gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Um you can’t destroy any of them unless you take fire from them and have positively identified enemy in them. You can’t just flatten the place with Arty before you drive up to it. As to what type, they remind me of buildings in small rural towns in Turkey. Normally they are only partly finished because the inflation rate means that either the owner can’t pay to complete it or the builder goes bust trying to fulfil a fixed price contract. I hadn’t looked at them as objectives (since the US orders don’t list them as an objective) and I play with all that “non realistic” stuff off. I’m just heading for BEAR and ELK as per the brief. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Originally posted by gibsonm: Um you can’t destroy any of them unless you take fire from them and have positively identified enemy in them. You can’t just flatten the place with Arty before you drive up to it. As to what type, they remind me of buildings in small rural towns in Turkey. Normally they are only partly finished because the inflation rate means that either the owner can’t pay to complete it or the builder goes bust trying to fulfil a fixed price contract. I hadn’t looked at them as objectives (since the US orders don’t list them as an objective) and I play with all that “non realistic” stuff off. I’m just heading for BEAR and ELK as per the brief. Ah, ok. That means that the objective is reached if the buildings are "not destroyed" at the end of the game ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Not sure on that read the brief: “Rules of engagement: The farms and villages in the area are, as far as we know still occupied - do not target or destroy a building unless you receive hostile fire and positively ID enemy units in the building.“ So you aren’t allowed to fire on them unless “you receive hostile fire and positively ID enemy units in the building.“ As far as I know the ONLY objectives for the US Player are ELK and BEAR, AS SURIYA isn’t either of those. Is that clearer? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Thanks for the answer. But what is with the PL ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 PL = Platoon? or PL = Phase Line? If Phase Line, which one are you referring to? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 I see 5 Objectives: -Dont destroy the peacefull buildings -Bear -Elk -PL Oaktree -LOA Tenasee 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Well, I’m not sure where as only BEAR and ELK appear on the map (I think, tuned those off too). The brief says (inter alia): Team "Wolfpack" will depart the LD at 0600Hrs. You are to advance north parallel to Route 42. The limit of your advance is indicated by LOA TENNESSEE on your tactical map. OK so we go no further than LOA [Limit of advance] TENNESSEE. This isn’t an objective, its a control measure, so our advance fits in with the neighbouring units. Your first objectives are Elk and Bear, located on the high ground in the hills (see tactical map) east and west of Route 42. You are to seize these two objectives, which will enable a secure base of fire to be established to support the continuance of your advance onto the plain and to the LOA TENNESSEE. On arrival at the LOA you will go firm and await the arrival of Team Heavymetal. OK we have to seize ELK and BEAR. These are objectives. On making contact with enemy units develop the situation as you deem appropriate. Inform battalion of your intentions. Rules of engagement: The farms and villages in the area are, as far as we know still occupied - do not target or destroy a building unless you receive hostile fire and positively ID enemy units in the building. So no blowing stuff up without a reason. Helps you maintain the 50%+ ammo level too. I want you to arrive at LOA TENNESSEE with your force at least 85% intact. We are experiencing supply difficulties so make sure you maintain an ammo load out of 50%. So we need to maintain 85% cbt effectiveness and 50%+ ammo levels. Not really Objectives, but in game terms the first part can be scored. I have no idea where you get PL OAKTREE from? Its not in the brief or any graphic I’ve seen (unless George has updated the version recently). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 What Version of the Scenario are you playing ? In my brief there is PL Oaktree. On Tactical Map to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Well based on the time of the first saved game, I’d say ver 6. As far as I know they haven’t changed markedly. What does the brief say about the Phase Line? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 PL Oaktree is between The Hills (Bear,Elk) and LOA Tenesee, it must be a "touch" object. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Don’t make assumptions like that. What does the brief say about it? It might just be a pretty graphic not something that you need to achieve. Hmm, well its 0120 here so it would be nice if you at least answered the question, or should I just go to bed and let you sort it out for yourself? [ March 23, 2008, 06:25 AM: Message edited by: gibsonm ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 "...advance north (Highway 42) passing PL Oaktree..." 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Well I’d say its another control measure. Basically you have to clear the road (makes sense) as well as the high ground. I’ve dropped George a note and he’ll either send me the answer or post it here himself. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Chapter 8 at the newsstand now! Armour Attacks! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted March 28, 2008 Author Share Posted March 28, 2008 Originally posted by gibsonm: Well I’d say its another control measure. Basically you have to clear the road (makes sense) as well as the high ground. I’ve dropped George a note and he’ll either send me the answer or post it here himself. Just back from my trip away hence the delay in responding. My apologies for the confusion! Mark has a slightly older version of the scenario, as he started his AAR before I uploaded a slightly revised version, which basically just corrected a couple of wee errors I had made. That aside the addition or omission of PL Oaktree will not make that much difference as to the end result Re PL Oaktree - It's pretty much just a control feature as per the brief. Otherwise Mark is spot on with his assessment of the briefing. Hope this helps. Cheers fur noo George 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggum Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Im finished the secenario yesterday. First i have to say, great work, the best cmsf scenario at the moment. I hope to see more scenarios like yours with such a huge and realistic map. I got a minor victory with 19 KIA. I think such a big enemy armoured force will be attacket by allied air power during allocation in real life so they cant luch such a massive attack like in this scenario. The own air and artillery support i pretty much useless if the enemy tanks are moving (attacking). And all the hidden ATGM positions are very nasty ( ). The bradlys are virtually dead if they arent in safe positions where no enemy can spot them. The M1 Tanks have to fight the main battle and i think with 4 more M1 i can kick the enemys ass a lot harder. Nearly all my KIA's are from bradlys with infantery inside get hit. That should be no critic, but i think thats a really hard-to-win scenario i i see no way how a humen blue player can win again a humen red player... Great Work George Mc, i will post a AAR soon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 We'll see how I make out. I'd say these are not "big" armoured forces on either side but usual configurations. You should be able to share the load between different elements to achieve the mission. I suspect a Tk hvy force would find clearing the town, given the ROE much harder than a mixed grouping. That last bit sounds like a challenge? [ March 30, 2008, 02:31 PM: Message edited by: gibsonm ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Chapter 9 at the newsstand now! Armour Attacks! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted March 30, 2008 Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 Hi Wiggum Glad you enjoyed it. The force size is about right - pretty small scale combat teams being tasked to a local tactical mission. If I mind the brief for the Syrian side does mention that their armoured force has been under attack - hence the slightly disrupted nature of the attack. Like all these things the US airpower is immense but in a combat situation such as this one there is always the chance that you don't get the air support you need. Also given that the area is still occupied by civvies, having air munitions dropped on civilian centres would be pretty bad press. Hence the ROE for the task force - you can't fire on houses unless you positively ID enemy troops therin and are taking fire. So the air attacks have come earlier, off map and when the Syrian task force has made contact with the US TF then it's too danger close to have air support flying around engaging ground targets. Unwinnable as Blue vs Red H2H - there is a challenge for someone Cheers fur noo george 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisND Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Just played it... this scenario rocks!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 Hi Normal Dude Glad you liked it. George 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted April 7, 2008 Share Posted April 7, 2008 Chapter 10 at the newsstand now! Armour Attacks! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G B Scurlock Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 I'm about 40 minutes into the scenario. Great fun. Now I understand the name. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted April 18, 2008 Author Share Posted April 18, 2008 Originally posted by G B Scurlock: I'm about 40 minutes into the scenario. Great fun. Now I understand the name. He! He! It works both ways eh? Cheers fur noo George 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G B Scurlock Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 George, I must say, you are one tallented scenario designer. Thanks for your work. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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