jshandorf Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 I can see this for infantry ambushes but for AT guns and tanks the range is something like 500 meters, I think. I am not sure but I know there is a limit. Why is this? Sometimes I want to ambush out to 750m+. Why can't I? Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 It will also have a limited life. Ambush markers are out for CM2 and covered arcs are in. But the covered arcs also might have a range function also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Username: It will also have a limited life. Ambush markers are out for CM2 and covered arcs are in. But the covered arcs also might have a range function also.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> IIRC the covered arc has a user-defined maximum engagement range. Don't remember seeing anything one way or another about whether there might also be game-imposed max range limits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 The limit was put in place to prevent, in theory, some potential gamey behavior. However, on balance it was probably not a good decision. As Lewis stated, Ambush markers are already out of the game. Covered Arcs are in. There is no range limitation, not even one that is tied to max weapon range. Just easier to program the thing that way Since putting a Covered Arc out to 5000m doesn't mean a SMG unit can shoot that far, there really is no harm in not having the range capped by weapon max range. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jshandorf Posted July 26, 2001 Author Share Posted July 26, 2001 Thanks for the response, Steve. Now... Fix it or do somefink! Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Time Software: The limit was put in place to prevent, in theory, some potential gamey behavior. However, on balance it was probably not a good decision. As Lewis stated, Ambush markers are already out of the game. Covered Arcs are in. There is no range limitation, not even one that is tied to max weapon range. Just easier to program the thing that way Since putting a Covered Arc out to 5000m doesn't mean a SMG unit can shoot that far, there really is no harm in not having the range capped by weapon max range. Steve<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Not sure I understand this, Steve -- are you saying that the player cannot specify a maximum engagement range when using the covered arc command? That would make it quite difficult to accomplish an ambush at short range, wouldn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Leland, the player can specify a max range. However, the system will not restrict that range to the max range of the unit's weapon. As I said, if you set the range for the Covered Arc out to 5000m for a SMG unit, CM will not slap you around for it It just won't make any difference until an enemy unit comes into around 250m or so range. So the player could have made the Covered Arc's max at 250m or 5000m and there would be no difference. If you want to make a short range ambush, you would simply set the Covered Arc to the range you had in mind. Say... 25m for example. You can also make the arc any shape you like, so in fact the area covered might be 25m on the extreme left and 5000m on the extreme right. In case people have trouble picturing this, a Covered Arc is simply an area bounded by three points. One point is the unit, the other two points are variable points depending on where you click. You can make a narrow cone shape at a great distance, or a very wide area at short range. Great flexibility and very easy to use. You'll all love it Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Ok; I just wanted to be sure that when you said "There is no range limitation" you didn't mean the player couldn't specify one if desired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 This is going to be cool. Imagine setting up a U shaped ambush and having an enemy waltz into the middle. He will trip off ambush fire if he goes left or right. Will all heights be targetted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rleete Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 Uh, the short answer would be 'cause that's the way BTS coded it! Okay, enough with the smart-a$$ answers. Here's my take: The entire intent of an ambush is to hit so unexpectedly and so hard that the target is either dead, or completely dazed by the attack. Killed, broken or routed are the only acceptable outcomes. So, to ambush out to anywhere near the effective limit of a weapons range defeats the purpose. Sure, that AT gun can hit at 2000m or more, but you want that first (and possibly only) shot to count. You hold off until a kill is almost a given. You want it to be at point blank ranges for the most shock value. You also hold off until the unit(s) are in the middle ground between cover, so it is a toss up as to what direction to go. Adds to the confusion, and any delay keeps that unit in the kill zone for that much longer. So, the real reason is probably that BTS figured you wouldn't need that much range, and just set it as a percentage of overall range of the weapon itself. Edited fer speling [ 07-26-2001: Message edited by: R_Leet ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Time Software: Leland, the player can specify a max range. However, the system will not restrict that range to the max range of the unit's weapon. As I said, if you set the range for the Covered Arc out to 5000m for a SMG unit, CM will not slap you around for it It just won't make any difference until an enemy unit comes into around 250m or so range. So the player could have made the Covered Arc's max at 250m or 5000m and there would be no difference. If you want to make a short range ambush, you would simply set the Covered Arc to the range you had in mind. Say... 25m for example. You can also make the arc any shape you like, so in fact the area covered might be 25m on the extreme left and 5000m on the extreme right. In case people have trouble picturing this, a Covered Arc is simply an area bounded by three points. One point is the unit, the other two points are variable points depending on where you click. You can make a narrow cone shape at a great distance, or a very wide area at short range. Great flexibility and very easy to use. You'll all love it Steve<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I am already drooling. WWB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUSSIEJEFF Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 The CM2 ambush function you have described sounds GREAT Steve!! I'd also like to add my interest in getting a response to Username's question of whether all heights will be shown within a unit's allocated ambush arc, or just the elevations that can be seen by direct line of sight?? Otherwise I imagine having to switch between line of sight mode and ambush arc mode might be a tad cumbersome when setting up numerous units for a largish ambush?? KUTGW in the meantime guys! AJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 It would also be nice if troops would just autorotate when you give the arc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 Lewis, <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>This is going to be cool. Imagine setting up a U shaped ambush and having an enemy waltz into the middle. He will trip off ambush fire if he goes left or right.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Correct. One problem with the Ambush Maker system in CMBO is that if you put the marker out to point, only that point was covered. Very difficult to cover a general area. Now you can have all three squads of a platoon, for example, be ready and waiting for any enemy unit along into a 200m wide, 50m deep area. This feature was primarily designed for lanes of fire, but once we got thinking about it Covered Arcs were a great replacement to the current Ambush Marker system. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Will all heights be targetted?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yes. It is anything in the space the Covered Arc overlaps. Of course, LOS is still required for it to be triggered. Meaning you can't be on the far side of a hill and extend a Covered Arc to the other side and expect to react if an enemy unit moves there out of direct sight. I think units already auto rotate to face the center of the arc, but I am not sure. I know with tanks the turret will turn automatically, thus leaving the hull facing up to the player. Currently this is not possible to do in CMBO. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Time Software: You can also make the arc any shape you like, so in fact the area covered might be 25m on the extreme left and 5000m on the extreme right.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh cool! :cool: This sounds very handy. The next thing I would like would be for the unit in question to spot enemy units more readily within its covered arc. Think that would be possible? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Time Software: I know with tanks the turret will turn automatically, thus leaving the hull facing up to the player.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Way cool!!! (And about time too, if I may say so.) Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt. Ryan Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Time Software: I know with tanks the turret will turn automatically, thus leaving the hull facing up to the player. Currently this is not possible to do in CMBO. Steve<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> That should make a lot of people happy since there were so many requests for this not too long ago. Another great feature! Edit: People like Michael [ 07-27-2001: Message edited by: Pvt. Ryan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcm1947 Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Big Time Software: I know with tanks the turret will turn automatically, thus leaving the hull facing up to the player. Currently this is not possible to do in CMBO. Steve _____________________________________________ Sounds like I just got one of my big wishes. Man, this will be really great! Now if I could just get my other one, but you probably don't know her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Time Software: The limit was put in place to prevent, in theory, some potential gamey behavior. However, on balance it was probably not a good decision. As Lewis stated, Ambush markers are already out of the game. Covered Arcs are in. There is no range limitation, not even one that is tied to max weapon range. Just easier to program the thing that way Since putting a Covered Arc out to 5000m doesn't mean a SMG unit can shoot that far, there really is no harm in not having the range capped by weapon max range. Steve<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hey, cool - I posted this idea some weeks ago. I didn't expected that it was already planned for CM2! Maybe it's a good idea if BTS post the planned engine changes or a general info page about CM2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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