Boo Radley Posted January 12, 2002 Share Posted January 12, 2002 I'm new to the forums. I don't even have the full game yet. I've been playing the demo over and over and over. But that's not the point. When using my tanks to fire a smoke screen, why is it that they fire several rounds before any smoke shows up? Is that just something on the demo, or does it hold true for the actual game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Wacky Posted January 12, 2002 Share Posted January 12, 2002 I would imagine that it takes the smoke a while to materialize enough to take full effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted January 12, 2002 Share Posted January 12, 2002 Hi Boo, Welcome aboard In Real Life the smoke from a smoke round (fired from a tank or artillery) takes a while to develop before it is thick enough to form a screen. It is this that is being simulated with the delay between when a round is fired and impacts, and when the smoke graphic appears. So, yes, the delay is in the full game too. It's not really that big a deal, just something you have to take into account with your planning. Regards JonS PS Smoke is your friend. Learning how to use it well is an important part of your tactical toolbag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Manuel Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 An interesting side note on smoke, is that the delay you see before the screen forms up does not apply for rounds fired right before the end of the 60 second movie. Any round fired in the last second or so immediately becomes a full screen when the movie file reaches "done." So if your offmap mortar battery fires 4 rounds at the end...they all go to full screens anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Radley Posted January 13, 2002 Author Share Posted January 13, 2002 OK, I get it. The smoke needs a few rounds before it is thick enough to take effect and appear on the screen. Makes sense. I was confused because one of the selling points of the game is the fact that all rounds count and are registered on screen. So I wondered, "So where's the smoke?" As for the smoke being an important tool, I hear you. As I said I've only played the two scenarios offered in the demo (hint, hint: would you guys send me the game already? I ordered it over a month ago.)and in the Chance Meeting game, I lay down a smoke screen so I can hustle my men into position without having to dodge arms fire. BTW, I'm loving this game. Up until now, I've just been playing things like Red Alert, Command & Conquer and they basically end up as tank rush after tank rush after tank rush. I wanted something with tactics, something more realistic than those games can offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jussi Köhler Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 Oh dear You have all the best in front of you... This game is SO rewarding... You never get tired of its mp opponents atleast See ya on the battleground! # Edited couse I cant Find my way home... # [ 01-12-2002: Message edited by: Jussi Köhler ]</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Boo_Radley: OK, I get it. The smoke needs a few rounds before it is thick enough to take effect and appear on the screen... <hr></blockquote> Sorry, I just wanted to clarify this point. Each round of smoke fired will eventually generate its own smoke plume, but it takes a while for each plume to be thick enough to register. So, (1 smoke round) + (appropriate delay) = (1 smoke plume) The delay varies depending on the type of round fired. The type of round fired also affects how big and how long each plume stays on the map. 155mm smoke is huge and lasts for ages, 2" mortar smoke is timy and only lasts 30 seconds or so. Regards JonS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herr Kruger Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 Oh my! I certainly did not know about different sizes and durations of smoke!! I'm so embarassed! I kind of did notice on-board mortar smoke seemed so small but never thought it out that big guns could offer longer-lasting smoke screens... dumbkopf! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offtaskagain Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 I hate it when I get smoked by 105s or bigger. The crap just won't go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperTed Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Boo_Radley: ...would you guys send me the game already? I ordered it over a month ago... <hr></blockquote> BR, You have waited too long. Send an email to matt@battlefront.com and he'll get you squared away. Be sure to include the order date, your real name, address, and form of payment when contacting Matt. He may need more information, but that will be a good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leta Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by panzerwerfer42: I hate it when I get smoked by 105s or bigger. The crap just won't go away.<hr></blockquote> Me too. In a recent PBEM game, my opponent fire 4-5 150mm smoke grenades right to one of my bunkers ... and the smoke remains for almost 14 turns! Finally, the game ends and the bunker was still in a smoke cloud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Radley Posted January 13, 2002 Author Share Posted January 13, 2002 I had noticed the different sizes of smoke plume. Suddenly in the middle of the game all these little plumes blossomed all over the map and I though, "I didn't do that, did I?" I then realized it was enemy mortar fire. Thanks also for the e-mail address. I e-mailed the main address last Wednesday, but as yet haven't heard back from them. So sad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 Has anyone tried using the 14" guns for smoke? Just curious... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acrashb Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 If you want to know about arty, and particularly smoke and its durations, go here. the longest duration is 2:30 - nothing lasts '14 turns', contrary to Leta's statements. Must have been a continuing barrage. And 14" guns don't have smoke (according to the above tables). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leta Posted January 13, 2002 Share Posted January 13, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by aaronb: the longest duration is 2:30 - nothing lasts '14 turns', contrary to Leta's statements. Must have been a continuing barrage. <hr></blockquote> I'm pretty sure about the number of turns. But, according to your data, I'm sure now (before I only suspects) it's a game bug. But I lose the battle, anyway ... :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puff the Magic Dragon Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 I wonder why infnatry isn't able to lay smoke. Where smoke handgrenades not alerady developed in WWII? Maybe it would be senseless anyway... I assume the smoke screen would excist at best for ~ half minute. But for a squad on retreat, maybe...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 After doing a i found this from BTS <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>posted 12-07-1999 04:47 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Los, very well put. The basic problem we had is ASL/CC/etc. on one hand, and lack of direct evidence of use on the other. I think we can safely say that smoke for squads was not used for concealment to the degree that other games allow you, so this means restricting it in CM. Since we think that the use was *so* limited, we decided it was best to leave it out altogether. The few cases we could find where SOP and accounts went hand in hand in support of smoke grenades was during planned bunker cleaning by carefully executed and time consuming tactics (i.e. not on the fly like CM simulates). One reason why I personally feel smoke for concealment was, in practice, quite rare is that the smoke produced from them was of limited use unless several were used in circumstances that were favorable (i.e. no wind, not in the open, etc.) I know that the German Squad Manual talks about shooting blindly into smoke when it appears, and that could also be a BIG reason why it wasn't used like other games would have you believe. Hell, if I was an MG gunner, and I saw smoke pop in a position that I knew the enemy was in, I would unload in that area for sure! Anyhoo, if anybody can convince us to add smoke later, it will be Los His research skills are excellent, as is his dedication to find out what really went on. Steve <hr></blockquote> the search button what a concept Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Radley Posted January 14, 2002 Author Share Posted January 14, 2002 I once stupidly got one of my rifle squads pinned down in an open position and they weren't able to move until I had a Sherman lay a smoke screen in front of them. You should have seen them scamper back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Manuel Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 Nice tactic Boo. Tank smoke rounds are great...very accurate, plus if you use it up the TacAI won't decide to use Smoke rather thatn HE when you gave an HE order. I hate when that happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tools4fools Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 How about if we could order our units (rapid firing guns in particular like AA guns and MG) blind into the smoke? Like the aera fire command that sticks to any part of a building. Sometimes this could be useful, enemy advancing over a bridge under a smokescreen for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by tools4fools: How about if we could order our units (rapid firing guns in particular like AA guns and MG) blind into the smoke? Like the aera fire command that sticks to any part of a building. Sometimes this could be useful, enemy advancing over a bridge under a smokescreen for example.<hr></blockquote> Again, a search would answer that question in more detail. The short answer is 'absolute spotting'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Radley Posted January 14, 2002 Author Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Silvio Manuel: Tank smoke rounds are great...very accurate, plus if you use it up the TacAI won't decide to use Smoke rather thatn HE when you gave an HE order. I hate when that happens.<hr></blockquote> Oh tell me about it! There I am, trying to get my Sherman out of harm's way, reversing like a maniac, ordering it to fire a smoke screen before the PF nails it, and it decides to open fire on a small machine gun squad. I call that rank insubordination! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tools4fools Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 @ Andreas: Thanks for the short answer ('absolute spotting') to my question; In combination with 'smoke' the search took me right to the specific topic and it answered my question. Marcus **** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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