So like..

[Valael]

Basically, I'm as new as one can get to war games.

So here I was, reading PCGamer's CMBB review and thought to myself "I just have to try it."

So I download the demo. I can't even beat the tutorial. I use the PDF file that came with it in hopes of getting somewhere.

I follow it the best I can, but it seems as though my units will ALWAYS run once fired upon. And once they start running, it seems impossible to get them to turn around.

On top of that, it seems as though my support units won't even fire.

Anyone have any advice to maybe getting atleast somewhat decent at this? Or care to explain why my units have about as much courage as a toddler?

Is CMBB just not meant to be a beginner's wargame?

[Snarker]

Actually, the demo is more to showcase the new features of CMBB v CMBO. You can safely purchase the game knowing that if you follow reasonable practices you will do fine. The manual is actually good, unlike the tripe usually supplied with current games.

[Das Reich]

I agree with what Snarker said.

Buy the game. If the idea of the game has you interested enough to post on here about it, then I can promise you that you will love the game once you get the basics down. And that does not take long.

[aka_tom_w]

Originally posted by Valael:

Anyone have any advice to maybe getting atleast somewhat decent at this? Or care to explain why my units have about as much courage as a toddler?

Is CMBB just not meant to be a beginner's wargame?

I would say CMBB is not meant to be a beginner's wargame.

It is quite a remarkable WWII combat simulator.

Many of us here have been playing card board wargames for over 15-20 years and spend the majority of our life growing up dreaming about things like FOW. (thats a big one as there is No fog of war in most card board wargames as both players see all the units irrespective of LOS or spotting as in most games there is no spotting rules.)

The attention to detail and the historical fidelity combined with the new morale model in CMBB make it a very demanding game to play. This is what the designers want and it was what most hard core wargamers respect and expect in a well made combat simulation.

It is hard to play BUT manual is Great and you can now buy the $15 strategy guide which will help you learn real world tactics that work well in the game.

I did not like the demo's at all.

if you want to win at the demo play the German side in the one on the Russian Steppe.

maybe someone else can remind us, the demo scenario seemed unbalanced and in each of them one side was ALOT easier to win with then the other side but I don't recall which specific advice to give.

Thanks

Good luck Keep at it, It really is rewarding to WIN!

-tom w

[ December 19, 2002, 11:54 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

[Matias]

Uh... I'm gonna go against the flow here and say that if you hate the demo, DON'T buy the game. Personally I love CM - even when it frustrates me beyond belief because its VERY realistic - but if you hate the demo, don't follow that up with $40 of frustration, remorse and and animosity towards the members of this board.

Instead, try the demo again - the scenario where the Russians attack the woods, NOT Yevlina Stare (sp?) which is designed to make the German player cry (at least newbie German players like I was!).

I'm advising this from memory, but I think the key to this one was Human Wave and support fire. First take your time in moving in your support weapons (a couple Maxims and Mortars right?) with Move to Contact into the little patch of woods in the middle of the map. Get them close to the edge with Move to Contact, and DO NOT start your Human Wave until thoose puppies are firing. Use Target to tell them roughly where to shoot and be sure that the target line you draw is in their Line of Sight. If it turns black and red, aim elsewhere or move the units. A succesful traget command will 'stick' and be displayed as long as you have the unit selected. Also one units are identified in the woods, give your support units new orders to target them directly.

Hopefully this will help, although niether demo scenario really gives a good feel for the game. You might also try and download the CMBO demo - the gameplay in those two scenarios is more like what I really love in CM, but be warned the graphics are far less impressive.

Another thing to try for a feel of if the game is fun to you w/o having to buy it and read the manual is setting the force bonus up for you. Play Yevlina Stare as the Russians or the demo scenario and give your side a 30% boost. It'll allow you to get the feel of the game play (and the satisfaction) w/o having to worry about learning both tactics and a new game interface at the same time!

Good luck! Hopefully you'll love it and join us... Join us... joooiiiin uuussss...

[JunoReactor]

Originally posted by aka_tom_w:

I would say CMBB is not meant to be a beginner's wargame.

Valael, dont let him scare you. He's a bit wierd in the head, happens to everyone after they stay in the forum for a couple of years. Me? I'm a lurker - I keep at a distance, just enough to keep my sanity.

The game can be as deep as you want it to be. There is a lot that happens under the hood, but you dont need to know what's boiling there to start playing the game and enjoying it. The game teases you. It allows to learn from your mistakes and steadily improve your tactics.

And the forum always provides a fresh supply of material to be read, and each time you discover something new about the game here, you go back and try it and do not emerge for hours.

Of course, there are wonders of nature like our esteemed Tom W. who grew up reading rulebooks and learning details like just what it is that seperates a StuG IIIg (early) from its (late) variant that frequent this forum, but treat them as part of the scenery, and you'll enjoy yourself.

As already mentioned, the average scenario in the full game is far better than the one provided in the demo. You cant really lose. Unless you wander into the Peng Thread, that is.

(edited just because)

[ December 20, 2002, 12:22 AM: Message edited by: JunoReactor ]

[Valael]

Well, I guess I wasn't trying hard enough. Actually, I think it was just stupidity screwing me up before.

This time around, I used a little common sense. First, I used the advise above and used Contact for moving my support around (Which didn't seem to do me much good considering I didn't actually see anyone until I got them to where I wanted them to go)

But this time, I didn't use my units as though they were one big unit/group. Instead I positioned each one individually. It was a blast to actually get somewhere in the game..

Just one question -- THere's no disadvantage to fastforwarding other than not seeing exactly what's going on, is there?

I definently think I'm going to have to get this game -- as long as I can find it at one of the local retailers, heh. Ordering over the net is kind of out of the question with all this christmas stuff going on.

Oh, and by the way, thanks for the replies. You probably convinced me to atleast give the retail a try.

Just curious -- Does anyone know if Bestbuy, Babbages/Gamestop, or maybe even Wal Mart has been known to carry CMBB?

[ December 20, 2002, 12:49 AM: Message edited by: Valael ]

[jdmorse]

One way is to plunge right in, and once you get used to basic commands trolll for a 'training pbem' one where up front your opponenet knows you are still learning, then they can make comments and suggestions, deconstruct what went right and wrong and you can see how they handle things. '

The games I earned the most from were ones where my rear was carved up and served well done.

There are thousands here and there that started like you. Experience, the simply playing makes things clearer.

A bit of advice. Think 'real life'. Often the gamey tricks of other games ain't going to work. Ask yourself what you would do realistically in a similar situation. many folks read WWII boioks and actual unit tactical manuels to get an idea. Battlefront has a tactical Library available at reasonable prices that is helpful, also the stategy guide.

Perhaps try the CM: Beyond Overlord demo as a way of getting used to things. It is a bit more forgivingand many people like it better.

Welcome and Good Luck

[Gaylord Focker]

Nope, you can only buy it from Battlefront.com

[MGONZOM]

Just on the Internet in the States.... worth the money and for the wait...

[Pvt. Ryan]

If you want to fast forward through the movies, maybe CM is not for you. Watching the movies over and over to see what happened and to replay the cool stuff is one of the best features of CM. Also, you don't have to win to enjoy the game. Some of the scenarios are very historic and don't give you a very fair chance of winning depending on what side you play. If you are new to wargames I suppose you are probably not all that familiar with WWII history in general, especially the forces involved. You might want to get learn a bit about the armored fighting vehicles of WWII so you know what your vehicles are capable of. Understanding each vehicle's strengths and weaknesses can greatly enhance your chance of victory. There are plenty of sites on the net that can provide a good education without having to buy any books.

[ December 20, 2002, 01:22 AM: Message edited by: Pvt. Ryan ]

[Valael]

I don't mind the movies so much anymore. It was mostly when I played my first/second game and tried to do it WarCraft style...and then having all of my units run for their lives.

Oh, and I tried BO -- The Chance Encounter map was great.. The other one completely kicked my butt.. heh

[Oddball_E8]

Then youll be happy to know that the chance encounter, last defence, riesberg and valley of trouble are available for CMBB as well... some nutter has been converting them for CMBB and we love him/her for it

[notalex]

I definently think I'm going to have to get this game -- as long as I can find it at one of the local retailers, heh. Ordering over the net is kind of out of the question with all this christmas stuff going on.

Oh, and by the way, thanks for the replies. You probably convinced me to atleast give the retail a try.

Just curious -- Does anyone know if Bestbuy, Babbages/Gamestop, or maybe even Wal Mart has been known to carry CMBB?

Beg, borrow, or steal a credit card, because you can only buy it that way from Battlefront. (They also take MOs and personal cheques, if you're in the US.)

This is by far the best wargame I have ever played and I've played them all.

$45 US divided by hours-of-pleasure equals division by zero or something before I lost control of the metaphor.

Buy this game.

[CavalryMan]

Originally posted by Valael:

..

Just one question -- THere's no disadvantage to fastforwarding other than not seeing exactly what's going on, is there?

No there is no change in the outcome, except that you may miss something small but significant. I find that I often do this whilst waiting for my troops to move up to where my recon has found the enemy

[Bartokomus]

valael

what you need is a seminal moment; taking out a KV with a satchel charge; knocking out a KV with an '88 when all your light German armor is cowering in scattered trees. And finally, the most challenging, knocking out a KV with flamethrower unit. Once you complete any of these tasks you will jump up from your chair and do the victory dance, family members staring on in fear and trepidation...

[Partisan Chief.]

Valael, Battlefront has great shipping. I live in Mississippi, and I got my copy in 3 days. By the way, if you never played CMBO, get the bundle pack. CMBO is a good way to ease yourself into the system in an more forgiving environment. Plus, it's a great game too. CMBB is better, but more brutal and unforgiving.

I think you'll find this community to be very close knit and welcoming, unless you stumble into the Peng Thread , and we'll always be willing to lend a hand to anyone who needs it.

Hope to have you aboard!

[MikeyD]

CMBB invariably comes as a bit of a shock to people who grew up on shooter games. Running, jumping and getting the first shot off doesn't much work here (and no health crystals to collect either ). I haven't seen a game that could hold people's attention for so long as CM (2 years and counting?). But you've got to understand what you're getting into.

[ December 20, 2002, 06:29 PM: Message edited by: MikeyD ]