Nidan1

20% done, Stalingrad here I come!!!

Amazin' stuff, BFC should be congratulated.

You guys are a sneaky lot!

That's exactly what I was thinking, BFC already has us on a string, they want a whole new army of newbies. I keep forgetting that they are in business, and want to make some money.

I'm thinking we might get a 1941 or 1942 battle, so we can drool over all those gray MK111s. Then the other one might be a 1945 when the end was near for the Germans, and all the SU100s and SU152s can roll across the landscape. Cant wait to find out.

OK, we will have to schedule one.

Live long and prosper Nidan1 Live long and prosper Bruno Weiss. Perhaps one day we can take out our frustrations on each other in a TCP/IP battle or two? :cool: [ August 31, 2002, 11:11 AM: Message edited by: Nidan1 ]

I see we are still at it. Here is my final contribution to this thread; In war people die. Americans are still divided over our involvement in Vietnam. The Vietnamese still love us even to this day. America is the biggest guy on the block, we are an easy target. Everything we are talking about is now history, we cant change it or re-write it no matter how hard we try. Nationalism is a fact of life on this planet, no matter how hard people try to deny it. This is a computer game forum, and tomorrow we'll all be too busy refreshing the browser to even think about this anymore. I believe that one day all men will finally learn to live together.

Funze wrote: I'm amazed that Nidan1 would acknowledge that countless Vietnamese were killed and then say "The problem with American involvement in the war was that we had no strategy to win." So it would have been okay to slaughter millions if it resulted in victory? ----------------------------------------- The whole idea that the U.S. was trying to liberate people or protect them from aggression, while at the same time its soldiers and officers routinely referred, and politicians like McCain still refer, to the same people as gooks, and treated them as subhumans who could be napalmed, bombed, shot, raped, whatever at will.... ------------------------------------------------ I take offense to the fact that you equate my statement as condoning the killing and raping, etc. of the Vietnamese. Unfortunately for mankind, war is sometimes used as a tool of national policy. When I said we had no strategy to win, I was referring to the fact that when any nation embarks on the use of force, for whatever reason or perceived goal, it better have some kind of plan to win. How many more people would have been killed or maimed in the Persian Gulf if the coalition had gone in half assed and fought over the dessert for three years instead of three months. The tragedy for all concerned as far as Vietnam is concerned, is that we started out with a noble purpose, but allowed it to become perverted due to indecision and faulty strategy. Killing is never a good thing, and no country is immune from excesses in wartime. I think its time to let this discussion go. [ August 30, 2002, 07:58 PM: Message edited by: Nidan1 ]

Good, I'm glad. Can we get the CMBB Demo now!!

The problem with American involvement in the war was that we had no strategy to win. We sacrificed 56,000 young Americans and countless Vietnamese, and then we just left. As a participant I am still glad I served, but now in 2002 I am disappointed that we didnt do a better job. [ August 30, 2002, 06:45 PM: Message edited by: Nidan1 ]

We have to understand how the Vietnam situation fell into the USA's lap in the first place. After WWII Ho Chi Minh was looking to create a unified state governed by the Vietnamese people. Instead of allowing the Vietnamese to develop their own country, the Americans allowed the French to re-occupy their former colonial holdings in SE Asia. Once the Vietnamese Nationalists realized that America and the West had allowed the former colonizers to come back in, they aligned themselves with the Chinese (whom they truly hated) and the Russians, because they saw that as a way to offset the Western powers. Because Ho Chi Minh was now seen to be a communist, America and the West could do nothing more than support France. (Remember the Domino Theory). When the French were defeated by the Viet Minh in 1954, the Western Powers stepped in again and called for a partition of Vietnam between the Communist North and the Democratic South. Thousands of Northerners were allowed to go to the South, if they didnt want to live under the Communist rule. Among those thousands were people that would soon create the Viet Cong. Eisenhower and then Kennedy continued to prop up regimes in the South, and an ever increasing number of American advisors flooded the country to train the South Vietnamese Army. After the Gulf of Tonkin incident widespread powers were given to Lyndon Johnson allowing him to deploy ever increasing amounts of American troops to S Vietnam, until finally the North Vietnamese sent regular troops to the South to prop up the Viet Cong. So here is the rub about who "invaded" who. The Vietnamese communists, both North and South considered their military action to be a war of unification and to rid their country of foreigners. America was so afraid of the "Domino Theory" that it would do anything to block communist wars of liberation anywhere on the globe. So actually America was the foreign Army preventing the unification of a sovereign country. We can go on and on here. This issue has consumed an entire generation, and it contiues to do so to this day. Hence these posts. I am a Vietnam Veteran and looking back on it now through the eyes of maturity and history, I feel that America should have stayed out of Vietnam, or at least withdrawn earlier before more lives were lost. I think America at the time thought it a noble cause, but I too think that the NVA thought they were doing the right thing as well. Its all in the history books now. [ August 30, 2002, 04:40 PM: Message edited by: Nidan1 ]

Go ahead be a man download it!!!

I was a decent movie, as historically correct as Hollywierd can make it. It was a battle against elemensts of the 1st Cavalry Division, and three regiments of North Vietnamese Regular Infantry,who were based in the Chu Pong Massiff, there were no VC around. It was the first major battle of the American version of the Vietnam War, between American troops and NVA Regulars. The North Vietnamese discovered that the overwhelming power of American artillery and close air support would force them to limit major attacks, and to stick as close as they could to American units to negate that power. Gen Giap called it "grabbing the enemy by the belt" The next major battles between Americans and NVA took place the following year, when two full divisions of NVA crossed the DMZ and dispersed in the northern provinces, the summer of 1966 saw major battles across the DMZ between the Marines and elements of the 324B and 324C North Vietnamese Divisions. The NVA had refined their "by the belt" tactics by then, and there were a series of vicious close in battles throughout that summer. As for Mel Gibson, he's a good actor, whatever his politics are.

I think the previous two posters may be on to something. I cant speak for the Russian Urrah! I know modern Marines shout something similar to Oorah!, but I am a Marine Corps Veteran of Vietnam and we never shouted anything other than stuff like "Godamn I hate this MFing Crotch" or "help me Mommy" I guess maybe "Urrah" or "OOrah" gives you more confidence then shouting "oh **** I;m gonna die!!" :eek:

What about the Uzbekistanis, Ukrainians, Georgians, Azerbaijanis, etc?</font>

I really like it when the briefings are written with a story line. One that not only gives you a feel for the situation, but immerses you in the situation surrounding the battle or op that you will be playing. Too much information is not good, but statements like; "American recon units have been probing our positions near the crossroads" or something in that vein give you a realistic feel for the battle and also a hint as to where contact might commence. Due to the fact that battles and ops in CMBB are planned to be in a larger battle area, a good briefing that immerses you in the situation will be all the more important.

I'm game, E-Mail the .CMB file to me and I will try it out.

I'm sure when the demo comes out, that there will be a rule in there on how to handle a "debarquement"

So if ParaBellum's statement is true regarding the French, then either no one edited the article on CMBB or they really dont remember when D-Day was,(which I find hard to believe) or they really dont know what they were writing about in the review, which would just indicate shoddy business practices. In any case, I'm glad I can order the game directly from BFC, and not have to deal with "Euro Quirks" :cool:

Do you think it could also could be interpreted as "ending"? That would explain a lot, and would also renew my admiration for the French.

until the landing of 1945 :confused: Whats really scary is the French cant remember when D-Day took place????? :eek:

A loverly little story, probably something we have all experienced at one time or another. What can really be an eye opener is playing a head to head game with someone who really know how to play this thing All of those freaky liitle quirks that you mention are actually designed to work that way. Our little CM fantsy world with little manevolent moving things and shooting things is actually a pretty damned good representation of the horrors of the WWII battlefield, as actually experienced by our fathers and grandfathers. CM can be a little piece of hell sometimes if you really think about it. One of mans darker endeavors, but which sometimes brings out in men all those hidden things we all dont like talking about. Getting too serious here, please dont pile on me guys, just found freaky old man's little story intriguing.

I think we are all getting a little punchy with anticipation of the CMBB release. Here's another wish list request in the "what I'd like to see category." What about the MP44 that was fitted with a curved barrel adaptor to shoot around corners? Wouldnt it be great to have squads of Infantry 44 or 45 hiding behind buildings mowing down squads of advancing Russian Shock Infantry. By the way the US Army Ordnance Museum in Maryland has one on display. Interesting adaptation based on German experience fighting in urban conditions. :cool:

Rob, Sent you private E Mail last night, but will post here also. Snow Warriors: Loads back to desktop. Ready for the Fray: Locks up game. Stand of the Strong: works fine, fun battle. This was as of last night, I know you took the games down for awhile and then reposted them. Still seems to be a problem here