No DShKs in the game?

[Artkin]

1 hour ago, Traitor said:

I think that's the reason for the DShK only being available in the game as a specialist team, historically they weren't mass issued to Rifle Divisions or machine gun battalions. You can find pictures of them from WW2 in both tripod mounted AA roles and wheeled HMG roles, so they were used, but it was probably only for specialist teams instead of standard issue equipment.

PS: I'm pretty sure the DShK AA tripod and wheeled mount are actually the same mounting, the wheels and gunshield can be detached and the carriage converts into a AA tripod. From Forgotten Weapons. So the AA specialist teams could easily convert the gun for the HMG role depending on the need.

Ah cool. In that case there would have been 3x HMGs in the rifle division's rifle regiment HQ... to serve as AA guns. In this case it would probably be best to leave them as specialist teams unless battlefront wants to add the rifle division's AA machine gun company. Not out of scope considering other divisional level units are included in the game such as recon companies, antitank battalions and sapper battalions

[Traitor]

12 minutes ago, Artkin said:

Ah cool. In that case there would have been 3x HMGs in the rifle division's rifle regiment HQ... to serve as AA guns. In this case it would probably be best to leave them as specialist teams unless battlefront wants to add the rifle division's AA machine gun company. Not out of scope considering other divisional level units are included in the game such as recon companies, antitank battalions and sapper battalions

I agree, but since the existing DShK model in the game is in the ground combat configuration, if  BFC restores the DShK into the game it will likely be in that form. I suppose it's not unreasonable for a commander to use a primarily AA HMG team for ground combat given how the gun mount can be quickly converted for either role, but that would mean it would only be available as a specialist team as it wasn't the most common usage of the weapon.

Hypothetically, and it would require more coding and new models, it would be cool if the wheeled HMG/transport configuration functioned as a "semi-deployed" state and you could choose to fully deploy it to use it as AA.....however I'm pretty sure all the non self-propelled AA in the game are static emplacements, I don't even know if it would be possible to code such a weapon.

[Brille]

16 hours ago, Traitor said:

I think that's the reason for the DShK only being available in the game as a specialist team, historically they weren't mass issued to Rifle Divisions or machine gun battalions. You can find pictures of them from WW2 in both tripod mounted AA roles and wheeled HMG roles, so they were used, but it was probably only for specialist teams instead of standard issue equipment.

PS: I'm pretty sure the DShK AA tripod and wheeled mount are actually the same mounting, the wheels and gunshield can be detached and the carriage converts into a AA tripod. From Forgotten Weapons. So the AA specialist teams could easily convert the gun for the HMG role depending on the need.

Saw this great video from Ian a while ago but wasn't aware that it was this rare of a gun. Surely it was not as common as the M2 but I would have thought that it was a bit more wide spread. This however is FG42 kind of rare...  (at least in ww2) 

If you now consider that it was mainly meant for aa duty it may be understandable that it was patched out (if it was intentional). 

But since it is fully modeled in the game it would be a shame to just leave it unused, historical accuracy aside. 

 

Edited July 13, 2023 by Brille

[Traitor]

On 7/13/2023 at 2:43 PM, Brille said:

Saw this great video from Ian a while ago but wasn't aware that it was this rare of a gun. Surely it was not as common as the M2 but I would have thought that it was a bit more wide spread. This however is FG42 kind of rare...  (at least in ww2) 

If you now consider that it was mainly meant for aa duty it may be understandable that it was patched out (if it was intentional). 

But since it is fully modeled in the game it would be a shame to just leave it unused, historical accuracy aside. 

 

I think it will be fine if it's limited to specialist teams only like BFC originally intended, it's not unreasonable that a commander might attach one of the AA HMG teams to other formations to serve as a HMG, it's not like they have to re-mount the gun or anything as the carriage can be quickly converted for either role.

[eniced73]

deleted

Edited November 14, 2023 by eniced73

[eniced73]

On 7/9/2023 at 2:57 PM, BFCElvis said:

There is a laundry list of missing units. All have been submitted to HQ. Here's the complete list:

Vehicles Missing from Single Vehicle menu

Sturmpanzer IV Brummbär (mid)
Sturmpanzer IV Brummbär (late)
Elefant
Hummel
Pz IIIM (Flame)
Soviet Units missing from Specialist Teams menu

DP LMG (Army and Guards)
DPM LMG (Army and Guards)
DShK HMG (Army and Guards)
German Units missing from Specialist Teams menu

Flamethrower (except Luftwaffe)
LMG34 (Heer and SS)
HMG34 (SS and Volkssturm)
LMG42 (SS and Volkssturm)
HMG42 (Volkssturm)
PaK36(r) 76mm (Heer, SS and Luftwaffe except airborne)
IeG18 75mm (Heer, SS and Luftwaffe armored infantry. Also Heer infantry prior to October and SS infantry prior to February)

 

@BFCElvis  Has this been fixed?

Edited November 14, 2023 by eniced73

[BFCElvis]

5 hours ago, eniced73 said:

@BFCElvis  Has this been fixed?

This one apparently slipped through the fingers of the TO&E person. They've reached out to Charles to see about a quick patch and were told "We can do a quick patch, but not this week." 

Thank you for the nudge.

[Anthony P.]

On 11/14/2023 at 9:34 PM, BFCElvis said:

This one apparently slipped through the fingers of the TO&E person. They've reached out to Charles to see about a quick patch and were told "We can do a quick patch, but not this week." 

Thank you for the nudge.

The same would appear to be the case for AT-4s in Cold War: 

 

[Vacillator]

20 minutes ago, Anthony P. said:

The same would appear to be the case for AT-4s in Cold War:

Perhaps, but this is the Red Thunder forum .

[Anthony P.]

24 minutes ago, Vacillator said:

Perhaps, but this is the Red Thunder forum .

Hush you, there's enough developer love to go around!

 

(Also I low key wanna see how ATGMs work out in RT.)

[Traitor]

On 11/15/2023 at 4:34 AM, BFCElvis said:

This one apparently slipped through the fingers of the TO&E person. They've reached out to Charles to see about a quick patch and were told "We can do a quick patch, but not this week." 

Thank you for the nudge.

Thanks for the update on the patch, I understand if it takes a while, seems like the team is busy with Engine 5!

Could you ask if they could take another look at the IS-2 (Late) potentially regaining it's DShK as well? According to a post I found in the forums it was removed for historical accuracy reasons as it was supposedly a post war addition, but then @akd found evidence that DShKs were indeed installed on not only IS-2s but a bunch of SPGs like ISUs too. So it seems like the original reasons for removal of the IS-2(Late) with 12.7mm HMG was flawed and that they were in fact used in WW2.
 

There is photographic evidence of an IS-2 with a mounted DShK, and a link to an order 'State Committee of Defense Decree #6723s" which mandated factories install 12.7mm DShKs on SPGs and IS tanks from late 1944 onwards. I don't expect new DShK equipped variants of SPGs to be included in a patch (probably more suited for a vehicle pack as it'll be a new variant of ISU), but perhaps the IS-2(Late) could be re-added to the game along with the DShK? After all, it was once in the game and is still included in the manual for Red Thunder as an option and so isn't really "new content".