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SC 2.0 or SC2 Poll


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I would like to do a tenative poll. If you were to lay out $25.00/$40.00 right now for an SC2 or SC 2.0 or an Editor<vote> upgraded version. With some neccessary evils, how many people would Put their Money up and backorder a copy of either release???

1 Liam is one

lets see if we can get Hubert 200 names??? Then maybe we'll give him the sort of motivation worth putting the time into a new development.. THanxs

[ November 17, 2003, 05:53 PM: Message edited by: Liam ]

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I don't have 25 bucks right now, but odds are Hubert has probably already fixed the things I don't care for.

I think he will spend the next while likely trying to please the fussier crowd.

On getting SC2 now though, I can wait. Next summer will be early enough or summer 2005.

I assume Hubert has a different form of stable income, so I am not concerned he is needing SC2 to pay any critical bills.

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That's exactly it that SC is not a big moneymaker. Another CMBO upgrade will likely net a lot more cash, when I picked up Computer Gaming World one of those wargames was advertised with a write-up. SC is something you never will hear about and is always going to be a minor title. It's going likely be a pet project of his. I don't know that SC is not more of Hubert's BrainChild though than the other Battlefront groups or how much of a share they have. It may be that he gets more from a product like this than the others. It takes more than 1 programmer to make an advanced game like CMBO usually. SC could be made by 1 but not easily. I'm likely thinking 1 year 2 years... Knowing myself the amount of work you have to dedicate to a game like this :(



We want Steak and potatoes tongue.gif

Problem is now I'm gonna have to crack open HOI or another like game in order to entertain myself as SC can't any longer hold me... Too bad there aren't more dedicated Strategic Wargame fans. If there was SC2 would be already in production phaze.<the cash, risk, time you have to dedicate into what could be a flop. Merely the popping out and distribution of the game could be counter-productive... Honestly I Think that Marketing is a huge step for SC, it needs to be done. The game is capable of making a bigger mark...Although again Risk, Money, Work> Why would a company waste their efforts on a risk when a CMBO is a garauntee ?

[ November 17, 2003, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: Liam ]

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Liam, what - I think - you're trying to say is simply not founded in reality.

SC has gotten wide media coverage when it was released (SC Review Page) , is by now being sold on shelves all over Europe, in Australia/NZ and in Japan, and we've had at least a dozen print ads in all the major gaming mags last year. But SC has been released a year ago. You don't read much about CMBB in the media these days, either, do you? smile.gif

SC2 is in development, that's an open secret, and when it's closer to completion you will see PR and marketing kick into full gear. Certainly with the proven success that SC was (and it has widely exceeded our expectations) that PR and marketing will be even stronger. Of course we could start hyping SC2 already now and place banner ads everwhere. But just because others do it doesn't mean that it works or makes sense. We're a small team and in the past we found that this is more distraction than it does good. Rest assured, you'll hear about SC2 all around the globe when it's done.

Also, SC2 development has NOTHING to do with the CM series, as both are running totally independently, so it's not like we have to choose between one or the other.


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and it has widely exceeded our expectations)
This is good, but somewhat surprising. Maybe most people don't play online (I never did till this game) or there are other sites supporting 'guilds' of SC players. But the size of the posting and playing community is rather small, at this the developers website. Or an I missing something?
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Well, the SC community certainly is different than the CM community, I am reminded of this often enough tongue.gif , and the ratio of members active on the forums vs. customers is even lower than for the CM series indeed. Why this is - your guess is as good as mine. Maybe people fire up SC for a quick round of solo play like other people would fire up Solitaire or Minesweeper? Maybe some of what has been happening on these forums - recently and in the past - is turning away people?


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is turning away people?

Shot that deer in the heart! Free discussion and open 'wild' post can be fun. But a cesspool of juvinial antics (read not funny) can be a bit much. I'm played several ppl PBEM that will not become 'active' because of too much profanity (?) and insanity, here (three ppl, I guess not that many).

Maybe, if you guys have a intern hanging around, you could give him the AA bug as a project, if MR H will allow acess to the code. :D

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Interesting... Your Tactical games definitely have the edge in production. 4 outta 5. Glad to see that Battlefront supports her Strategic series as much and I hope that it turns out to be 4-5 titles, I'll buy everyone. If it's like SC it'll have near a year of playability. Something like this has production that costs 5-20X as much with frilly graphics<I'm sure that a large portion goes to advertising and frillies, boxing. I know I still don't sell a my Utility in a box>...in fact SC is a little too addictive and although the community can be a pain in the arse...Some of these butt noses have kept me here for some reason. Beating them Primarily tongue.gif repeatedly <so probably a lot of their fustration is getting their arse beat by me tongue.gif >

I noticed a few guys from other like wargames, even over the years have popped up in this forum. We're an oldddd community Wargamers, who get blindsinded. It's almost impossible to school em... When things were going good here we had the topic filled with sooooo much good debate you couldn't find the bad. :( Sorry about that but I think Wargamers are like New Yorkers. ;)


[ November 18, 2003, 05:42 AM: Message edited by: Liam ]

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"Maybe people fire up SC for a quick round of solo play like other people would fire up Solitaire or Minesweeper? Maybe some of what has been happening on these forums - recently and in the past - is turning away people?"


To the first part yes, that's how I enjoy it most; I don't mind making personal scenarios where the AI has a lot of extra units and MPPs so it can put up a good fight. I enjoy playing six or ten moves quickly against the computer and then getting back to work (I also work at my computer). PBEM isn't my style, I lose track of what's going on in different games because most of them are at the same point and look similar. :eek:

IP isn't for me either because it's impossible to string that many consecutive hours together. Also, the few times I tried it my opponents kept sending annoying messages across, things like "That has to be the worst Sea Lion in history!" -- said the turn London fell and two turns before he surrendered. The point is, being an old tournament chess player, I don't care for kibitzing. I don't bother my opponent and expect the same in return. But the real problem is time; I don't much of it to spare in blocks, so that approach is out.

So, I'm mainly a solitaire player.

Regarding the second part, you've been incredibly permissive lately. I suspect it's a combination of three things.

(1) To dispel claims you've been quick on the draw -- something I feel you had a tendancy to be a long time back, but for the past eight months or so you've been very restrained, so I can't agree with that view.

(2) Hoping to either let it play itself out -- which I think it has -- or to at least wait till it becomes obvious that a little forcefulness is called for -- and again, I think that's also come to pass. I sympathize with your dilemma and think you've done a great job with it.

Or ...

(3) You were showing a little slack because so many of the Forum's mainstays have been involved. Once more I think you've got a hard call to make.

New people might be turned off by infantile arguments. I'm sure you remember how bad it was last year, yet Comrade, Rambo, Liam, Zappsweden, Terif, Panzer39, my good friend Kuniworth, myself and many others still got involved despite all the juvenile bickering. Many others, like Immer, Wagner, Macon and Les were already posting and the bickering hasn't caused any of them to leave.

Would the Forum be better without it? Yes. Will it ever stop? Probably not.

I remember a couple of guys who came into the fold, had nothing but bad things to say about the other members, and vanished. Who misses them? Probably no one.

Anyway, just a few scattered thoughts on the situation. I still like this Forum a lot and have very high hopes for both it's future and it's resurgence with the release of SC2.

[ November 18, 2003, 06:43 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

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Hey JJ went back a year for fun and looked over the posts on pg 64 (?). I saw your name and a lock so I just had to read it.

Top post:

I've been commenting lately that someone seemed to be tampering with my postings. This morning I found a posting I didn't make with my forum name of JerseyJohn -- it was by Jon__J__Rambo or whatever he calls himself. In it he calls me a German Lover and posts some stupid remarks referring to me as "Claus Boobie" and posting some sort of belligerent challenge about comparing w-4 forms, etc. I draw the line at personal attacks and especially personal attacks that come in the line of blatant stupidity.

Henceforth I will avoid this site.

Disgusted -- John P. Dellova

I will be sending this same message to all administrators and posting it as a farewell forum.

History repeating its self - just change the names?
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Originally posted by JerseyJohn:

[b I still like this Forum a lot and have very high hopes for both it's future and it's resurgence with the release of SC2.


I lost my hope for this forum. PPL will be scattered soon into all directions...the timeframe between this unacceptable situation and the outcome of SC2 will be to long.

One can´t spent 1 year or more just with useless discussions like in the other tread.

Fact is there is no league anymore, there is no respect anymore, there is no friendship anymore, there are no battles anymore, it seems to me the the only reason to stay in this forum for some ppl is just to insult other ppl as a result of plain frustration and burnout symptoms.

The sad thing is that not everybody of the nice guys here has the possibility to play in another league and enjoy a friendly community like myself in the "Panzerliga".

Jersey can you remeber "This is a hell of a Community, a hell of a forum"...the nice picture of Kurt?

Some bad words were exchanged but turning things to the funny side everybody could laugh about this story. Nobody was angry as finally we were all kidding...... but now i can´t laugh anymore.....this is really a MEGAHELL this forum!!


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You're right. I've always regretted that thing but don't believe in going back and changing things I originally said; if I ever did, that would be number one on my list!

That was from the First Great JJ-Rambo War; I think we had two more, but they were brief and really just border skirmishes compared to that first one.

The two of us threw a lot of very bitter insults at one another. Along the way Rambo claimed he was twelve years old. I made one of my typical scathing remarks and one of the European guys said I should be ashamed of myself for saying something so nasty to twelve year old kid! :D He had to have been the only guy on earth who didn't know it was a joke.

Anyway, in a sense I'm glad you resurrected that one at this time. If Rambo and myself were able to reconcile our differences and become friends then anyone should be able to do it.

Our exchanges were much worse than anything Terif nd Zappsweden have said to one another. We got over it and so can they.

Thanks for the nostalgia! :D

PS -- I stuck to my word and did avoid this Forum, with only 3,000 or so posts after my Grand Exit!

[ November 18, 2003, 07:08 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

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As Zappsweden said in his closing remarks in the other Thread, you really are fairly new to the place. Stick around a while longer, say three months, and you'll see everything rebuild. In a year or so I've already seen it happen several times.

The Halcyon Days were the late winter of '02, but a lot of those people were only passing through. I can remember at least twenty I really liked and an equal number I really couldn't stand, but they're all gone now. Others have come along to fill their places and the successors have been better forum members, for the most part, than their predecessors.

I'm not a big joiner, nor was I ever interested in doing anything on the internet, but this Forum really is a community. The new site is also a community but I think it will grow much more slowly, though probably with greater consistency as it draws people who have been around a while and also post at BF.

Someone else will form a league, probably next week, probably a returned Zappsweden! :D

Anyway, don't give up on things, it will all pan out and sooner rather than later.

[ November 18, 2003, 07:27 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

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To stay another 3 months in this forum? :eek: One have to be masochistic to stay here for that long time. But maybe we all are. :D

But honestly said i m member in a couple of forums but i never saw one like this one. This is really uniq. ;)

As a reward for suceeding the psycho-test one will get the membership for lifetime and another 1 year later you will get the iron cross making you a hardcoremember. tongue.gif

With less than 10 acitve members it´s not worth to form a leage....for none.

I would not bet for it but accept that if there is no league, no competition anymore, (because of a minor bug) more and more ppl will leave.

Maybe in the past things calmed, but this time it seems to be over.

But maybe as longtimevictim of this forum you know it better. :D We will see....

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Sure you can have your rematch, and you can use your AA+AF on attack mode..but be aware that i either use the same tactic or i roll with lvl 5 tanks over your AA cities....or you just simply accept a new born houserule...no placement of AF in cities and no attack with carriers out of ports. :Dtongue.gif

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There still are many playing and enjoying the game. Its the Z-league crowd that has come crashing down. Zapp did a great service for the SC community starting and running the league for a long time. Perhaps as Rambo said, it had run its course.

But dont think that everyone was invovled in the Z-league. It's the old debate of the Tcip players verses the email players. If you look back at past threads I believe there should be several good posts on this subject.

Many of us are still playing friendly games via email. We are still enjoying our friendships and still playing SC.

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