Well, at least one bazooka made it to the East Front

[YankeeDog]

Was wandering around the web researching something else when I found this pic:

WARNING: The following is a Tripod site. You WILL get an annoying pop-up window about home mortgages or something if you access the site (unless you have a blocker, of course. . .)

access this web page and click on "Soldier Firing Bazooka over snow" (remote linking to this site is blocked)

Actually, the image is too small for me to even tell for sure if that's a Russian soldier firing the 'zook. But it's the first picture I've ever seen that even claims to be of a Russian soldier with a bazooka in combat during WWII.

So maybe we should see zooks in CMBB with a rarity, say, of +1000%??

[ August 05, 2003, 04:18 PM: Message edited by: YankeeDog ]

[Oddball_E8]

i have seen some russian soldiers carrying bazookas in a landing from the World At War Series... they had loads of them there...

the way i see it they werent common... but the ones that were used were used en masse... so they should be available... as should captured fausts and chrecks... late war of course... IMHO

[von Lucke]

Hmmmm --- I'm wondering if that photo is from the East Front at all:

Given that details are hard to make out, and the subjects are almost nothing more than silhouettes, the one with the bazooka kinda looks like he's wearing US Army-style pants and boots. It also almost looks like he's wearing one of those little knit caps US troops liked to sport in winter.

Wouldn't be the first time somebody miss-ID'd a photo...

[IntelWeenie]

Originally posted by Oddball_E8:

as should captured fausts and chrecks... late war of course... IMHO

Captured small arms are sometimes available, why not 'fausts?? I'd have to nix the schrek teams only because there's no infantry rarity... :mad:

(unless they were made ungodly expensive)

[pad152]

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Captured small arms are sometimes available, why not 'fausts??

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This is why I would like to see the ability to create your own Infantry units(Infantry Editor) with CMX2 where you select the number of men and select/edit what weapons they have. The editor would know how many men is required for each weapon so you can't have a 8 man squad carry eight 50 Cal MG's.

The edited units could be saved along with the scenario data for custom battles or operations to keep everyone playing with the same unit data.

[Denwad]

Yes, as much fun as realism is, alternate themes would be VERY cool.

Like, 1940, England's BEF is massacred at Dunkirk and not a single BEF man survives. Later, the Luftwaffe relentlessly bombs RAF facilities and U-boats cutoff England from the rest of the world.

Germany, 1945, after conquering England and decimating Russia, Germany draws up plans to invade the US.

You know, I can always dream :eek:

[Captain Pies]

The soldiers trousers are also bloused out above his boots which would suggest strongly its a yank.

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by Denwad:

Yes, as much fun as realism is, alternate themes would be VERY cool.

Like, 1940, England's BEF is massacred at Dunkirk and not a single BEF man survives. Later, the Luftwaffe relentlessly bombs RAF facilities and U-boats cutoff England from the rest of the world.

Germany, 1945, after conquering England and decimating Russia, Germany draws up plans to invade the US.

Do you also propose to suspend the law of gravity? Just curious.

You know, I can always dream :eek:

The dream of Germany conquering the world, or even a substantial part of it, sounds more like a nightmare to me.

Michael

[Nippy]

Originally posted by Denwad:

Germany, 1945, after conquering England and decimating Russia, Germany draws up plans to invade the US.

Milita Sharp shooter - 10 points

T26 Pershing - 800 points

Enola Gay - 15,000 points

Look on the German players's face - Priceless

[reinald@berlin.com]

I always thought it is established fact that the Russians got bazookas via lend-lease. They didn't like them though and the weapon therefore did not see widespread use.

[YankeeDog]

As I understand it, the verifiable facts on bazookas on East Front are as follows:

1) It is a matter of historical record that a few thousand were actually sent. I've seen high figures between 5,000 - 6,000, and lower figures down around 3,000. It is unclear to me whether this figure represents actual rockets (which would make this a very small amount), or just launchers, which would presumably make the actual number of rockets some multiple of this number.

2) The Soviets clearly didn't like the things. Thought they were too weak in penetration ability, were too short range, and had to large of a firing signature.

3) To the best of my knowledge, it is completely unknown how many, if any any bazookas actually made it to front line Russian units. At least, I have never read any accounts of them being used in battle on the East Front. That's why the linked pic is interesting. It *purports* to show a bazooka in use in combat on the East Front. In actuality, it is very unclear exactly what the photo shows, and even whether it is from the East Front at all. . .

Cheers,

YD

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by pad152:

----------------------------------------------------

Captured small arms are sometimes available, why not 'fausts??

----------------------------------------------------

This is why I would like to see the ability to create your own Infantry units(Infantry Editor) with CMX2 where you select the number of men and select/edit what weapons they have. The editor would know how many men is required for each weapon so you can't have a 8 man squad carry eight 50 Cal MG's.

The edited units could be saved along with the scenario data for custom battles or operations to keep everyone playing with the same unit data.

There were certainly times when units upped their automatic weapons usage for special circumstances. When my own Regiment crossed the Albert Canal in September 1944, the first 8 man assault section had two Bren guns and 6 Stens. "Extra" stens were often parcelled out to infantry units for patrolling, etc.

Would be a fun concept and also a way for those manual campaign players to better track individual squads and set them up for the next battle.

[Doodlebug]

Originally posted by von Lucke:

Hmmmm --- I'm wondering if that photo is from the East Front at all:

Given that details are hard to make out, and the subjects are almost nothing more than silhouettes, the one with the bazooka kinda looks like he's wearing US Army-style pants and boots. It also almost looks like he's wearing one of those little knit caps US troops liked to sport in winter.

Wouldn't be the first time somebody miss-ID'd a photo...

I agree with you there. I'd go so far as to predict that we're actually looking at a picture of a GI in Korea.

[Pak40]

I think the picture is either bogus or chronologically misplaced. The picture is listed under Operation Barbarosa and Counterattack, which implies 1941-42. I don't think the Bazooka was even issued to US troops until 1943.

[Michael Emrys]

Without looking it up, I'm pretty sure it was issued to American troops in 1942, well in time for Torch. I seriously doubt that it got to the USSR in numbers that year though.

Michael

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by Michael Emrys:

Without looking it up, I'm pretty sure it was issued to American troops in 1942, well in time for Torch. I seriously doubt that it got to the USSR in numbers that year though.

Michael

Captured samples from North Africa was used as the basis for the Panzerschreck which appeared in the summer of 43, so the Germans definitely had it before then.