January 17, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goofy: I'm also willing to show my support and belief in the product by pre-ordering as I did with CMBO! Any idea when that will start? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Absolutely, add me up to the pre-ordering list as well. Perhaps I should have named the topic "BTS, you know we'll give you our money, what else do you want from us now" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 What BTS wants: Send money, beer, pizza; in large quantities! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 Did anyone mention CM2 Beta Demo? Or is CMBO to be considered a CM2 Beta? Cheers Olle ------------------ Srategy is the art of avoiding a fair fight... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 Nabla wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>So two questions come up naturally: 1) How does BTS see the role of these this bulleting board in the development of CM2? 2) Have you thought about the problem of giving feedback on the ideas about CM2?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Excellent points Nabla. In the V1.1 A Major Bug? thread, it was suggested that some sort of process was conceivably of use for these aspects as well as authenticating or sorting through the never ending stream of notions as to what was, and what was not, historically authentic and of a large enough or common enough scope to wind up being included in CM. But the last starshell was fired and still nothing was heard from the SS California. ------------------ "Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth." -Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916) [This message has been edited by Bruno Weiss (edited 01-17-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Clark Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 I'll pre-order the second there is a CM2 demo that lets me know everything is peachy between my PC and CM2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 "BTS, what do you want from us now? " how about this: Lets all leave them all alone for 12-18 months while CM2 is in its incubation period. the BEST thing we can all do for BTS to spread the TRUTH about this great game far and wide and increase sales by trying to get all our friends to buy a copy and tell their friends about the now nearly PERFECT v1.1 WITH tcp/ip that is already out there. Spread the news! Promote CMBO as the BEST wargame you ahve ever seen. If the Sales keep rollling in for BTS they will be happier and continue to diligently plug away at the sure to be NEW and improved CM2!! Now go forth and promote CM beyond just this forum. -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coralsaw Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by aka_tom_w: Lets all leave them all alone for 12-18 months while CM2 is in its incubation period. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, I know that your post was tongue-in-cheek Tom, but that's not quite it. There are a lot of people on this forum, that spend time and time answering questions, and can help make CM2 ten times better than CMBO. The Beta brigade is doing a great job, and I wouldn't expect BTS to discuss their full development plan with mere mortals here, but Nabla has a good point, and if I can judge from past behaviour, Steve and Charles are indeed talking closely with the community at all times. As to promoting the game, I among others mefinks, do as much as possible, but don't send me on a promotion mission, I won't do it, I already have a job. Regards ------------------ My squads are regular, must be the fibre in the musli... [This message has been edited by coralsaw (edited 01-17-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yarb Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 I think buying yourself another copy of CMBO every two or three months you continue to be obsessed with it would be proper compensation for BTS I'm fairly sure there's at least four games I haven't bought since I got CMBO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Yarb: I think buying yourself another copy of CMBO every two or three months you continue to be obsessed with it would be proper compensation for BTS I'm fairly sure there's at least four games I haven't bought since I got CMBO.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I would like to take the copy of Hasbro's Squad Leader that I sunk 50 Canadian dollars into and send it back to them...in a flaming bag of dog manure preferably, but I think Canada Post has restrictions about sending mail that is actually on fire. Pity. Good lord, if the designers ever asked us for our input, I alone have a million "dream" items I would like to see included. Multiply that by 10 or 20 thousand satisfied customers, and they wouldn't have time for anything but reading emails! I think most of our suggestins would fall under the heading "chrome", anyway.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFCElvis Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 I was around for virtually all of the board discussion for CM1. Throughout the entire developement of CM1 Steve, Charles and all the beta testers would post items on this board about what is new with the game. This usually led to long discussions about historical aspects of the items and playability of the items. Many ideas that BTS had for certain aspects of the game were (and still are) affected by discussions held on this board. No doubt the lions share of debate took place between Steve, Charles and the betas but if someone voiced a sound well reasoned debate it was heard. The point of this history lesson you ask?: "BTS, what do you want from us now?" When the time comes and information begins to come in from beta testers and BTS if we have an opinion, especially a conflicting idea, be prepared to defend your position in a clear and reasonable way. Also, be prepared to back up your ideas with historical evidense that the people being asked to make the changes have (or can have)access to. And making sure no discussion ever turns personal or into a flame war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 How about a section solely for "fans" to make suggestions for improvements or additions to CM or its future offshoots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dittohead Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 I think 4 sacrificial Virgins dressed in white would be appropriate. ------------------ The box is locked, its Robot Fighting time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirocco Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dittohead: I think 4 sacrificial Virgins dressed in white would be appropriate.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> We all have that on our personal wish lists... ------------------ "He belongs to a race which has coloured the map red, and all he wants are the green fields of England..." - Joe Illingworth, Yorkshire Post War Correspondent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 Why should they be in white? I think it more historically authentic to be dressed in blue. Recognized throughout Asian cultures as a Royal color. I'm sure the sacrificial training manual specified blue. That ain't bad Michael Dorosh, but it would still be full of "crows in the trees" and "ducks in the ponds". Eye of the beholder thing. I'm still wondering about a mechanism that both gains a measure of consensus, and provides for authenticity verification. Hmmm, but what... ------------------ "Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth." -Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabla Posted January 18, 2001 Author Share Posted January 18, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Elvis: I was around for virtually all of the board discussion for CM1. Throughout the entire developement of CM1 Steve, Charles and all the beta testers would post items on this board about what is new with the game. This usually led to long discussions about historical aspects of the items and playability of the items. Many ideas that BTS had for certain aspects of the game were (and still are) affected by discussions held on this board. No doubt the lions share of debate took place between Steve, Charles and the betas but if someone voiced a sound well reasoned debate it was heard. The point of this history lesson you ask?: "BTS, what do you want from us now?" When the time comes and information begins to come in from beta testers and BTS if we have an opinion, especially a conflicting idea, be prepared to defend your position in a clear and reasonable way. Also, be prepared to back up your ideas with historical evidense that the people being asked to make the changes have (or can have)access to. And making sure no discussion ever turns personal or into a flame war.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This sounds like a reasonable way of working together, especially if it worked with CM1 (I'm fairly new around here and therefore do not know everything that happened with CM1, but I'd sure like to donate a part of my brain to CM2 ). However, to avoid the frustration of users that now have long and interesting discussions with no response I'd be very pleased to hear BTS's opinion on this. Also, I'd like to know if BTS already has a full supply of Beta testers. If some seats are available, you can count me in. Although I do understand that I might be at the end of a very long, communism style line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted January 18, 2001 Share Posted January 18, 2001 Nabla, [serious mode="ON"/] Good post. I think Steve and Charles mention in various media and also here that they are still hearing, reading and locking out our posts. I am pretty sure they are still the minority of this industry who don't rush software out driven by some stupid marketing people and listen to constructive advises. They actions have proved themselves so far -- that's why we have 1.0 without TCP and now 1.1 with TCP included. There are already a large number of discussions about CM2 or even CM3 back in he beta demo days. I am sure they are on their drawing board right now working on various thing we suggested or even we left off. Since all we know that CM2 covers the whole Eastern Front battles dated from June 1941 to May 1945. It will be bigger and badder than we have in CMBO right now. Charles, KD, Madmatt and others have mentioned form time-to-time, here-and-there, there will be a number of possible fundamental changes in game mechanisms like "rat warfare" in Stalingard and really long range tank battles. I agreed with Elvis and I would add if we keep the constructive and mature discussions going here, we are helping to fuel and construct a better CM2 over the already great CMBO. [serious mode="OFF"/] Had enough kinda words, eh? Okay, let's everybody on this board bring out their plastics and buy their 2nd/3rd/4th/etc copy of CMBO!!! Let's do it! Griffin. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" [This message has been edited by GriffinCheng+ (edited 01-18-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mr. Johnson-<THC>- Posted January 18, 2001 Share Posted January 18, 2001 BTS needs your Crank as soon as you can send it air express to them. If they are not sleeping the can get CM2 completed twice as fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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