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No insult Zapp, really, none, but beating Terif back then was (and I'm going out on a limb here) much easier than it is now. Between now and then, Terif's had, what, at least 800+ games extra experience. It's a different ball game now.

Ok people, that's it, I've had enough! All said with a good sense of humour, you think I'm so 'lucky'. It's NOT pure luck. Yes, luck is a factor, but it's not the only factor. I put up an excellent defense of france this game, and Terif chose to go through the south, I didn't force him. He chose to be uncautious, and I made him pay every step. I, like most some others, choose to opt for a shorter game for a multitude of reasons: 1. Playing Terif = playing Deep Blue, why make it any any any ANY easier for him, just for the sake of a longer game? I want to win against him, I have always since I started playing. I don't use any ultra cheap methods, but legal and proven tactics. The only thing I've done is fine-tune some strategies for defending france. 2. France is 60% the game, so losing badly in france = losing game most of the time, ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY against Terif. Why bother continuing for 15+ hours when I've already lost? I'm just not one of those people. I play for fun BUT I also play for the win (especially against Terif 3. I've lost against Terif 10+ times now, most of them mini-games (which I know he hates, sorry for that), but it's because I'm trying to learn from him. I can't really learn from a game if I'm way behind in France, because the odds are already stacked against me. Terif can't lose as Axis post-france, UNLESS you've done what I just did. And the position in this game is what I've been trying to do to him every single time we've played. He's just really really really good at what he does, and I was just trying to mirror him. No matter what is said, this game isn't cheap, or unrealistic. I've lost a lot too, and feared a Sealion, but I also knew around late '40 that it would still take a LONG time for him to get to Paris, and I would make it as long as possible. Sealion was a threat, but it was almost 42, so UK threw everything, incl. the kitchen sink. Did it pay off in the long run? I think so. I HOPE so ;P, October 41 Paris + 8500+ mpp for Russia should be insta-victory. His only loss with Axis, that's pretty insane. Terif's been playing this for 3 1/2 years now and never lost as axis in 1000+ games, so it's cool that i'm the first.

It's true, the solution is to move the german AF's back a bit, one or 2 hexes. That leaves the LC troops open to attack more however. But it seems that losing a german AF early is usually a very bad scenario for Axis, so better to be cautious.

2 things: 1. Axis, when handled by a good good player, is virtually unbeatable post-france. 2. Allies, when played by a good good player, can crush Axis in France, or at least heavily heavily delay them. Post-France is much harder. = Allies should invest heavily in defending France. Any losses can/may/will be offset by Axis losses, and a much stronger USSR.

In case some of you haven't noticed, I'm not a huge fan of AARing. In this case, though, it needs doing. It seems that Terif will lose his 1st game as Axis, ever. Does that mean he's getting senile? No, that means he got unlucky. However, I think every player who has ever played him has gotten lucky at one time or another. But in spite of any luck the Allies have gotten, Terif has simply shown consistently that he knows what to do, and brought every single Axis game to a victorious conclusion. But not yesterday! Let the AAR begin: Late '39: - Warsaw captured turn 3, but Poland survives until turn 4. - 3 BB's and 1 carrier move towards Denmark. Within 5 turns, Baltic fleet is sunk. Denmark is captured turn 4. - 1st Allied turn, moved UK corp next to the Dutch corp, 2 hexes NE of Brussels. This way, the corp can land and attack german AF in Hamburg turn 2. - UK buys Monty, puts AFs in London, and hex NE of London. - Fr Fleet goes to hunt for subs, and destroys them by turn 4. - Terif attacks the corp on the boat with all 3 AF's instead of attacking LC (corp sinks). - Allies attack LC turn 2, take it with the French, and simultaneously destroy german AF in Hamburg. It had to intercept London attack, and got intercepted when attacking the corp boat too, so its weak and I attack it with fr AF (who's in the maginot middle hex as a spotter) a carrier and the UK AF NE of London. AF dies, and Terif only left with 2 AF's. Good thing is that Italy is entering the war, because I had opted to destroy the german AF instead of opping fr air to malta. Early '40 - Terif moves heavy forces into the South, into Italy. - Monty and the 2 AF's move around the Paris area. They are shortly joined by an additional 2 UK armies. The first UK army is sent to defend Marseilles. A french tank is built and defends the mountain hex north of marseilles. Eventually both units entrench to 4. - French build no Billote, and concentrate solely on corps, except for the tank. - Germans try repeatedly break through the mountain hex held by a corp NE of marseilles. It takes around 5 turns to take the hex. - Italians take out Egypt, Beirut, Malta and Algiers in quick succession, and most of the UK/French fleet that wander into the west med. A bad mistake of mine was not to concentrate all the fleet together, and Terif picks off ship by ship. Mid '40 - Most of the rest of the year is spent by Terif trying to break through the south. French losses are quite light, and only the occasional corp is lost. Terif breaks through with Panzers and Italian corps later on, but both panzers and around 4-5 italian corps die as well. Additionally, another German AF and Italian AF are killed while attacking the UK army in Marseilles (he takes it at least tho). Another german army dies later on, along with a few german corps. All this while of course, UK AF's are intercepting, and helping to make counter attacks. This continues until October 41 when Paris is occupied. Before it falls however, another german army dies on the fr mine, and another italian corp west of paris. UK holds brest and for 1 turn, Brussels. Final losses by October 41 for UK: 1 AF (killed itself counterattacking german army) 1 UK army 1 UK corp entire fr army 4 ships left, all but one badly damaged. Few mpps left, and no chits Germany hasn't conquered any minors yet, and russia is in the high 80's%, Terif must attack next turn, or at least the turn thereafter. It's Feb 42 on the last turn we played, and Romania joined only the turn before, and Yugoslavia hasn't revolted yet, so german attack on Russia will be very very weak. Only 4 german AF's, and 1 italian. No research detected at all from german side, 0 in jets, 0 in LR. Usa is at ~60%, so when he declares war on russia, it goes up another bit too. Can Terif win this one? If not, it would mean a milestone in SC history, if anyone cares hehe. Only Terif could have made it this far, but far enough it is not. Russia and Germany will be duking it out for the next while, because UK is too weak, and USA isn't in yet. I estimate around 10 turn, at the end of 42 before the Allies get seriously involved, but Russia is pretty much making the same mpps as Italy/Germany combined. Finland might join the axis tho, because USA isn't involved. It's an exciting game, and I haven't figured out what to do with Russia exactly, but it seems no matter what I choose to do (possible attacks on Finland, Sweden, Poland, Romania, Turkey/Iraq) I'll succeed everywhere. Germany is just too weak.

Sorry all, this is supposed to be on the other side, didn't realize i was posting here. I'll copy paste. If an admin wants to remove this post, please do.

In case some of you haven't noticed, I'm not a huge fan of AARing. In this case, though, it needs doing. It seems that Terif will lose his 1st game as Axis, ever. Does that mean he's getting senile? No, that means he got unlucky. However, I think every player who has ever played him has gotten lucky at one time or another. But in spite of any luck the Allies have gotten, Terif has simply shown consistently that he knows what to do, and brought every single Axis game to a victorious conclusion. But not yesterday! Let the AAR begin: Late '39: - Warsaw captured turn 3, but Poland survives until turn 4. - 3 BB's and 1 carrier move towards Denmark. Within 5 turns, Baltic fleet is sunk. Denmark is captured turn 4. - 1st Allied turn, moved UK corp next to the Dutch corp, 2 hexes NE of Brussels. This way, the corp can land and attack german AF in Hamburg turn 2. - UK buys Monty, puts AFs in London, and hex NE of London. - Fr Fleet goes to hunt for subs, and destroys them by turn 4. - Terif attacks the corp on the boat with all 3 AF's instead of attacking LC (corp sinks). - Allies attack LC turn 2, take it with the French, and simultaneously destroy german AF in Hamburg. It had to intercept London attack, and got intercepted when attacking the corp boat too, so its weak and I attack it with fr AF (who's in the maginot middle hex as a spotter) a carrier and the UK AF NE of London. AF dies, and Terif only left with 2 AF's. Good thing is that Italy is entering the war, because I had opted to destroy the german AF instead of opping fr air to malta. Early '40 - Terif moves heavy forces into the South, into Italy. - Monty and the 2 AF's move around the Paris area. They are shortly joined by an additional 2 UK armies. The first UK army is sent to defend Marseilles. A french tank is built and defends the mountain hex north of marseilles. Eventually both units entrench to 4. - French build no Billote, and concentrate solely on corps, except for the tank. - Germans try repeatedly break through the mountain hex held by a corp NE of marseilles. It takes around 5 turns to take the hex. - Italians take out Egypt, Beirut, Malta and Algiers in quick succession, and most of the UK/French fleet that wander into the west med. A bad mistake of mine was not to concentrate all the fleet together, and Terif picks off ship by ship. Mid '40 - Most of the rest of the year is spent by Terif trying to break through the south. French losses are quite light, and only the occasional corp is lost. Terif breaks through with Panzers and Italian corps later on, but both panzers and around 4-5 italian corps die as well. Additionally, another German AF and Italian AF are killed while attacking the UK army in Marseilles (he takes it at least tho). Another german army dies later on, along with a few german corps. All this while of course, UK AF's are intercepting, and helping to make counter attacks. This continues until October 41 when Paris is occupied. Before it falls however, another german army dies on the fr mine, and another italian corp west of paris. UK holds brest and for 1 turn, Brussels. Final losses by October 41 for UK: 1 AF (killed itself counterattacking german army) 1 UK army 1 UK corp entire fr army 4 ships left, all but one badly damaged. Few mpps left, and no chits Germany hasn't conquered any minors yet, and russia is in the high 80's%, Terif must attack next turn, or at least the turn thereafter. It's Feb 42 on the last turn we played, and Romania joined only the turn before, and Yugoslavia hasn't revolted yet, so german attack on Russia will be very very weak. Only 4 german AF's, and 1 italian. No research detected at all from german side, 0 in jets, 0 in LR. Usa is at ~60%, so when he declares war on russia, it goes up another bit too. Can Terif win this one? If not, it would mean a milestone in SC history, if anyone cares hehe. Only Terif could have made it this far, but far enough it is not. Russia and Germany will be duking it out for the next while, because UK is too weak, and USA isn't in yet. I estimate around 10 turn, at the end of 42 before the Allies get seriously involved, but Russia is pretty much making the same mpps as Italy/Germany combined. Finland might join the axis tho, because USA isn't involved. It's an exciting game, and I haven't figured out what to do with Russia exactly, but it seems no matter what I choose to do (possible attacks on Finland, Sweden, Poland, Romania, Turkey/Iraq) I'll succeed everywhere. Germany is just too weak.

Hey! I didn't give up! I hope you saved our game, i only left cuz my g/f was really, and i mean really, bugging me. We gonna finish that game, so take me off that list (for now

Was a great game. I headed right for Berlin tho. What'd I build for Russia, like 15 AF's, no joke, NO JOKE. Invested 5 chits in jet (only jet), and got 2 levels up in 3 turns. Germans had no chance. Koenigsberg was captured turn 2, warsaw turn 3. Was swarming anything (tanks, corps) through every gap on the german ostfront. I drove UK into the ground tho, and look what happens, it dies. But, I hedged my bet that the USSR would do the dirty work for me, and, it did! GG Liam, look forward to the next one.

Sry guys, didn't even realize there was an AAR. Game was tough from the beginning, we'll continue it later

Hey ppl, finally got high speed at home, so if anyone's looking for a game, just buzz me. And I'm no. 4 only? wtf? i though DH rated me no 2?? Seriously, ratings suck, and it's all just fantasy on this thread. First, i'm no. 2, and you all suck. Yeah, you too, and you, and YOU. Damn, has anybody made it past france when im allies? Don't think in the last 10 games... but i've really brushed up my axis game, so if anyone wants to prove something...

Hey, wanted to ask if anyone here is playing GG's WaW? if anybody is, let's get an old-skool SC crowd to play WaW while we wait for SC2

REALLY

Yo, I'm in for sure. What, we've only tried to have around 5 tourneys so far with zero success Like to actually have something going here.

I'm working this week 11am-8pm, i'll be free after 8. I'll stick around work after 8 if ur around, we'll play a few. I have new opening moves for the allies, very strong stuff here Need a victim

Was a fun read guys. TIME

I'm dying to get my hands on this game..... dying..... *croak*

Game is almost at an end... how many german units have been ground up? I lost count around 4 turns ago... but it's alot! i expect surrender soon.

easy come, easy go! polish 10str corp reoccupies warsaw from koenigsberg. moved a corp one hex to much east (my mouse is slippery

Hehe... Pol Brkthru...Subs a movin', nothin else out a the ordinaree...

I'm in, just need an appointment. Shoot, we shouldve had a tourney like this a long time ago

Yep, ditto on Cosmin's words. I still play, but it's actually out of habit. JJ, don't tell me you play the dorky AI? If I don't have to think while playing a game, then it's no game for me! The AI bites big time, as it does in almost all wargames. I played Korsun Pocket the 1st time, as Axis, and got a decisive victory against the AI. The game is awesome, like SC, but it's really meant to play against others. Shady reload types?! Hehe. Ok, Rambo and I did play a game 2 weeks ago, and I sincerely had a communication problem, so we had to reload one turn. I played the turn different and screwed him over. Oh well, i'm bad. But, i must say, that was the first and only time i've ever even reloaded a turn! I was too lazy to email him my autosave, and he didn't care either. Whatever, doesn't make me a sneaky cheater by a long shot, but I did take advantage. The last 3 months I've played cos almost exclusively, plus a smattering of games with Sombra and Rambo. Haven't played Terif recently, but who likes playing games they know they can't win?! Hehe... however, once SC2 comes out...

May 25th, Paris taken, all UK units stranded, Cos concedes. Was pretty much a by-the-book attack through LC. 3rd game coming up...

Turn 4: - took blood hex, fr army destroyed - Subs almost gone, but BB heavily damaged, and one CL lightly - Poland + Denmark surrendered turns 2 and 3 respectively - Will mighty german wehrmacht be unstoppable?!

- Allies attack Ireland - Pols counter attack, do decent damage - Fr line of armies formed... - Denmark reinforces