Glubokii Boy Posted February 24, 2012 Share Posted February 24, 2012 Hello... Sorry to bring this up again ! but the lack of triggers in this game makes me sad... I only play single player because of the limited time i have avaliable to spend by my computer...In a H2H game my oponent would not get many turns sent/week wich i think they would soon find boring. What i would like to do is to play a good AI game for an hour or two when i have some free time. (maybe one evening a week) but i'm sorry to say that the singleplayer option for this game is not working. An example: Me playing the attacker (attacking a village): The scernario designer has deployed the AI units evenly across the map to defend the whole village (not something i know)...I decide on a left flank attack and pretty much wipe out the defenders on that flank. The enemy in the center and on the right flank do NOTHING ! they just sit there watching their buddies to the left get slaughtered. On the right flank the enemy have 3 STUGs ready for the fight. While the left flank is getting totaly destroyed they do NOTHING ! The scenario designer was guessing that the player would attack on the right flank so he prepared a supprise. REINFORCEMENTS arriving on the right flank and doing a counterattack. I have no units on the right flank (i'm on the left) so that enemy counterattack will find no targets and result in NOTHING ! Meanwhile i attack the rest of the village being defended by totaly STATIC defenders. Thoose STUGs still do NOTHING ! If the editor had a good set of triggers the battle mentioned above and all others could be made very intresting with an active AI oponent reacting to every situation in a very good way instead of doing NOTHING ! I'm sorry to be sounding overly negative but i had VERY high hopes for this game. I still consider CMBB to be one of the best computergames ever made. I would recomend having a look at Eagle Dynamics DCS series (A10 and Blackshark) if you're unavare of it and how that editor works. Having an editor with simular triggersystem in CMBN would be great allowing for amazing single player scenarios to be made. The fact that almost no single player scenario have been made by the community during the last couple of months i feel shows that something is very wrong. My oppinion is that a good triggersystem ought to have higher priority then the commonwelth module as well as other modules to come... Again...i appologize for being negative but i really want to like this game but right now i can't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Errmm - there's been several community made scenarios released. In fact it looks to be around several a week (all quality ones) - check out the repository. Re triggers - it's been talked about for sure and BFC have stated it's on the 'to do' list so it will make it in there. If playing QB you can get odd things happening as the AI Plans by the very nature of the QB set-up are more generic. Try one of the user made scenarios and you will more than likely find that the scenario designer can ensure the AI gives you a run for your money. If looking for ideas why not start a thread asking for recommended single player scenarios. I'm sure you'll get enough to keep you going? Cheery! George 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 If you play a QB the 'one-size-fits-all' movement orders don't exactly show off the game in the best light. An experienced scenario designer working at the top of his game can really give you a run for your money, though. The best examples of hand-built scenarios I've seen have mostly been CMSF module-related. But that's only because they've had years to build up an impressive cache of 3rd party scenarios. Imagine how many CM:BN scenarios we'll have in two years! Actually, we're just a few days away from the scenario list perhaps doubling(?) in size with the arrival of Brit module. I'm the *only* person I know who is dubious about triggers. The scenario designer would soon lose control of events as trigger commands start cascading across the map. But nobody at BFC is listening to me. Everybody wants triggers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paper Tiger Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Poor RepsolCBR. The first three respondents to his OP are all beta testers Don't worry, mate. We all want to see AI triggers in the game and I really hope that BFC's next title will have them. There are workarounds to create the illusion of an AI that responds to the human player's moves but thats just pure guesswork on the part of the designer. I think somebody once described the current AI scripting as one huge WEGO turn that spans the entire game. That's about right. Triggers will really unleash the Single Player game, that's for sure as they are a complete waste of time for the H2H player. I also think the majority of new scenarios being uploaded to the Repository recently have been almost exclusively for H2H play. It's a simple fact that it's much easier to design H2H missions than it is to design missions for Single Player. A mission designed for Single Play should have at least three AI plans for the side the missions is designed to play against, ideally five. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 25, 2012 Author Share Posted February 25, 2012 Hello... "Poor RepsolCBR. The first three respondents to his OP are all beta testers" - That is perfectly ok. I never ment for this tread to become a 'complain contest'...I just had to get this of my chest... "Errmm - there's been several community made scenarios released. In fact it looks to be around several a week (all quality ones) - check out the repository." - Maybe i'm looking in the wrong place but i can't find that many in the repository. Less then 10 since begining of december and several are H2H only. "There are workarounds to create the illusion of an AI that responds to the human player's moves but thats just pure guesswork on the part of the designer." - This is what i mean. If the designer GUESS right during the entire scenario then the mission will be a good one and fun to play. If he guess wrong the game will be far less fun. A VERY big improvment would be to not force the designer to GUESS what will happen but to have the AI react to events taking place during the mission and act acordingly. With a good triggersystem that should be possible and it would elevate CMBN from a OK game to an OUTSTANDING game with no competition. "An experienced scenario designer working at the top of his game can really give you a run for your money, though." Yes ! I have played a number of scenarios that is very well made and i understand that a lot of work have gone into them. My hat goes of to the scenario designers. But still...I often feel that something is missing...'if only thoose guys could have regrouped to helped out over here'...'Why did the enemy not send his armour to help out'...''what are thoose guys doing over there'...That said. I still enjoy playing many of the scenarios but the final details to make the game experience perfect is not there. It could be ! This game has amazing possibilities but i feel triggers is a must. "Re triggers - it's been talked about for sure and BFC have stated it's on the 'to do' list so it will make it in there" - Yes i understand that and that is great. I just wish that the trigger implementation would be bumped up on the 'to do list'. From looking through this forum i get the feeling that triggers is years away. The comming modules are most certanly good and will be fun to play and i will buy them but i feel that other things are more important than new units...Triggers for one. "I'm the *only* person I know who is dubious about triggers. The scenario designer would soon lose control of events as trigger commands start cascading across the map." - That is always a risk. A small one though i think. when triggers is implemented there will be some time of trial and error to find the right balance of how much scripting the games can take. The possibilities will be amazing however and i'm sure that a great number of 'perfect' missions will be made. I also think that a good triggersystem will make scenariodesigning alot easier. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 I'm the *only* person I know who is dubious about triggers. The scenario designer would soon lose control of events as trigger commands start cascading across the map. I am sure that triggers could be used to create a mess and a disaster:) But they could also be used for good. Consider the OP's example. Instead of the AI guessing on a right flank attack they could instead have defenders left centre and right and hold a mobile reserve. Once the attack starts and the defenders start taking casualties (or similar trigger) the mobile reserve could react to that and move into position to defend against the attacker. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wodin Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 There are alot of great scenarios out there for SP. I play SP only, there are also some great campaigns. I never play QB, ever. A QB will never give you the challenge a well made scenario will. I have noticed alot of HtH scenarios have been released recently though. Still I've still plenty of scenarios to get through and then all the CW ones aswell. I suggest you ask around for some recommended scenarios\campaigns. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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