HMG from Saving Private Ryan

[Dietrich]

I don't mind the close-range urban use of a FlaK 38, which may not or may seem within the boundaries of plausibility/realistic-ness (depending on how many combat accounts one has read). I do mind the comprehensive and unrealistic non-usage of the multiple MG-34s/MG-42s which the German infantry in that scene were carrying.

Of course, in WW2 movies oftentimes the GIs have an unrealistically high proportion of Tommy guns (cf. Miracle at St. Anna, in which most of the main GI protagonists have Tommy guns, rather than, say, one Tommy gun and the rest M1 Garands), whereas the Krauts have an unrealistically high proportion of MP40s yet make relatively little use of their MGs.

And in BoB, many of the Easy Company guys' grenades had <1-second fuses. (Or were they just that bad-ass that they often let a grenade cook-off before tossing it in? =P) Whereas in SPR, none of the potato-mashers got cooked off, so they could be thrown back the way they came.

"Quick, lets retreat across a marsh"

And then there's:

"It's a whole other company!"

"So? They're just charging into the open, and even if they have any MGs they aren't using 'em..."

[Squatdog]

Use of a Flak 38 in an urban close support role is entirely plausible (although obviously not from pointblank range as in the movie).

Bringing an open-topped Marder to the fight? No.

[Arm505]

Also, the three rules of portraying fights against Germans - there are always boatloads of them, they all seem to have zero plan or tactical sense, ie they're just mobile targets for the heroic allies, and they must be made to seem evil somehow (merely being the 'enemy' isn't enough) - witness the odd knifefight with the Jewish guy in SPR, the 'saved' guy killing his 'saviour' - unknowingly, but still...maybe I'm just seeing it the wrong way

[RockinHarry]

Use of a Flak 38 in an urban close support role is entirely plausible (although obviously not from pointblank range as in the movie).

Bringing an open-topped Marder to the fight? No.

Me guesses the conscript Waffengrenadiers needed to throw everything they had, incl. the famous kitchen sink, vs. the elite US para squad.

...but it´s just a movie and thus has its requirements as Slysniper pointed out nicely.

Edit: Somehow the german force composition reminds me of a typical CMX1 QB selection (a bunch of Waffengrenadiers, a Tiger, a Marder, a Flak and a HMG). Are Spielberg and Hanks CM players? :eek:

[Cymru]

Me guesses the conscript Waffengrenadiers needed to throw everything they had, incl. the famous kitchen sink, vs. the elite US para squad.

...but it´s just a movie and thus has its requirements as Slysniper pointed out nicely.

Edit: Somehow the german force composition reminds me of a typical CMX1 QB selection (a bunch of Waffengrenadiers, a Tiger, a Marder, a Flak and a HMG). Are Spielberg and Hanks CM players? :eek:

Then its a good thing it isn’t based on a CMx2 QB. They would have 20 Marders and nothing else.

[slysniper]

Somehow the german force composition reminds me of a typical CMX1 QB selection (a bunch of Waffengrenadiers, a Tiger, a Marder, a Flak and a HMG). Are Spielberg and Hanks CM players? :eek:

Now, that is funny! But somehow true.

[hoolaman]

And then there's:

"It's a whole other company!"

"So? They're just charging into the open, and even if they have any MGs they aren't using 'em..."

Where the hell are they going? They're just running back around to the same dike/berm they started on.

The explosions are pretty sweet in BoB though, no gas flash mushroom clouds there, it's "real" HE. BFC could learn something from those explosions! They've gone for the exploding flash bang version in CMBN.

[Michael Emrys]

...vs. the elite US para squad.

They were Rangers, not paras.

Michael

[Michael Emrys]

They've gone for the exploding flash bang version in CMBN.

That's because players, most of whom are familiar with what they've seen in the movies but not with real HE, demanded it. It seems to me though that the explosions in CMx2 are a bit more realistic than in CMx1.

Michael

[hoolaman]

They were Rangers, not paras.

Michael

Er, they were Para's of the 101st Airborne.

[hoolaman]

That's because players, most of whom are familiar with what they've seen in the movies but not with real HE, demanded it. It seems to me though that the explosions in CMx2 are a bit more realistic than in CMx1.

Michael

I don't remember anyone demanding crap explosions.

I also disagree that the CMx2 explosions are more realistic or better than the old games, but that's a matter of taste I suppose.

[Michael Emrys]

Er, they were Para's of the 101st Airborne.

The guy they were going after was a para. The rescue party were Rangers.

Michael

[Squatdog]

Then its a good thing it isn’t based on a CMx2 QB. They would have 20 Marders and nothing else.

If it was, the Germans would spend 15 minutes maneuvering an HQ unit into LOS of the US forces and insta-gib them with an 81mm Orbital Bombardment.

[noxnoctum]

I annoy the hell out of my family members when I get all groggy during war movies. I'm not allowed to speak anymore.

Haha. That made me laugh .

[Killkess]

My all time favourite of SPR: Sticking a Tommy gun through the drivers visions block of a TIGER and shot the driver

All in all a quit typical HOLLYWOOD action movie.

[RockinHarry]

They were Rangers, not paras.

Michael

oh well.. if it´s just for adding something to your sig, then may it be so.

[RockinHarry]

Interesting find from Intelligence Bulletin Vol III, part 9, Jun-Jul45, page 53:

"Enemy action started about 0500 with diversionary shelling

of the infantry on our left flank. At 0559 the enemy artillery

shifted its fire into Captain Stouffer's area, and laid a heavy

barrage for approximately 5 to 10 minutes. After the barrage

lifted, the enemy patrol moved from its assembly point, and split

into segments, as indicated on the accompanying map. Twenty

to 25 men, equipped with automatic weapons and five light

machine guns, established a base of fire. Twelve to 15 men,

equipped with automatic weapons and a 20-mm cannon on a

hand carriage mount, constituted the left flank patrol. (Later

the 20-mm cannon was discovered to be a 20-mm Flak 38 con-

verted to the ground mount.) Twelve to 15 men, with automatic

weapons and bazookas, constituted the right flank patrol. Be-

fore these elements moved into their positions, they proved ex-

tremely proficient at disarming American booby traps, both the

prefabricated and the improvised types. ..."

The file can be searched here:

http://cgsc.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/