Questioning the Unquestionable ...

[Thomm]

When I played the WiC demo I noticed that I do click about twice as often in CM:SF than in WiC, because, as we all know, one has to 'confirm' movement orders with the right mouse button in CM:SF, regardless whether they have only one waypoint or more.

Is this something that is considered optimal by the majority, or is a traditional 'one-click' approach favored?! I would not mind holding down the, e.g., Ctrl key in order to enter multiple waypoints, especially since a good deal of my right mouse clicks seem to be ignored by the interface (have to click up to three times occasionally).

Best regards,

Thomm

[panzermartin]

I really really wish CMSF to borrow some UI from these massive RTSs. If something, they know the realtime thing years now. Right mouse click should be used for ordering and not camera panning. Facing would be easier by holding down the right button.

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by Rollstoy:

When I played the WiC demo I noticed that I do click about twice as often in CM:SF than in WiC, because, as we all know, one has to 'confirm' movement orders with the right mouse button in CM:SF, regardless whether they have only one waypoint or more.

Is this something that is considered optimal by the majority, or is a traditional 'one-click' approach favored?! I would not mind holding down the, e.g., Ctrl key in order to enter multiple waypoints, especially since a good deal of my right mouse clicks seem to be ignored by the interface (have to click up to three times occasionally).

Best regards,

Thomm

good point

its sort of annoying that the right click has be made some times several times before you can get it to "stick"

yes I find that annoying too.

[MarkEzra]

RE: Rt Click, Rt Click, Rt Click...ahhh there: this needs some work

[Abbott]

Originally posted by Ali-Baba:

I really really wish CMSF to borrow some UI from these massive RTSs. If something, they know the realtime thing years now. Right mouse click should be used for ordering and not camera panning. Facing would be easier by holding down the right button.

Yeah, Command & Conquer did it right!

[panzermartin]

Originally posted by Abbott:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ali-Baba:

I really really wish CMSF to borrow some UI from these massive RTSs. If something, they know the realtime thing years now. Right mouse click should be used for ordering and not camera panning. Facing would be easier by holding down the right button.

Yeah, Command & Conquer did it right! </font>

[Abbott]

Originally posted by Ali-Baba:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Abbott:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ali-Baba:

I really really wish CMSF to borrow some UI from these massive RTSs. If something, they know the realtime thing years now. Right mouse click should be used for ordering and not camera panning. Facing would be easier by holding down the right button.

Yeah, Command & Conquer did it right! </font>

[Other Means]

Originally posted by Rollstoy:

When I played the WiC demo I noticed that I do click about twice as often in CM:SF than in WiC, because, as we all know, one has to 'confirm' movement orders with the right mouse button in CM:SF, regardless whether they have only one waypoint or more.

Is this something that is considered optimal by the majority, or is a traditional 'one-click' approach favored?! I would not mind holding down the, e.g., Ctrl key in order to enter multiple waypoints, especially since a good deal of my right mouse clicks seem to be ignored by the interface (have to click up to three times occasionally).

Best regards,

Thomm

Good point. It does seem a lot of work to use the UI.

[panzermartin]

Abbot, I disagree about CMSF being more of an RTS. You obviously havent played one lately because CMSF is a tactical nightmare compared to these things. CMSF is all about decisions. Fast clicks will bring you more losses. The problem with CMSF lies partly in the interface, not the philosophy of the game. Move, target, rotate could be one click like in those games, while retaining the same hotkeys system for the more special commands. It wont hurt its tactical side, rather save time and focus for more thinking and planning.

[Abbott]

Originally posted by Ali-Baba:

Abbot, I disagree about CMSF being more of an RTS. You obviously havent played one lately because CMSF is a tactical nightmare compared to these things. CMSF is all about decisions. Fast clicks will bring you more losses. The problem with CMSF lies partly in the interface, not the philosophy of the game. Move, target, rotate could be one click like in those games, while retaining the same hotkeys system for the more special commands. It wont hurt its tactical side, rather save time and focus for more thinking and planning.

That's fine Ali- obviously we just disagree on implementation, I am so burned out on RTS and anything that moves CM:SF farther into the genre (to me) makes it less of a Wargame. I do agree that the current interface is a bit clunky to use. I thnik Steve and crew are working on that. Maybe with some more time for refinement CM:SF will find it's way back to more of a Combat Mission "feel".

[SlowMotion]

Originally posted by Ali-Baba:

... The problem with CMSF lies partly in the interface, not the philosophy of the game. Move, target, rotate could be one click like in those games, while retaining the same hotkeys system for the more special commands. It wont hurt its tactical side, rather save time and focus for more thinking and planning.

Getting move and rotate to work reliably would be especially important for the real time play. Now it sometimes happens that you start rotating the view, but because some of the mouse clicks are ignored you can't stop view from rotating. Making it stop may take several seconds and during this time the opponent kills your unit.

[Omenowl]

Considering the RT mode allows for pauses and the fact you can leave your soldiers in autowatch phase I hardly consider it a click fest based on speed. Yes, it does require me to click a lot, but I noticed it is more about setting firing arcs, evaluating the enemy or trying to stand back while I decide what to do.

I also noticed that spending the extra 5-10 seconds and thinking about my decisions is better than simply trying to speed up the fight. Compared to MTW2 or Dawn of war I feel I am awarded more leisure in combat, but my decisions are more catastrophic if not done correctly.

My forces tend to get split into 2-3 groups and I focus on one vs. another. One will wait to provide suppressive fire or to watch for reinforcements, while another inches its way forward to secure an objective. If one groups gets bogged down, I might leave them to defend and bring up another from a different direction to provide more suppresive fire or take the objective. My real complaint about most scenarios is time more than clicking.

[SlowMotion]

Originally posted by Omenowl:

My forces tend to get split into 2-3 groups and I focus on one vs. another. One will wait to provide suppressive fire or to watch for reinforcements, while another inches its way forward to secure an objective. If one groups gets bogged down, I might leave them to defend and bring up another from a different direction to provide more suppresive fire or take the objective.

Think how this would be with 2-3 players on one side and full battle playback. During play you'd get incredible FOW because you're not controlling all units even on your side. Still after the battle you could view what actually happened in different parts of the map.