What is a Fusilier?

[Guest Mike]

he he he

OK - a quick primer about Napoleonic infantry battalion organisation is in order I think

As now, a battalion was made up of a number of companies - the exact number varied from state to state - the British had 10, hte French 9 or 6 at various times, etc.

Infantry companies always fought in lines, and prior to Napoleon's tiem the normal formation for a battalion was al the companies lined up side by side, in a longer line.

So most troops were formed into "line" companies - these could have various titles such as Musketeer, but they all ahd the common feature that they fought in the line.

However the best men were put into elite companies. These were termed "flank" companies because when the whole battalion was formed in line these companies were on the left and right flanks of the line.

The tallest men would be in the Grenadier company, and the smallest and/or most nimble and/or best shots would be in the light company.

There were variations on this patern tho - for example the Austrian army in hte Napoleonic wars did not have any flank companies in the battalions - instead the regiment (2 or 3 bn's) had 2 Grenadier companies, and these were all split off and formed into brigades and divisions of Grenadier battalions - the 2 companies from 2 regiments would form a battalion.

this system of "converging grenadiers was used by pretty much everybody at some stage or other. Some natins also used "converged" light battalions of the light companies taken from ordinary infantry attalions - particularly hte English in hte American War of independance.

However such "converged" battalions shouldn't be confused with regimetns with the title of "light" or "grenadier", which were supposed to be elite troops of hte appropriate type.

In such regiments the "line" companies would have a different title - eg Grenadier or Fusilier or Tiralleur, while the "flank" companies might also have different titles - eg the "Grenadier" company in a French light battalion wa titled "Carabinier" IIRC.

Hope that helps!!

[leakyD]

Hmmm...

Though the nature of war has grown increasingly complex, the nomenclature and terminology for the units that conduct war have simplified.

Pretty interesting!

Maybe it's the only way we humans can deal with such a nasty business. Complex names *and* complex equipment/tactics/logistics would just be too much.

[The Vyrdolak]

Originally posted by gibsonm:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Zaraath:

grenadiers from Catholic countries (France, Austria) tended to wear bearskins, while mitre caps were worn by Protestant armies (Great Britain, Brandenburg-Prussia).

OK so how did British Guardsmen (Grenadiers, Coldstream, etc) end up with bearskins? [/QB]</font>

[The Vyrdolak]

Originally posted by Screeny:

OK OK OK hold that train and thought for a second.....etcetcetc....so does any one knows a good book on all of this but then of the Napoleonic Era?? There are many books about Napie but I don't want to end up with an Biograpy descriping his breakfast ritual . So A good readable yet thorough book on the basic principle, tactics, strategies, unit types, doctrines, ToE, OoB's etcetcetc of that era for the beginner...

Thanx in Advance

Jeremy Black, Col. John R. Elting, and (Sir?) David Chandler are all excellent. Eltings Arm's Around a Throne does get a bit deep into the minutiae of La Grand Armee, maybe not what you're looking for.

[Redwolf]

I am beta-testing, so to speak, a guide on the various infantry formations.

You can read it here:

http://schlepper.hanse.de/redwolf/infantry-toe.html

If you have some time, please let me know whether you find it useful. Corrections and additions are welcome.

[ August 31, 2003, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: redwolf ]

[Joachim]

Originally posted by Zaraath:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by gibsonm:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Zaraath:

grenadiers from Catholic countries (France, Austria) tended to wear bearskins, while mitre caps were worn by Protestant armies (Great Britain, Brandenburg-Prussia).

OK so how did British Guardsmen (Grenadiers, Coldstream, etc) end up with bearskins? </font>

[Amedeo]

Please, refer to my previous post for the true origin of the British grenadiers' bearskin caps.

BTW bearskins were not used by Higlanders during the Napoleonic period, the seemingly "furry" hat they wore is actually a cap with _lots_ of ostrich feathers on it. They switched to true bearskins shortly before the Crimean war period.

Regards,

Amedeo

[blue division]

The terms 'Fusilier' and 'Grenadier' as far as the British Army from as far back as the War of The Spanish Succesion in 1702. Basically, a Fusilier was a member of the line infantry armed with a rifle. A grenadier was a guy with a rifle and a bag of primitive grenades - light the fuse on a big iron ball and throw it at the enemy. The grenadiers were handpicked on the grounds of being the tallest of men physically - just think, throwing those grenades must have been like throwing a shotput. I would also expect them to have higher morale and discipline than a standard rifle man. They were really the shock troop infantry of 16th century warfare.

The use of the term Grenadier and Fusilier has survived in Britain because of regimental history and tradition. The Grenadiers were obsolete by the time of Napoleon - muskets would have cut them down long before they could do anything.

[Philippe]

My memory is getting a bit hazy around the edges, but I thought that Grenadiers were armed with muskets rather than rifles. And I wonder how many of them really carried grenades into battle by the late 18th century.

Musket and rifle aren't synonymous. Chasseur-type infantry (aka Jaegers, Cacciatore) fight in open order and tend to aim their weapons at individual targets. Line-type infantry fight in closed ranks and point their weapons in the general direction of the opposing formation. This latter procedure is not so silly when you realize that a musket ball flying out of the barrel will be spinning every which way, and the chances of hitting a twenty meter wide target at a hundred meters is probably 50-50 at best. That's why they didn't bother to aim, and that's why a firing squad was a particularly inhumane form of execution (in the pictures of the execution of admiral Byng the squad is standing very close). The whole point of musket tactics was to get as high a volume of fire in the general direction of the enemy as possible. You don't win because you kill him, you win because he loses his nerve in the smoke and the noise and runs away.

Muskets are smoothbore, and reputedly a little easier to load than rifles, which may or may not have tighter barrels but apparently fire a slightly different sized ball. Napoleon armed his light infantry with the same weapon as his line infantry to reduce the size of his ammunition train (and thus increase his columns' road speed), but apparently intended to eventually switch back -- he never got around to it. Most other armies that had jaeger-type troops tended to arm them with rifles, since a rifle is better than a musket for aimed fire. Note that jaegers got into the various military systems via Hungary, Austria, and Germany, and there were many different styles of German armies (Saxons, Bavarians, and Prussians were the main ones). When working with Napoleonics you always have to be careful to make sure you know what your Fusilierien, Schuetzen, or Jaegers are armed with, because if they're carrying muskets the designation may be honorific, or if they're Napoleonic German allies they may be Gallicizing and shortening the supply train (and simplifying logistics and industrial production) by using muskets instead of rifles. I think the Westfalians may have done a bit of this.

Remember that a fusilier is someone who may or may not be carrying a fusil (french for rifle).

[Bonxa]

That infantry guide was very useful Redwolf. I would have loved to read something like that when I was new to CM and it cleared up some things for me even now. Should be linked from the Tips & Tricks useful posts thread.

[teotwawki1]

Speaking of fusils, perhaps the worlds most famous fusil is the Fusil Automatique Leger, or FAL. At one time or another, over 90 countries fielded the FAL,including many NATO countries. It has been called the Free World's Right Arm. It's a must have for enthusiasts of the dreaded EBR.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled broadcast.

[Krautman]

Originally posted by redwolf:

I am beta-testing, so to speak, a guide on the various infantry formations.

You can read it here:

http://schlepper.hanse.de/redwolf/infantry-toe.html

If you have some time, please let me know whether you find it useful. Corrections and additions are welcome.

Very interesting! Could you provide source notes?

[MG TOW]

Late 1944,

Germany

Fusiliers are (somewhat mobile) Reserve light infantry regiments replacing recon regiments simply because regular organic recon regiments had to be integrated with heer divisional line units, shortage of man power and all.

They are modelled very much like heer mountain regiments in structure and arms. The counter unit to the fusilier is the volksgrenadier: Less mobile but better equipped.

[Redwolf]

Originally posted by Krautman:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by redwolf:

I am beta-testing, so to speak, a guide on the various infantry formations.

You can read it here:

http://schlepper.hanse.de/redwolf/infantry-toe.html

If you have some time, please let me know whether you find it useful. Corrections and additions are welcome.

Very interesting! Could you provide source notes? </font>

[David I]

Amedeo,

Hold on one minute Old Boy. The Highland Regiments of the British Army have NEVER worn bearskin caps! Kilted, Highland Regiments have worn Feathered Bonnets begining in the 1780's and their bands (including the pipes and drums) still do. The Highland Light Infantry Regiment wore diced shakos and the Royal Highland Fusiliers wore bearskin fusilier caps until their amalgamation (neither were kilted regiments). The Scot's Guards are a Guards Regiment, not a Highland Regiment.

How Highland Regiments came to wear the Ostrich feathered bonnet, when they hail from a land that's not exactly renowned for it's huge Ostrich herds, is an interesting question. :confused:

On a general note: I highly recommend Christopher Duffy's "Warfare in the Age of Reason" as an excellent primer for 18th century warfare.

David

[Andreas]

The Ostrich feather is probably connected to the Prince of Wales?

Ich Dien and the blind king of Bohemia, and Crecy, and all that?

Any connections there?

[Amedeo]

Originally posted by David I:

Amedeo,

Hold on one minute Old Boy. The Highland Regiments of the British Army have NEVER worn bearskin caps!

Of course Highlanders wore ostrich feathers bonnets in the XVIII century though the napoleonic period, but I remember having read that the new pattern cap introduced in the mid of the XIX century was indeed made of bearskin and feathers (although different in shape from the typical grenadier or fusilier bearskin cap).

I might be wrong on this since I'm no expert of the Crimean War (I have a good knowledge of the SYW and Napoleonic period however), but rest assured I'm not mistaking the Guards or Fusiliers regiments for Highlander

Regards,

Amedeo

[John D Salt]

Originally posted by blue division:

[snips]

The use of the term Grenadier and Fusilier has survived in Britain because of regimental history and tradition. The Grenadiers were obsolete by the time of Napoleon - muskets would have cut them down long before they could do anything.

However, when hand-grenades once again became a practicable weapon in the Great War, the British Army was compelled to call soldiers whose specialism was throwing hand-grenades "bombers". The regimental tradition of which you speak insisted that the term "Grenadier" could only ever be applied to a member of the Grenadier Guards.

All the best,

John.

[David I]

Amedeo

"...but I remember having read that the new pattern cap introduced in the mid of the XIX century was indeed made of bearskin and feathers (although different in shape from the typical grenadier or fusilier bearskin cap)."

It may have been in the works but it never went through, or was one of those 90 day fashion changes that never caught on. The feathered bonnet remained combat wear until the 1870's and was retained as "home service" uniform up to the Great War. From then on it was worn by Band Members only. (I think there was a short lived attempt to widen it's use in the interwar years but I can't swear to it). The diced glengary, TOS and steel helmet then took over.

Traditions die hard in the British Army, and that goes double for Highland Regiments.

DavidI

[Amedeo]

OK David, thanks for the clarification. I know that traditions are strong in Highland Regiments, after all the only concession to the rigors of trench warfare at the start of WW1 was a khaki apron on the kilt

Bye

A.