Withdraw order doesn't work on the first floor of the building,

[chuckdyke]

The Evade is more useful in a RTS scenario if you can play RTS by PBEM? With this I am in the dark as our H&H battles are on Hotseat. I found Evade in buildings the units move automatically to the ground floor. Depending on the Combat stress they also flee to the nearest cover. How they write the code we can only guess.

[Vacillator]

18 minutes ago, chuckdyke said:

if you can play RTS by PBEM

You can't, that wouldn't be sensible.  So the above advice (excluding Chibot's) does not apply to PBEM as far as I can see.

Edited March 16, 2023 by Vacillator

[Chibot Mk IX]

On 3/16/2023 at 5:16 PM, Vacillator said:

Thanks for taking the time to post great info my friend. 

I suppose my question boils down not to why I would use Pause (in the orders phase), but how I can use it in the middle of a PBEM turn as suggested earlier in this thread (and actioned via the button Chuckdyke highlighted).  I don't think I can do the latter in a PBEM as it's a pre-ordered feast?

Hi Vacillator

I think we have a little confusion here.  All the screenshots are taken during the PBEM order phase, these commands will have impacts (sometime a huge impact) on the next PBEM turn's combat result. Just like the regular move/fast/target orders, you need to make a plan first then input these orders during the ordering phase then hope for the best result comes out in the next turn.

For example, the sceenshots in first post feature Volkssturm troops. In the pervious turn,  I used hide+target arc command to successfully build an ambush zone for the soviets. Cut down at least 10 soviets infantry in less than 20s. But I saw my opponent had two more squads + 2 HMG return fire at the end of the turn. I need to move out. I don't want to get the troops pinned down, then either be picked up by sharpshooter one by one, or eliminated by a T-34/85 HE round. So I issued a withdraw order. 

I hope in the next turn, in an ideal situation, the Volkssturm troops will getup and run out of the building ASAP.

 

Same as the BMP-3 area fire screenshot. I issued the orders. I hope during the next turn's replay, I can watch the BMP-3 turn the turret into the correct position, move to the fire position, pause for 5-10s, finish aim process (likely to take 3-4s) fire one air burst HE round,  then move back to safety before Javelin finish the lock (usually take 15s). After watching the next turn's replay , I was glad to find out it works. I eliminated the Javelin ATGM team while the other hidden US Javelin ATGM teams failed to interrupt the BMP-3's action.

Of course, let's assume my opponent had a M1A2 hidden in the wood then the plan would failed miserably. in that case, the M1A2 detect the target while my BMP-3 were on the way to the fire position.  Then my BMP-3 stay in the fire position (pause for 5 s), in the meantime M1A2 fired one APFSDS, smashed into the BMP-3's hull caused an ammo cook off. That is the end of the story. Fortunately, that didn't happen in my PBEM game. 

Sometime this is a risk you have to put into the consideration. 

 

 

 

[chuckdyke]

Withdraw. Evade works IMHO Rattled units at times disobey orders. This is not a bug as first stated. The idea of conversations and dialog is to reach consensus.

[Vacillator]

1 hour ago, Chibot Mk IX said:

I think we have a little confusion here.

And if that's my fault, apologies.  I read some of the earlier posts as being about non-PBEM (non-WEGO) game play but with comments about how it 'might' apply to PBEM.

And as a mostly PBEM player I couldn't see how it applied to PBEM.

[Brille]

On 3/16/2023 at 7:49 PM, Chibot Mk IX said:

OK, it looks like the "withdraw" button (or evade, or whatever that button called) is not equal to "fast". 

run the test # 2 a few more times. withdraw command can ensure the pinned down squad get up and running down stairs in the same tun. A "fast" does not generate a guaranteed retreat. They will be kept at pinned down status on the upper floor for 1-2 more turns with "fast" command.

 

 

Now that I got the time to test it too I must say you are right: The evade button functions much like the same as the "withdraw" button in the older games.

I remember that I´ve tested it at the beginning of my CM career and there it seemed not to work as intended for whatever reason. So I didn´t bother with it anymore and thought it was a short cut for the Real-Time players, especially because it isn´t an obvious command in the command panel, like everything else...

 

But yeah I made a simple test: 2 Platoons of german grenadiers get area fire from american MMG in bunkers. After a full minute they are all pinned for good.

Now I gave one platoon the fast order to another location and the other platoon I gave the "evade" button, while they are all still under fire.

 

The first platoon (with the fast command) didn´t move an inch, occasionally (I did more of the same test) one soldier will try it´s luck and ran but in general they were fixed to the position.

The second platoon (with the evade-command) will try to get up and sprint to the destined position. Some may lay on the ground for a while, while others get up sooner and run but at the end of the turn all the soldiers are transfered to the safe location.

 

Most of my tests I did on open ground with a wall as cover for the soldiers. I also did some tests in houses and witnessed that the withdraw order don´t always work even when they are in the upper floors.

 

So I can confirm that the evade command isn´t the same as the fast command and that the evade command is somewhat buggy in buildings. Another difference is that you will hear special audio if you press the withdraw button: The soldiers will yell "Retreat!" or something like that.

I would be glad if battlefront would attend to the problem in the next patch or so, since it is a very powerful tool.

 

Thank you for the revelation, @Chibot Mk IX !

 

 

Edited March 21, 2023 by Brille

[Bulletpoint]

Did you try to just give a "quick" move order away from the threat?