karch Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 I just got my copy of X today and will be installing it. Does anyone know if the RAVE graphics extension that gets put into 9.1 (classic environ) has been updated? Does CM run in classic mode or will I have to do what I did before... boot back into OS9 change my extension set to the 9.1 graphics drivers. It will be great once more apps run native in X with protected memory and such, but until then.. It won't do me much good. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Did you know Apple is using Linux code in their new OSX? But isn't it funny how Mac keeps upgrading their OS when the majority of the available programs won't run on it? Kinda makes you wonder doesn't it? Upgrade to OS X yet I still have to use OS 9.1 to run things. Oh yeah, what's a Mac again? [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 03-27-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmead Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Actually Maximus, OSX contains nothing from Linux. What it is based on is a UNIX kernel (Mach?) which was part of the assets bought up with NEXT. Another item to keep in mind, our friends in the MS world often go thru what we only enjoy once in a while. Win 2K has been a nightmare for many. NT can be a never ending hassle. Don't get me started on Active X and all of the various and sundry bits and pieces can drive you around the bend. In order to have progress you have to have change. OSX will have many challenges, one will be software incompatibility. The change to PPC was much more traumatic. Right now there is alot of software that runs under OSX and each day will bring more. I can't wait for Maya, no more SGI or NT for me! Just my .02 [This message has been edited by kmead (edited 03-27-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Maximus, you obviously don't understand what OS X is as an operating system. Its an entirely NEW opertaing system. Not an incarnation of OS 9. I know it may be misleading but X is a complete rewriteup of an OS not OS 9.1 updated. It may be hard to understand, but its as different as going from Logo to DOS. Also, its UNIX based not Linux. I dont know if you remember NeXT, but OS X is basically NeXT OS of today. Its not really ment for backwards compatibility though it is supported (carbon). [This message has been edited by Freak (edited 03-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 From little information I gathered so far (sorry not really interested in jumping into OSX for my good Prismo) it is a Unix core (or more precisely Mach micro-kernel). It provides true preemptive multi-tasking which Wintel crowd has been enjoying for years (sadly) and better crash protection through better memory scheme (memory segmentation?). I am not sure why MacOS needs the latter cause for almost a year, I have seen less software crashes (spell G.P.F.) than Win95/98/NT crashes in a day - combined. FWIW, you get a number of GNU tools available right now for development but I am not sure if Sun JDK 1.3 and/or GNU Java are immediately available. That is pretty much a developer's pov. Griffin. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Get the CMSOD at Combat Missing Command Post (CMCP) at http://www.angelfire.com/games3/CMCP/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk-vfa201 Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Actually OS X being based on Unix Kernel the numebr of programs runnign on it are practically infinite. Take your favorite Unix program and compile it on a OS X Mac. What is that ... uhmm 100 times more programs or 1000 more than what is available for Wintel clones? Sorry, but bashing on Mac OS X now makes you look ignorant and misinformed. Period. End of story. Oh yes, the question was "what is a Mac?!". Sorry, you'll never understand it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Martin Cracauer Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 This is totally off-topic, but what theh heck... The Unix clone the MacOS X kernel is based on is 4.4BSD, with many extensions from FreeBSD, another free 4.4BSD derivate, developed by a group of volunteers like Linux, but in a more controlled way. The userland (not kernel, but libraries and commandline tools etc.) is even closer to FreeBSD. Apple developers are on the FreeBSD mailing lists. Linux has an inacceptable license and while overall good, still has hot spots of problems, like the filesystem, whereas the BSD derivates are a little smaller (feature-wise and code-wise), but what they have is of even quality. If you want to know more about that, please ask on the general forum. But does anyone know an anser to the original question, does CMBO run on MacOX X? Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk-vfa201 Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Serious post now here. I have a friend working in Seattle for MS. Know what are they doing now? studying OS X. His comments are: we are rushing like mad trying to catch up with Apple again. And he mentions something about Darwin. Same old MS story. It is amazing Windows is still around. Kinda THAT makes you wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Seahawk-vfa201, you forget, Maximus is ignorant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadmaN Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 DOS reigns superior over all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 As for CM AFAIK, CM does not work in classic mode. But it may work by booting into 9 as a startup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk-vfa201 Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Martin, ANY application that is carbonized will run on OS X. Developers say carbonizing an application is almost a no-brainer. Developing instead a cocoa application will take more time. Companies like Adobe, Aladdin, Iomega, NewTek (producing LightWave btwt) are all going native OS X but it takes more time although there is no one serious software developers having dared to say they are not going OS X and comments from developers are really enthusiastic. BTS could produce in short time a carbonized version of CM but I would hate to have it delay CM2 even by a week Anyway, the classic environment (9.1) runs concurrently and there is no need to boot into it: both OS may have applications running at same time but I would easily give CM a try: many applications run flawlessly on OS X as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 MadmaN Said: "DOS reigns superior over all." Yep my PC friends use DOS or did a few years ago. They liked to run all their emulation stuff on that over windows. But is it really superior over all? I doubt that. Is DOS even supported by MS anymore? I doubt that as well. [This message has been edited by Freak (edited 03-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk-vfa201 Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Originally posted by MadmaN: DOS reigns superior over all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Still OT: Yep, BSD is arguable the best Unix-like OS out there (Long Live Sun Microsystem! ), if not the market pressure (Unix SVR4), SunOS would still remain as a BSD derivative. For the file system, iirc, BSD uses 512-byte blocks whereas SVR4 employs 1024-byte blocks. That translates to better use of storage blocks. Linux is closer to SVR4 crowd. If my post is kinda flawed, pls let me know. Back to Topic: Back in MacOS X beta, reports posted here show CMBO is not compatible. Seperate boot is required. Personally, I don't see it is going to be changed unless Steve & Charle company says the otherwise. Griffin. Originally posted by Martin Cracauer: The userland (not kernel, but libraries and commandline tools etc.) is even closer to FreeBSD. Apple developers are on the FreeBSD mailing lists. Linux has an inacceptable license and while overall good, still has hot spots of problems, like the filesystem, whereas the BSD derivates are a little smaller (feature-wise and code-wise), but what they have is of even quality. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Get the CMSOD at Combat Missing Command Post (CMCP) at http://www.angelfire.com/games3/CMCP/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Way OT: I am pretty sure MS-DOS and Win95 are orphaned. But I am not sure if you can get hold of a copy of DR-DOS (a DOS "clone") not to mentioned if this one is even supported. Griffin. Originally posted by Freak: Is DOS even supported by MS anymore? ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Get the CMSOD at Combat Missing Command Post (CMCP) at http://www.angelfire.com/games3/CMCP/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Bates Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Originally posted by Maximus: Did you know Apple is using Linux code in their new OSX? But isn't it funny how Mac keeps upgrading their OS when the majority of the available programs won't run on it? Kinda makes you wonder doesn't it? Upgrade to OS X yet I still have to use OS 9.1 to run things. Oh yeah, what's a Mac again? [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 03-27-2001).] And what, exactly, does your posting have to do with the original question which was: "Anyone get CM running on OSX?" Do you feel incredibly threatened by the business organistion called Apple? Are they putting stuff in your cornflakes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 By M. Bates: And what, exactly, does your posting have to do with the original question which was: "Anyone get CM running on OSX?" Do you feel incredibly threatened by the business organistion called Apple? Are they putting stuff in your cornflakes? Maximus the troll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Hi mom! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaypee Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Originally posted by GriffinCheng+: Back to Topic: Back in MacOS X beta, reports posted here show CMBO is not compatible. Seperate boot is required. Quite right. For what it's worth though, I have been able to load it, go through all the motions of selecting games, sides and such, but the map won't draw. I can load the scenario editor and do everything up until previewing the map. Then the map won't draw but you can click where the Go button would be to exit the preview and return to the terrain editor. Most disappointing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarmo Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 I believe the big problem is Apple dropping all support for Quickdraw3D and Rave in favour of OpenGL in OS X. Quickdraw 3D was the last years "mac-standard" and CM is built around it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 Too harsh for ones eyes! [This message has been edited by Freak (edited 03-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 "loading 3D map" NOPE The full release MAC OSX (with the BSD 4.4 kernel) will not show the CMBO map. It went through all the start-up steps up until you click GO.... but then you get hung up at "loading 3D map" and thats it. as previously posted "the big problem is Apple dropping all support for Quickdraw3D and Rave in favour of OpenGL in OS X." So I guess that OpenGL in MAC OSX does not support CMBO So bottom line, at this point without fiddling with my Mac OSX config CMBO will not run. DON'T worry, it was, just on my "test" mac so my main mac laptop will be Running 9.1 until CMBO will run in OSX so I can keep playing! I would really like to load OSX on my laptop BUT not if CMBO won't run! -tom w [This message has been edited by aka_tom_w (edited 03-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooleen Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 I have just finished rolling out win2k company-wide and I am very pleased with the OS. My company also uses a UNIX server for all of our accounting packages etc....The unix server has yet to crash in my two years at this company. So far in two months, the win2k machines have yet to crash. If this osX really incorporates a UNIX kernel, then it should be stable, but what about it's graphic drivers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted March 28, 2001 Share Posted March 28, 2001 OK, Freak, you obviosuly have a problem accepting the views of a Windows user. OK, so I mispoke a little, Unix instead of Linux, but it's basically the same thing. Linus is just a toned-down version of Unix to work on Personal Computers instead of Servers and Mainframes. Anyway, no I don't feel threatened about the Apple "business organization". Why would I be frightened about a snobbish individual named Steve Jobs who won't share his source code to just anybody without first the somebody shelling out thousands of bucks for a glimpse of it. The so-called problems with Win2000 and NT is that all the drivers haven't been written yet for them. But here we have MacOS X that has abandoned Quickdraw3D and RAVE and adopted to OpenGL. So now that anything that is not written in OpenGL won't run. So what's the use of upgrading to a new system if it won't run anything other than OpenGL programs? That's like buying a huge supply of Uranium, but I don't have anything that runs on Uranium. That's the beauty of DirectX since Win95. It makes everything work. That's why there is no more of having to configure each game to work with your sound and video card. DirectX takes care of that. Besides I am so glad that 3Dfx's GLIDE API died. What a bunch of crap that was. If you didn't have a 3Dfx card you couldn't run in 3D acceleration mode if the product was only GLIDE-based e.g. Red Baron 3D. That is the problem with the Apple Organization. They only make things that work with Apple products. IBM's were the first MS-based products, yet it is very rare that anyone has a IBM computer. But the whole PC community is based on "IBM-compatible" computers. But everything Apple is Apple made. Talk about isolationist thinking. Oh how dare Apple to sell their patents to other manufactures to create competition to help drive down the costs of Apple-based computers. Ever wonder why Macs are so expensive? It's called a M-O-N-O-P-O-L-Y-! PCs would be the same way if it was only IBM making the machines and hardware. Don't feed the monopoly. Feed competition. Do you think gasoline would be this expensive if there was another wide-spread fuel used in automobiles like methane or what have you? So if you wanna buy expensive stuff, go right ahead, but don't go bashing other users who buy cheaper stuff because of competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts