asurob Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Scenario 3. After holding off the intial Syrian thrust I get my reinforcements. Naval gunfire opens up... ...falls short and wipes out all my reinforcements on the left. I lose the scenario...(needless to say) with heavy loss of life. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmage Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 ouch =( danger close eh? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 That'll learn you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevinger Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 "Emergency" fire mission... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asurob Posted October 6, 2008 Author Share Posted October 6, 2008 ouch =( danger close eh? actually the circle of death was well beyond my dug in marines... it simply fell short. Worst feeling in the world was to hear the commence fire commands and then watch the destruction and not be able to stop it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Remember that the user designated area for shot fall is not the same thing as the danger area. The danger area is based on the inherent accuracy of the munition being fired, which may have it land well outside of the targeted area. IIRC for 155s the area is 500m from the aim point. Now here's the rub... if you use Area Fire, then the area shaded is in theory all "aim points". So in theory it's 500m from the edge of the designated target area. In reality I don't think it works out like that, so my guess is the larger the designated Area Fire circle, the proportionally closer you can be to its edge. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homo ferricus Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 What kind of munitions is the "naval gunfire" supposed to simulate? As far as i remember they haven't put big guns on ships since WWII, and all those ships have been decommissioned. But modern destroyers have some well-calibred cannon on them, don't they. Maybe not 155mm. O well, just a thought. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffan Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 127mm Mk45 guns, pretty good dual purpose IIRC Staffan 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmage Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 maybe they brought the Iowa class out of retirement for some action? Any navy buffs around know what kind of big guns the US navy has left? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 What kind of munitions is the "naval gunfire" supposed to simulate? As far as i remember they haven't put big guns on ships since WWII, and all those ships have been decommissioned. But modern destroyers have some well-calibred cannon on them, don't they. Maybe not 155mm. O well, just a thought. The Arleigh Burkes carry a single 5-in turret, and this is a pretty standard caliber for the DD and CG class ships. The ROF and accuracy of the modern gun mounts is quite impressive, though I'm sure it can't compete with a shore battery in terms of sustained fire. The OHP class frigates carry a 3-in turret, and IIRC most of the other dedicated warships of this size do as well. Edited to add: All the BBs were decommissioned in the 90s. It's cheaper to just send a DD with a load of tomahawks. The 16in. guns on the USS New Jersey were cheaper per shot, but it's the coast of keeping the darn thing crewed and afloat that kills it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmage Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Would've thought the Iowas would've had some force projection value, a lot more scary if you park it off someone's coast then a destroyer, guess too expensive though, shame awesome ship! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffan Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Actually ship based systems are a lot more accurate than land based systems, we had the 3inch (76mm) Oto Melare in the dansih navy on the corvette I served on, we did some "burst" firing at ranges out to 9 miles (nautical) with salvoes of up to 10 rnds in 15 seconds and we got everything in a CEP of 100 meters... Nor the dasnish support ships carry the 5 inch (127mm Mk45) and it is a vastly superior weapond albeit with a lower sustained firerate Staffan 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 No doubt a BB has a hell of a psychological impact. Question is, how many modern, faster, quieter, cheaper DDs or FGs would you be willing to sacrifice, to keep one BB afloat? There are arguments both ways. Of course, you can make the same argument regarding CNs. . . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meach Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 I must be missing something here cos all I see under marine artillery choices are M777 and Mortars. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCmarine Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Some info on Naval gunfire. It is every bit as good as artillery battery fire. The Navy mainly uses a 5 inch gun which is 127mm but is well simulated by 155s. A 5 inch gun mount is fully automated which produces an awesome rate of fire (1 round every 2 sec) and enables them to sustain the fire well. I personally observed naval gunfire in Lebanon 83 and with a two mount ship firing a round a sec the results were devastating. Also naval gunfire is a little different from arty fire in that they have a flat trajectory (better to hit ships). The lateral deviation is less than arty but the range deviation can be more. It is important to know the gun to target azimuth so you know what you are seeing when spotting. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 The 16 inchers on the Iowas work out to 406mm. It was like firing VW Beetles at people. Beetles packed with explosives! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huntarr Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Just to clarify, by the book. FM 6-30 TACTICS, TECHNIQUES, AND PROCEDURES FOR OBSERVED FIRE 4-6. METHOD OF ENGAGEMENT ..... b. Danger Close. DANGER CLOSE is included in the method of engagement when the target is (rounds will impact) within 600 meters of friendly troops for mortar and artillery, 750 meters for naval guns 5-inch and smaller, and 1,000 meters for naval guns larger than 5-inch. For naval 16-inch ICM, danger close is 2,000 meters. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theFightingSeabee Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I don't know if field artillery can do this, but I've seen (on tv) the big 16 inchers were able to fire one round with a high trajectory, one with a medium trajectory, and one with a shallow trajectory and have all 3 rounds impact simultaneously at the same point. Now that is some gunnin'! The naval artillery in CMSF Marines is really just 155mm field guns labeled as Naval guns. I don't think they modeled naval artillery. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I have heard that about the BBs as well. I know that with their upgraded fire systems they were able to fire a spotting round, track its trajectory and then have the FDC input corrections and fire for effect before the spotting round even landed. Sweet. Yes, the part of the US Navy is being played by the 155mm field piece. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I don't know if field artillery can do this, but I've seen (on tv) the big 16 inchers were able to fire one round with a high trajectory, one with a medium trajectory, and one with a shallow trajectory and have all 3 rounds impact simultaneously at the same point. Now that is some gunnin'! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius359au Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I don't know if field artillery can do this, but I've seen (on tv) the big 16 inchers were able to fire one round with a high trajectory, one with a medium trajectory, and one with a shallow trajectory and have all 3 rounds impact simultaneously at the same point. Now that is some gunnin'! The naval artillery in CMSF Marines is really just 155mm field guns labeled as Naval guns. I don't think they modeled naval artillery. Its Called "Time on Target" , all the guns in a battery fire at different times to have the shell arrive at the same time - the cancelled Crusader sp had the capability to do it with burst fire , and I think the AS90 and PZH200 can do it as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 It's called "Time on Target" No it isn't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius359au Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 No it isn't. Ok then, MRSI (Multiple Rounds Simultaneous Impact) ,Ive always just called it Time on Target from when I first heard about it as a kid back in the dark ages:p 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 ToT has a specific meaning, which is different to burst (or MRSI) fire. You can, of course, personally use the term for whatever you want. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asurob Posted October 7, 2008 Author Share Posted October 7, 2008 Having been a carrier sailor I think I just learned more about naval gunfire then I did with 5 years on the inside. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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