Aleppo International Airport - Part One Post here

[ChrisND]

If you have a copy of my scenario for aleppo, you can either post here with your thoughts or email normaldude77@gmail.com. Your last scenario turn is also always appreciated.

I am currently working on v 1.01, after which I will put the scenario up for file share:

Changes:

- Re-did the hangers to look more like military hangers, adopted from Kieme's scenario.

- Re-did the AI plans, AI was not moving it's troops efficiently to their defensive points (They would either do the crawl of death or would sit on their asses for two minutes at each waypoint). SPOILER: Now dependin on the AI plan selected, the troops will automatically set up in the desired defensive points instead of moving to them.

- Added flavor objects, but generally only to areas that matter in the scenario. For example you won't be seeing many in the residential district where very little of anything occurs.

- Gave Syrian troops slightly better morale and more ammo.

- Improved briefings.

[SgtMuhammed]

Just a quick rant. You can catch my rant in the "What the patch didn't fix" thread.

The map is nice. Is there any way to put some vehicles or something on it to represent the airport equipment from the briefing. I have barely started playing with the editor so I'm not sure if this is possible.

Force balance seems to be ok but problems with the TACAI put the Americans at a major dissadvantage, especially since they are required to use CQB against the terminal. The lack of smoke is supposed to be made up for by the superior American NODs but there seems to be little actual difference.

This may be a bug but it seemed that the Syrian units were able to engage at whatever range the Americans were.

I am rapidly reaching the conclusion that it will be impossible to make good infantry heavy scenarios until the TACAI is fixed.

This one definitely has potential but I believe that the game itself is holding it back.

[ChrisND]

I really, really want to include vehicles on the runway but the game mechanics hold it back at the moment.

The observation range for night time conditions is definetly too far for my tastes, but I don't know of a way to fix this. i agree that American NODs tech doesnt seem to make any difference.

[Kieme(ITA)]

Normal Dude, I'm starting now to play your scenario.

If you want to add some sort of civilian vehicles you could do like I did for those few I added to my scenario: pick some unconventinal transport units and set them as "destroyed", then place them where you want with deploy red command and there you go: you got some vehicles which actually will look OK but won't get any difference in the playtime.

[ August 11, 2007, 02:28 AM: Message edited by: Kieme(ITA) ]

[ChrisND]

Originally posted by Kieme(ITA):

Normal Dude, I'm starting not to play your scenario.

If you want to add some sort of civilian vehicles you could do like I did for those few I added to my scenario: pick some unconventinal transport units and set them as "destroyed", then place them where you want with deploy red command and there you go: you got some vehicles which actually will look OK but won't get any difference in the playtime.

That is an idea.

[Kieme(ITA)]

Ok I've played Aleppo International Airport!

First of all I liked the map. The difference between residential/commercial/industrial building zones are evident and quite interesting:

The residential area is full of small houses all placed nearby the other, so you get a convincing mid east confusion style... quite nice!

The industrial area is made of larger buildings, I liked them because the actual game doesn't represent specifically industrial buildings so that we few we happey few scenario designer have to work with what's there. Taking out windows and buildign larger buildings seems to be the way for now (maybe some more textures or different windows styles could help a lot)!

The best building effort in the map is for sure the terminal, I'm sure it took its time to be made but it worth it! Really nice!

The map is interesting because it represent open spaces with wide line of fires and contraint spaces (residential area) with close hand to hand combat.

I'd like to see more units in that area in order to be able to try some better tactics with the house cleaning...

Finally I liked the general scenario although I'm a fan of smaller (in terms of time only) scenarios maybe with more vehicles at disposal.

I will look forward for next versions!

My compliments for this one.

[ChrisND]

Originally posted by Kieme(ITA):

I'd like to see more units in that area in order to be able to try some better tactics with the house cleaning...

I have wanted this too. 1.01 will feature the AI having a variable depth of defense: it could keep units close to the terminal, or they could be more spread out along the industrial sector.

Thanks for your thoughts! What was the end result and selected difficulty level? Any comments on balance vs the AI?

[Kieme(ITA)]

Well, the balance was Ok and I liked the particular unit selection with both forces.

I didn't scored more than a draw anyway I'm not so used with infantry tactics.

My 2 cents the balance was good, even though I'm not an expert on the infantry side of the matter

[KNac]

Waiting for 1.01

[blow56]

How do I get this scenario?

[ChrisND]

1.01 will be ready later today. I will then post a link for it here.

[ChrisND]

http://www.mediafire.com/?fjodxbajgnd

There ya go!

[Law&Order]

I really like this one, one of the best scenarios for CMSF at the moment. I only played 1.01 and it was a blast. Nice setup and I liked the house cleaning. Snipers were very much appreciated! Though opposition for me at the industrial area, had to call the f15 for remodelling... Only minor flaw for me was that I only got 1 shot of arty, which I wasted on something too easy in hindsight.

End result was a minor defeat for US, as 4 para squads were wasted by 2 engineer (!) squads in the terminal, and I failed to clean out some remaing 1 or 2 man enemies. Overal, really enjoyable, and ran actually quite good for such a large map. Thanks for the fun!

[ChrisND]

Thanks Law&Order,

Yes, there is not much 81mm ammo, and for reason. It is an airborne drop after all. But there should be enough ammo for two full fire missions provided you use medium or below. I wanted to include the company 224s as well, but can't seem to ge them in.

Would I be able to see your last saved turn?

Chris

[SgtMuhammed]

Just played the new version through. It ran better this time. I don't know if it was something you did to the map or if it was the patch but everything was smooth as silk.

I had a crash in the middle of one runthrough so I ran it twice and the AI defended different each time. Had some pretty tense moments dealing with the enemy vehicles.

The fight in the terminal was epic. Lots of guys running around shooting through the ceilings and floors. Pretty neat.

I called in an airstrike on a strongpoint and ended up putting a crater about 50 meters across in the map. I didn't know that could happen. I was so shocked I almost forgot to order my attack.

You might consider making the fighers in the outlying areas move about taking pot shots at the Americans. As it is there is really little chance that they can take out the American command groups. I think it would also work if you put more low level fighters scattered about to simulate local security and police.

I am going to play again to try and see the other plan. I didn't get to see it completely before the game crashed (which was a first for me). You may already have it in but I think a counter attack by a QRF platoon would be a nice possible event.

I scored a total victory losing 13 guys total while inflicting 200 casualties and killing all the vehicles, one with the .50 sniper.

One nice difference from the first run through was that my snipers actually fired. Again I have no idea what may have made the difference.

[jomni]

where's the download link?

[ChrisND]

Jomni, itus posted above about five posts up, theres a link for media fire.

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

Just played the new version through. It ran better this time. I don't know if it was something you did to the map or if it was the patch but everything was smooth as silk.

Well, it must be the patch, because I added more to the map, especially flavors. Good news!

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

The fight in the terminal was epic. Lots of guys running around shooting through the ceilings and floors. Pretty neat.

Good to hear, this is what I was aiming for.

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

I called in an airstrike on a strongpoint and ended up putting a crater about 50 meters across in the map. I didn't know that could happen. I was so shocked I almost forgot to order my attack.

Yeah I have been surprised as well. Twice now I have had my own fire dropped straight on my troops. There's a reason they call 600 meters danger close! :eek:

One thing that is bugging me is that the JTAC team does not come with any comms. They seem to be dependant on their strykers, which have of course been omitted. In my testing I usually ended up using the company CO to call in the air support. It would be nice if the scenario designer could determine the comm equipment available.

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

You might consider making the fighers in the outlying areas move about taking pot shots at the Americans. As it is there is really little chance that they can take out the American command groups. I think it would also work if you put more low level fighters scattered about to simulate local security and police.

I am glad you noticed this, for having the fighters sort of roving around harrassing was my intention. I have the plans for them to randomly run around entered in, so I am not sure why they aren't doing this. Thanks for the heads up.

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

I am going to play again to try and see the other plan. I didn't get to see it completely before the game crashed (which was a first for me). You may already have it in but I think a counter attack by a QRF platoon would be a nice possible event.

If you would like to ensure you don't get the same plan again, you can always go into the editor and select that plan as "never use". There are three.

I actually did experiment with one plan being an immediate counter attack by a QRF platoon with the BTRs but found it unworkable. The Syrians are reservists attacking at night... invariably it was a slaughter when they tried to move forward, or they started doing the "crawl of death".

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

I scored a total victory losing 13 guys total while inflicting 200 casualties and killing all the vehicles, one with the .50 sniper.

Yes that .50 cal is freakin hell on BTRs. I'm glad someone got a victory I was beginning to think it was too hard, since most of my reports have been ties or losses.

Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq):

One nice difference from the first run through was that my snipers actually fired. Again I have no idea what may have made the difference.

Neither do I.

I am currently working on the second installment. A few hours after the first scenario ends a nearby Syrian mechanized battalion launches a dawn counter-attack and the paratroopers must hold the Aleppo terminal from an attack from the north highway.

After that I plan on a third installment simulating an air assault raid launched off of the airport to hit a military target. I might go ahead make a campaign of it, once all of the scenarios are finished I can just link them together.

[jomni]

found it

[Dr. Zoidberg]

Originally posted by Normal Dude:

Twice now I have had my own fire dropped straight on my troops. There's a reason they call 600 meters danger close! :eek:

One thing that is bugging me is that the JTAC team does not come with any comms. They seem to be dependant on their strykers, which have of course been omitted. In my testing I usually ended up using the company CO to call in the air support. It would be nice if the scenario designer could determine the comm equipment available.

I'm glad (well, a little!) to hear that I'm not the only one that has obliterated his own troops with a misplaced F-15 strike. Imagine my surprise when I give it a cease fire order and begin moving down the road shortly after, only to hear a very loud bang and notice my squads were totalled!

Kind of gave up after that, I was surprised by how many troops were left when I looked at the map after ending it. But still I think I would've been able to assault fairly well had I not lost my full strength squads to my own incompetence.

Part of the reason I screwed up so badly with the F-15 was that it was the first time I had even been able to use fixed wing air support and was not quite adjusted to the times and such. Loved the .50 cal as well, though I only managed to use it for plinking at the BTR's. Knocked out one and I must've disabled the other as it was dormant for the rest of the game.

Definitely one of my favourite scenarios so far, great map, force selection for both sides and design in general! I will be giving it another go as soon as possible.

[ChrisND]

Thanks for the report.

[SgtMuhammed]

Can they jump the Javelin? I know the Dragon was a bitch but I got out just as they were starting general issue of the Javelin and haven't heard anything from the Paratroopers.

[ChrisND]

generally they are dropped as door bundles, or they can be bundled with the heavy drop

I used to jump with a base plate, nothing like having one of those smack you while exiting the door.

[ChrisND]

Scenario version 1.03 should be ready soon.

[SgtMuhammed]

Played it again with the 1.03 patch. Noticably better.

Looking at the pictures of the airport I am pretty sure that the terrain between the runways slopes down into a ditch.

Anyway, I like what you are trying to do with the hangers but they are like little unit traps. I have had several units get stuck in the space between the hanger and the embankment. Perhaps you should just use heavy buildings.

I have also noticed something strange. If I order a squad into a hanger usually only one guy will enter the building while the rest will just sit outside. That one guy is stuck for the rest of the mission most of the time.

Does the 82nd still use the 60mm mortar? If they do hopefully they will be put in in a later patch along with arty smoke.

Man that F15 is powerful. I had it drop its bomb on the building in between the long hanger and the terminal. I kept my guys in the wooded area behind the big apartment complex (at least that is what it looks like to me) by the industrial area. Bomb hits and half my units start cowering even though they are over 500m and two rows of buildings away.

There are some really wierd LOS issues inside the Terminal. I had several squads get mowed down by units they appearantly could not see because they never returned fire. This happened to both sides. I never saw a case where both sides were blazing away. It was always one side firing and the other guys just taking it.

My guys are absolutely deadly with their AT4s. Had one guy stop while sprinting, fire his AT4 from about 150m, kill a BTR and then continue to his position. I also had the horrible experience of moving almost an entire platoon up only to realize that no one had any AT4s and they were about 10 meters from the ass end of a BTR. Again no one used a 203 or anything else.

Anyway, most of the problems are systemic rather than just scenario related. This is one of my favorites.

By the way, what time is it set at? Rune sent me a night battle and it is absolutely pitch black, you have a hard time seeing your own guys. Your's isn't nearly as dark.

[ChrisND]

Thanks for playing again, Sgt. Goody. I have still noticed some infantry problems myself, particularily with fireteams getting "stuck".

I just played a runthrough where the BTRs charged the drop zone and I had to fend them off with M136s and the .50 cal.

The date/time is 0130, June 19, Hazy.

I considered the slope between the runways, but it sounds like engineering folly having non-flat terrain right on a runway, right?

Also, better briefing graphics are coming:

For mission 1:

For the second mission, which is under construction:

This will definetely be combined into a full on campaign when all the missions are complete.