noob Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 In a game im playing i have a HQ unit that has set up two off map mortars to do an area fire mission with a 10 min delay. During the countdown the HQ unit was panicked by an artillery blast near the building it was in but it has recovered now, however i cannot access my artillery orders, it says denied and busy in the mortar picture box, when i try accessing it through another HQ unit it shows me a go to spotter button which takes me back to the spotting HQ unit but still with no access to adjust or cease the barrage. I'm assuming something has screwed up because the spotting unit went through a drastic morale swing, has anybody else experienced this ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarRat Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 If your radioman or spotter gets killed you're done even if the rest of the HQ is ok. I'd check your HQ again and make sure no one got killed or wounded. I'm not sure but it might be possible for a radio to get lost or destroyed too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 If your radioman or spotter gets killed you're done even if the rest of the HQ is ok. I'd check your HQ again and make sure no one got killed or wounded. I'm not sure but it might be possible for a radio to get lost or destroyed too. One of the guys in the HQ unit is dead so i guess it is a bug as i have a Battalion Commander that should be able to override his subordinates orders i would of thought. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 I think this is one of those bad things that just happens if you have an important unit get whacked. Realistically unless the unit that called the strike is in C2 why would superiors consider adjusting a mission. Was it a preplanned strike in the setup phase? If it was you should really consider keeping these units somewhere safe until the arty is done. If it wasn't what happened when the spotting rounds fell? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 Realistically unless the unit that called the strike is in C2 why would superiors consider adjusting a mission. So you are saying that if a spotter calls a mission and then gets killed the mission becomes locked to the corpse even if a superior officer decides to cancel it ? sounds like a bug to me. Was it a preplanned strike in the setup phase? If it was you should really consider keeping these units somewhere safe until the arty is done. A mission can be called from a safe rear area with long LOS anytime during the battle so to assume that the spotter was in a dangerous position is erroneous and your tone is also a touch patronising. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackcat Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 If a spotting unit loses communication for an extended period with the artillery during a fire mission, but before FFE, the mission will probably be cancelled automatically (page 105 of the manual). As for a higher unit cancelling the mission, if the spotting unit has lost its comms links how would they know? So not a bug, just the game working as intended. P.S. Does your damaged spotting unit still have a radio? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 I am sure another officer might be able to cancel the order but presume without a radio you are going to need to be in speaking range of an officer who does have a working radio. So in a lot of circumstances that presumably does not allow enough time for that to occur. Therefore perhaps BF dropped it as an important must do coding. I am guessing. : ) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 So you are saying that if a spotter calls a mission and then gets killed the mission becomes locked to the corpse even if a superior officer decides to cancel it ? sounds like a bug to me. A mission can be called from a safe rear area with long LOS anytime during the battle so to assume that the spotter was in a dangerous position is erroneous and your tone is also a touch patronising. The game doesn't model every situation perfectly. It is hard to tell what would be the most reasonable thing to occur all the time. If a platoon leader called in a strike and then dropped out of C2 with the arty unit totally then the mission as posted above should get canned at the spotting stage. If it is preplanned barrage and a unit drops out of communication with the arty unit why shouldn't it go ahead? I guess in real life if a unit drops out of C2 and a superior unit is in close C2 to the unit that had the problem it could possibly have taken charge but this doesn't happen. Right now this means that spotters and their equipment have to stay safe. Your unit did take damage. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 If a spotting unit loses communication for an extended period with the artillery during a fire mission, but before FFE, the mission will probably be cancelled automatically (page 105 of the manual). As for a higher unit cancelling the mission, if the spotting unit has lost its comms links how would they know? So not a bug, just the game working as intended. P.S. Does your damaged spotting unit still have a radio? Thanks for directing me to the manual, if its in the book its in the game, my knowledge of the realities of artillery spotting are non existant so as long as i know its meant to happen im ok with that, however there wasnt much i could do as my spotter was in a safe place and just got unlucky by being in a building next to a couple of tanks my opponent targetted with some heavy artillery, i guess the lesson there is to keep your spotter away from potential targets. My spotter still has a radio and im happy with the mission to carry on, i was just a bit suprised and frustrated that i couldnt access it just in case i did want to adjust it if it fell short. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 The game doesn't model every situation perfectly. It is hard to tell what would be the most reasonable thing to occur all the time. If a platoon leader called in a strike and then dropped out of C2 with the arty unit totally then the mission as posted above should get canned at the spotting stage. If it is preplanned barrage and a unit drops out of communication with the arty unit why shouldn't it go ahead? I guess in real life if a unit drops out of C2 and a superior unit is in close C2 to the unit that had the problem it could possibly have taken charge but this doesn't happen. Right now this means that spotters and their equipment have to stay safe. Your unit did take damage. Well having no knowledge of the realities of artillery missions i will defer to the manual, i'm just relieved it's not a bug, at least now i can take steps to avoid the situation happening again. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackcat Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 "if its in the book its in the game" Well, it probably is. One last thought on HQ units getting thumped. A couple of days ago I had a platoon HQ take a casualty, it was the radio operator. Straightway the radio disappeared from the unit card and the HQ lost comms to the company HQ and the artillery. A couple of turns later that radio was back and so were the comms. I assume that game simulated the 21c picking up a still functioning radio, which was nice. I also assume that radios don't always survive their operator becoming a casualty, but I don't know this for sure. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Well having no knowledge of the realities of artillery missions i will defer to the manual, i'm just relieved it's not a bug, at least now i can take steps to avoid the situation happening again. Not really on option if you play WEGO but if you play realtime the safest thing to do is have your unit actually hidden. Don't have any unit near the spotter move or fire (probably best if they are hidden too). When the spotting rounds are about to fire unhide your unit and give it a short covered arc. This is best way to go about spotting arty if you can't avoid being close to the enemy. There is no protection from random spotting rounds and dumb luck but hidden units as they are prone need the event to happen much closer than a unit that is in the normal spotting state. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdogg Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 There are lots of frustrating moments with Arty, but this is realistic. Every tactical account of warefare i have ever read had some kind of snafu with calling in arty at some point....fog of war. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker765 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 When the spotting rounds are about to fire unhide your unit and give it a short covered arc. How can you tell when this is going to happen? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 How can you tell when this is going to happen? When you set up a mission, it tells you how long til delivery. About a minute before that time expires (I've never seen it say "Delivery: 1m") the status of the battery you're calling will switch to 'spotting' (from 'preparing' or 'receiving', I think). From that point, Spotting rounds will start falling and your spotter needs to be able to see 'em, so 'unhide' the team. It's easiest to keep track of in WeGo, I'd imagine, since you have plenty of time to keep track of the countdown. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 How can you tell when this is going to happen? As above. Doing it this way is a hassle but I have come across situations (close drops in hedgerows) where it is about the only way you can get it done. Often a HQ unit staring at a hedgerow 80m distant will get spotted and shot up well within the 3-6 minutes that most arty comes in. Whenever arty is happening the arty icon flashes and you simply need to keep an eye out for it. The piece doing the firing should report as "spotting". You need to unhide for this portion (although it is still possible to spot the rounds hidden your chances are diminishing to zero) and once it changes to firing you can hide or move. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holien Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 Is this bug being addressed? For me it is a bug and not a feature if you are seriously saying that if the unit who called the mission in dies / loses it radio etc.... then you lose the ability to call that battery for the rest of the game? What is Probably cancelled? This is rubbish if you are on the radio to someone and have to maintain contact via continuous comms it is soon bloodly obvious to the other end when Dave or Hans stops talking and you can not get a response. So the game should do one of the following either allow a couple of minutes to pass. Happy to accept that you don't get it straight away but 2 - 3 mins should be enough. Or allow a superior unit to cancel the call. I.e. Company HQ / or Specific Arty OP. Often on the battlefield they will know the unit has been taken down and they should be able to countermand the hanging call. The phrase Probably does not express hope... IMO I would strongly suggest this needs looking at if it does not do the above. Especially as now the game has far more importance for Arty than the old CM... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredrock1957 Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 I had the same thing happen to me as the OP stated, mine occured while spotting, I got the denied and it looked like the battery was locked out... I even told my opponent as it occured after we both patched... Continuing the game about 7 minutes later the Arty showed up as FFE and off by about 50 meters... Now the battery is available again... The question would be did the OP play out the game?? To me I concluded that the HQ provided some information to the battery and after being shot up till there was one soldier in the HQ without a radio, that the battery waited, for more info, and then decided to let loose based upon its last report from the HQ. At first I thought it was a bug, but it does seem sensible to me... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holien Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 To me I concluded that the HQ provided some information to the battery and after being shot up till there was one soldier in the HQ without a radio, that the battery waited, for more info, and then decided to let loose based upon its last report from the HQ. At first I thought it was a bug, but it does seem sensible to me... I would want more clarification from Battlefront on just what the SOP is for the game. If a higher HQ in the game is really doing that and spotting for the dead OP then I am happy. But if that is not happening really happening in the game engine then it is very dodgy. IRL if the battery lost contact with the OP I don't think they would go, ohh well no info lets just drop some shells... (I could say maybe some nationalities might??) Anyway I would expect IRL a battery that loses contact with an OP would take requests from anyone else that needed it, rather than just waiting for the OP to come back on line. Any Arty buffs IRL out there that could comment on RL SOP? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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