Sequoia Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 I'll speculate it's because if it was there, players would want to use it for its primary purpose, which was towing various larger guns, which isn't a game feature. Thoughts? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 I assume it's for the same reason that many other heavy prime movers are not included, it's technically outside of the scope of CM games. Those large guns would be impractical to use in a mobile offensive role, and if they're already in place they don't need to be moved and so the heavy prime movers will be well behind the lines and out of combat. That being said, it would be pretty neat, I won't be complaining if they if they eventually introduce heavy prime movers so we could move the big guns despite the impracticality 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probus Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 (edited) How long did it take to pack up and set up these big guns? EDIT: Wiki says it can be set up in an AT role in 2.5 minutes... Edited February 4 by Probus 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sequoia Posted February 5 Author Share Posted February 5 I don't know German AT gun doctrine. I would think though, after their position is revealed, a good tactic would be, if possible, pack and hitch up and move. I suspect it's not in the game is because of the work involved in the animation of having every different gun and crew doing that, and have it look passably real. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 On 2/5/2024 at 10:35 AM, Sequoia said: I don't know German AT gun doctrine. I would think though, after their position is revealed, a good tactic would be, if possible, pack and hitch up and move. I suspect it's not in the game is because of the work involved in the animation of having every different gun and crew doing that, and have it look passably real. True, shooting and scooting to another prepared position after an AT gun is revealed does sound like good idea, I haven't considered that. Not sure if it was done though. I know that many heavy guns are theoretically capable of being set up in a few minutes or even fired from the travel mount in emergencies, but I'm not sure how often it was actually done or if was common enough to implement into CM games. I feel like it probably wouldn't be done in ideal scenarios as you wouldn't want to risk the vulnerable transports. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artkin Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 I believe they were pretty rare but yeah I'd love to have these bad boys in the series eventually. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vacillator Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 On 2/4/2024 at 11:54 PM, Probus said: Wiki says it can be set up in an AT role in 2.5 minutes. So game time is not the reason then. More likely this: On 2/5/2024 at 2:35 AM, Sequoia said: the work involved in the animation of having every different gun and crew doing that I'd be happy to look the other way while the gun and crew magically re-connect... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 On 2/7/2024 at 7:45 PM, Vacillator said: I'd be happy to look the other way while the gun and crew magically re-connect... Yeah, even if it was janky without proper animations, I would take functionality over graphics any day. I wonder if AA and Heavy guns not being able to be towed in WW2 CM games is due to the heavy tractors not being included in the games, or if the heavy tractors were not included because the AA and Heavy guns were not intended to be towed. A chicken and egg situation perhaps. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 Even in CM1, once one disembarked an 88mm one could never reembark it. My understanding was that it took too much time for a typical CM mission. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vacillator Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 5 minutes ago, Erwin said: My understanding was that it took too much time for a typical CM mission. I also thought I'd read that was the reason, but: On 2/4/2024 at 11:54 PM, Probus said: Wiki says it can be set up in an AT role in 2.5 minutes... I'm not totally clear what 'it' is but I think the discussion was about large AT/AA guns in general. Being currently in the middle of a 3 hour game, I seem to have plenty of time to drop off, deploy, perhaps fire, pick up, move, drop off etc.? Instead of which I have two Pak40s being manually pushed to relocate them. Not sure how often that happened apart from short distances? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probus Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 I'm tellin' ya... Wikipedia says 2.5 minutes and as we all know, Wikipedia is always right! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vacillator Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 36 minutes ago, Probus said: I'm tellin' ya... Wikipedia says 2.5 minutes Even if it was 30 minutes in my 3 hour game, that would be do-able (and useful). Otherwise you have a big chunk of metal sat in the wrong place right up to 3 hours. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 I'm pretty sure that the 88mm can be fired from the travel carriage for the AT role in an emergency, maybe that's what the 2.5 min figure is referring to? Maybe such guns could get a semi-deployed state with low accuracy and fire rate to represent the crew desperately manhandling the gun into a barely usable position, while it still needs to be fully emplaced to have full accuracy and fire rate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weapon2010 Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 it was in the original CMBO , able tow all guns and transport troops, except the 88( set up time was hours), I think it should be included as it is a classic German vehicle, perhaps in the now rare vehicle pack? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 I recall deploying 88mm from a SdKfz7 in CM1. However, one could never reembark the 88mm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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