howardb Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 Personally I don't think it's too much to ask for a date BTS think they will release on. Like "we think we're done by xxxx but we can't promise anything". If they can't hold that release date simply say "we encountered a couple of problems and the new date will probably be xxxx". Or a weekly designer diary (which many other developers do to the fans) where they could say what they're currently working on or what's left. That kind of an update would take 10 minutes every week nothing more (I bet I'll get a person stating it would take much longer but it wouldn't). I'm just waiting for Diablo II myself but I would sure like to know when CM is here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcelt Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 My problem with the major argument here is that you can never "get a game right" .Its like believing that,given enough time you can achieve perfection.Theres no such condition No matter how brilliant a game is(and this one certainly is),it can always be improved and enhanced.The developers could go on enhancing it until 3000 and beyond.It seems to me you just have to say we'll improve and enhance until a particular time. Improvements then cease and game is delivered. I must also remind you ,as the recent age survey illustrated ,for many of us ,time like size, is important.We really want this game while we can still see a faintly flickering screen and can weakly tap a mouse button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest L Tankersley Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 Fionn asked: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>What's NLT and is 30/4 the 30th of the 4th month?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> NLT == "No Later Than" Really, people, chill out. Obviously BTS wants to release the game as soon as possible. But they don't want to release it before it is ready. And having people breathe down your neck is annoying. It is notoriously difficult to estimate how long software will take to develop and finish. "When it is done" is a legitimate answer because anything else is just guesswork. If you can't understand or accept that, you really need to calm down some. Take a break from the board for a few days or something. This isn't intended as an attack or an insult, just a bit of friendly advice from someone that has been through the software development process many times before from the perspective of the developer and of the customer. There's a heuristic I came up with many years ago while waiting for a hotly-anticipated game: when given a release date, double the amount of time between now and the release date and add three months to get the actual release date. This heuristic was startlingly accurate. Be grateful BTS hasn't given out release dates to us for Combat Mission. Leland J. Tankersley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamo Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 I don't know what all the fuss is about, I got my release copy the other day and have been having a great time smashing Stuarts with my Jagtigers...You guys haven't got yours yet? Yeah, mine was delivered by the same little blue man who tells me to start all the fires and kill my family and dress up like Cher and..hehehehe I need my medication...hehehe CM withdrawels are getting bad again.....MOTHER! Stop stretching the cat! hmmm, (twitch, twitch) Zamo From the padded cell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulR Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 One does not have to know the specifics to know the specifics. Steve and Charles are walking a fine line between their desire for income (sales) and their commitment to quality, which relates to pride, reputation and yes, ultimately, more sales down the road as their company aquires something even more impoatant than a good product, namely a great reputation for good products. I give them a lot of credit for having the stones to make sure this product right (by their definition) and to not introduce a date that could, by their own doing, introduce pressure on themselves to make bad business and creative decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bauhaus Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goanna: PS: Mike is full of crap. Gold demo 31/1. Game sent to Goanna by Steve personally 14/2. First whipping of Fionn NLT 30/4. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Just wondering, will Steve send the game to you complete with flowers and chocolates, or will he just take you out to dinner and then give you the big one......game that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zulu Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 I think a few people should back off and reevaluate their posts. Do we really want another flame war erupting here? As far as I could tell this is an open forum. Asking people not to reply unless they have the answer that you want to here is very rude IMHO, plus very limiting. A one way discussion will be very boring. Steve and Charles have made it abundantly clear that the game will be released when it is ready. This is fine with me and I think with the majority of the people here. Fionn gave a firm release date and I can live with that, though I hope its a little sooner. If CM were released as it stands now in the demo form that most of us have, throw in 30 or so scenarios, you would still have a game that if head and shoulders above anything else available in the wargaming genre. Ask yourself how much enjoyment that you have gotten from a FREE! demo. Have you tried CC4 yet? I have, and the CM demo blows CC4 away. When CM is released in final form, it's going to be a rare kind of game, ie. great and virtually bug free, plus containing actual enhancements suggested by this forum (where else has this happened?). Its going to be on my hd for a long long time. So, have patience and like the winemaker said,"someting, something, not before it's time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 Fionn vs Goanna! Fionn vs Goanna!! Fight! Fight! DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goanna Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 Sorry for the delay in my reply as my beauty rest was required. First off, thanks for taking care of my light work Leyland. NLT is indeed "no later than", and the date was as you thought, Fionn, 30 April. Don't tell me you Irish folks have adopted the way those yanks provide dates ahve you? Now, down to the real point of this thread. I think what some of the folks here are after is some of the real servitude we have purchased from Steve old boy by sending him our, what was it $45? Personally, I am considering requiring Charles and him to hop on a plane at the end of the week and flying to see me to explain the delay in person. I mean hell, I am his CUSTOMER aren't I? And of course he wouldn't want to disappoint the .0000001% market share that I and the rest of the Australians will represent. So hey, lets not worry about the brewing flame war on the board. The only people who need to take a break from reading the board are the folks at BTS. Just have someone they delegate weed through the wingeing to find any salient items that might be posted and lets get out the chees and have a real whinefest. Good Day. PS: Steve/Charles is coach OK for the tickets I'm posting, because I had to fly a guy from Microsludge out here last week to sort him out and I'm a bit short on dosh in the expense account? ------------------ desert rat wannabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goanna Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 Oops, forgot Mr. Bauhaus. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Just wondering, will Steve send the game to you complete with flowers and chocolates, or will he just take you out to dinner and then give you the big one......game that is.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I thought a nice light dinner of Thai takeaway and then straight to a heated battle on my office LAN would do the trick while Charles sorts out some problems I am having on some pesky C++ code I have here. Then we'll switch off when we run out of piss or have to go shake hands with the governor. Speaking of big ones, whats that I am ramming home to you in our game. You know, leaving me with all three StuGs was probably less than totally smart for a game plan on turn 4 since you seem to be all out of cans. ------------------ desert rat wannabe [This message has been edited by Goanna (edited 01-17-2000).] [This message has been edited by Goanna (edited 01-17-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bauhaus Posted January 17, 2000 Share Posted January 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goanna: Oops, forgot Mr. Bauhaus. I thought a nice light dinner of Thai takeaway and then straight to a heated battle on my office LAN would do the trick while Charles sorts out some problems I am having on some pesky C++ code I have here. Then we'll switch off when we run out of piss or have to go shake hands with the governor. Speaking of big ones, whats that I am ramming home to you in our game. You know, leaving me with all three StuGs was probably less than totally smart for a game plan on turn 4 since you seem to be all out of cans. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> ok, I'll admit it, I suck......big time. But look in the woods, me thinks we have a blood bath on our hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bauhaus Posted January 18, 2000 Share Posted January 18, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goanna: Oops, forgot Mr. Bauhaus. I thought a nice light dinner of Thai takeaway and then straight to a heated battle on my office LAN would do the trick while Charles sorts out some problems I am having on some pesky C++ code I have here. Then we'll switch off when we run out of piss or have to go shake hands with the governor. Speaking of big ones, whats that I am ramming home to you in our game. You know, leaving me with all three StuGs was probably less than totally smart for a game plan on turn 4 since you seem to be all out of cans. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> ok, I'll admit it, I suck......big time. But look in the woods, me thinks we have a blood bath on our hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted January 18, 2000 Share Posted January 18, 2000 Goanna, nah we haven't adopted the Devil's way.. umm I mean American way.. of reckoning dates but having an American wife means I gotta learn all the weird and wacky ways Americans spell and do things . She's from Texas and even my grasp of proper English is slipping as her insidious presence corrupts And no, she doesn't check the board. I may be brave but I'm NOT foolish enough to post this if she could see it Wargamers, the only thing we are TRULY afraid of is our wives . ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted January 18, 2000 Share Posted January 18, 2000 Fionn: From Texas! What were you thinking?? My wife lived many years in Texas, also, so I feel your pain... As for a maximum release date, I don't feel that it is all that important. I gave BTS my preorder back in June or something, so I trust them to release CM when it is ready to be released. I am sure you can all find time to bone up on your tactics while waiting for the game to be released...I know I am! I am more of a strategically minded person, myself, and have much to learn... Hmm...kind of a long post - I better make sure I'm not spotted, I don't know what they do to lurkers here Down periscope! ALARM!!! ------------------ Inferi nihil timent, non habent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berlichtingen Posted January 18, 2000 Share Posted January 18, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Wargamers, the only thing we are TRULY afraid of is our wives<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Amen to that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeydz Posted January 19, 2000 Share Posted January 19, 2000 You got yourself a Texas Gal Fionn?? I guess you decided to not mess around with the lesser gals and go straight to the best of the bunch. (Born and raised a Texan! Yaa-Hoo!) MikeyD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted January 19, 2000 Share Posted January 19, 2000 Fionn, does she warsh the car? DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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