Forever Babra

Oh, Lord -- The Semples! Okay, but only If there's a texture to show the mattress the driver lays on... But my vote goes for OP Tanks/PzBefehlswagen in all or any configurations. Raupenschlepper Ost. Because it's the coolest machine that was ever built anywhere in the world at any time. [This message has been edited by Forever Babra (edited 02-07-2001).]

While sitting here feeling all smug and satisfied that I've gleaned enough info to "do it right" I had the most horrible thought: What if the red background over white bar described in the Bouchery book is from 1945 when the 144th was divisioned? That would certainly revive the blue over brown theory for an independent unit in July 44. I'm going to lay down now. I have a headache...

D-Day to Berlin lists the following arm of service colours for the background: HQ (Including medical, MP, Postal and Intelligence units) - Black RASC - red over green, diagonally, top right to bottom left Signals - White over blue Engineers - Light Blue REME - blue/yellow/red RAOC - blue/red/blue - divided vertically RA - red over blue. Recce - green over blue Sr. Armoured Bde of Div and Sr. Inf. Bde of Div - Red Jr. Armoured Bde of Div and 2nd Inf. Bde of Div - Green Jr. Inf Bde of Div - Brown. Nowhere are independent brigades listed Mr. Wise mentions that placement of the unit serial number, arm of service colour, and brigade sign, varied widely, so it's not too surprising they appear reversed.

The pic in the book is a little clearer than the scan. When I scan from low quality paper I get those grainy diagonal lines, which is a pain. The brigade insignia is just barely visible in between the sledge head and the retaining strap, under the hammer handle. Definitely a 33rd Bde vehicle, although without knowing what I was looking for, I would never have seen it. The box is a first aid kit, standard on Brit Shermans -- the 174 is more visible than it is in the scan, but as doodlebug says, the lower portion of the numbers is slightly obscured, probably because the box is not large enough to accomodate the full size unit serial. I believe the white bar is located below the first aid kit, on the hull itself. . [This message has been edited by Forever Babra (edited 02-07-2001).]

Doodlebug, thank you so much! Okay, so now I know the tanks in the picture (the subject of my model) are from B Sqdn. The pic in "D-Day to Berlin" is the same one you describe. Is yours of any better quality? It appears there "might" be a bar under the 174, but the pic is so grainy and the dust so thick, it's really hard to tell. For those interested, a 1024x768 scan of the pic can be seen at http://www.geocities.com/babrakhan2001/144rac.jpg [This message has been edited by Forever Babra (edited 02-06-2001).]

Thanks to Rob Casey who dropped me an email with the info gleaned from "From D-Day to VE Day, The British Soldier" Volume II (Jean Bouchery / Histoire & Collections), that the unit number would be on a red background over a white bar.

It's very difficult to tell from the pic if the background to the unit serial number is two-tone or not. There's a heavy coat of road dust on the vehicles in the column. The British system conforms to the Canadian (or vice versa) of three digits for independent units, two digits for "divisioned" units. Since the unit serial number of the Three Rivers was blue over brown, and also 174, I'm inclined to believe the colours would not be the same for the 144th RAC. Still, one never knows...

I feel your pain Anyway, the info I still need is: 1) <s>The colour of of the background on the tac marking.</s> 2) <s>The brigade insignia (if any)</s> 3) Any other unusual features of this regiment. EDIT: Aha! Okay, now I've got the Brigade insignia. Not terribly dramatic but at least it will be easy to paint! [This message has been edited by Forever Babra (edited 02-06-2001).]

I figured you'd be lurking... Okay, that's one step up. I thought as part of an independent brigade the sqdn insig would be white. I didn't realize they carried the seniority system. That would make it yellow. Anyone else got any more info or pics? And since one good turn deserves another, you might find the name of that bagpipe tune somewhere among the thousands of midis at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Corridor/7562/MUSIC.htm I know I've heard it before, but damned if I ever knew the name of it. EDIT: Commander: Brigadier HB Scott Units 13/6/44 to 13/8/44: Headquarters (172) 1st Northamptonshire Yeomanry (173) 144th RAC (174) 148th RAC (175) Units 16/8/44 to 18/1/45 Headquarters (151) 1st Northamptonshire Yeomanry (152) East Riding Yeomanry (153) 144th RAC (154) Battles: 4-18/7/44 Caen. The unit was transferred to 79th AD in January 45. No doubt your listing is from after that point. [This message has been edited by Forever Babra (edited 02-06-2001).]

I need some assistance with tactical markings for the 144th Regiment RAC, for a modelling project. I know the Regiment carried a tactical number "174", but I have no other info. There is a pic of a platoon rolling toward Caen on page 64 of "D-Day to Berlin" (incorrectly identified as the 12th Cdn. Armoured Reg't, The Three Rivers Reg't, which also carried 174 as a tac number), which shows large white call-sign numbers on the turret sides and rear, but I can find no other info or photos of the unit. Since the unit belonged to an independent tank brigade (33rd), I'm fairly certain the squadron insignia (not visible in the pic) would be white. After that, I'm in the wilderness. Does anyone have any info/pics on or of this regiment? I know there are some good books in print on the subject, but I'm a little unwilling (read: unable) to shell out at the moment. Any help would be appreciated.

Yeah, and NASCAR drivers make four left turns, not four right ones... I still laughed though, escpecially when... naw, I won't spoil it. ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

Just a note: Multiple waypoints for groups, which usually means a long march, are a bad idea anyway. You increase the risk of your men being opened up on and them not responding effectively while they try and decide whether they should return fire, run for cover or complete their movement order. You will get better success using short marches. You can plot another short march for the group when they halt. Fatigue will be lower too.

Four troops per tank, eh? ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

Heck with it. Lock it up. ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite [This message has been edited by Forever Babra (edited 02-03-2001).]

I checked out the 1/6 Stuart from 21st Century Toys down at the local Toys R Us. BIG! But it was $300 (still a hundred less than the PA offerings) and out of my range. I picked up the 1/18 Sherman instead. For a "toy" it has amazing accuracy. It's accurate enough that I could definitely ID it as a 1943 production M4. It will take some long hours of kit bashing to bring it up to spec, but most of that will be finishing work, not detail work. ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

I had the same experience Hussar. It means we suck, you and me ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

Like Cybeq, I keep them in reserve, hidden, then bring them out only through known safe routes when they're needed. They can unhinge large sections of an enemy's defensive line when they open fire. In defensive scenarios, I'll use them for a late-game counterattack. ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

Och, it's a bonnie day, and ah've driven the Ford Tempo in both wet and dry weather conditions... The Borg, the borg, the CM Borg... ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

Arrrgh.... Just like my beloved motherland, this thread has been spoiled by "tourists" Matt, shut 'er down, lock 'er up, and hang up the "Gone Fishin'" sign. If the cesspool concept is to continue, perhaps it should be in a thread started by BTS, labelled "Cesspool", with the purpose and acceptable limits stated clearly in point form in the very first message. ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

If you don't like the mod, don't use the mod. Mods are funny that way. ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

You sure about the placement of that pic, slappy? ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

They are sweet, aren't they? ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

For an excellent debunking of the "coward" myth, there is a very good essay in the anthalogy "Time to Kill", which analyzes the Italian army at various points in the war. Definitely worth a read. Don't know about your numbers, Rex. It's all Greek to me -- I'll just have to take your word for it ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite

Hmm... I see the topic keep shifting from tactical to operational to strategic. Operationally (and strategically), the entire Belgian campaign of 1815 is a classic case study of Maneuver warfare at work. Bounce the enemy in a surprise march, defeat one, change fronts, defeat the other, split them, force them back on their (different) bases of supply. Defeat them in detail. Take the capital. Watch the wavering satellite nations flock to join the camp. That it did not succeed for the French does not make it less valid; it simply illustrates that the enemy were adept at modifying their own operations to meet the exigencies of the moment. Wellington and his British regs had a solid reputation by that point in the wars, but the bulk of the Anglo-Allied army were non-British conscripts of questionable quality, and even more questionable loyalty. It wasn't the idea of a frontal attack that was flawed, it was the execution (and a bit of intervention in the form of luck good or bad).

Lorak. While I await Herr Oberst's fifth file, please note that Mace and I have finished a 40 turn assault (I won, of course) which was started AFTER H.O. That's Babs - Win Mace - Loss Ho - Slow! ------------------ When it's my turn to march up to Glory, I'm gonna have one HELL of a story...