Laying down fire and squad formations.

[Manx]

Here's the situation,

i've located Syrian positions on the outskirts of a town. I bring an inf squad up to a ridge that provides cover and stop them just short of the ridge line in defilade. Creeping them up to get Los/LoF i usually end up with only ONE guy out of a squad of nine putting down any fire.

The only way i can get all nine to provide any support is if i push them forwards into a hail of bullets. A US infantry squad packs a lot of punch, but not if only one or two of them are actively shooting. The rest just lay prone stuck in spotting mode. Well the enemy has been spotted, do something!

Why once contact has been made by the squad, don't all members try to get into good firing positions?

Am i missing something?

[ September 22, 2007, 01:21 AM: Message edited by: Manx ]

[Mishga]

It don't work all the time but I use the FACE command to line them up on the ridge....it's a bit hit or miss but just sometimes the squad realigns on the target and you get more output.

[Manx]

Mishga, that's one of the things that i've been trying to do, but like you say it's very hit and miss whether you can get the guys lined up. Default formation when stopped seems to be roughly 3 rows of 3 men, so at least 6 of those are never going to get into firing positions without exposing the front ranks.

Would have been great to see control over each individual in the squad when necessary - like the current split command but the squad breaks down to each man.

[SSG DEG]

I think the game needs an ONLINE Command. The Assualt command initiates a fire and movement sequence for the squad on a fire team basis. We need to be able to get the whole squad online and in the fire or assualt mode

[MiB]

Perhaps a "mode" for each squad, how they line up defaultly when they stop?

IE for quick marches you can have them default into 2 rows, or for moving to engagement they default by seeking the most cover they can find in a line, etc.

[Mishga]

Manx

Yeah I know what you mean. My snipers in the sniper teams are always in the rear gazing at the palm trees or whatever they are doing while the three front grunts are blazing away.

I am sure it will be addressed at some point. What would be nice is a "line up" tool. Similar to the artillery line fire tool.

"Guys, on the ridge, commence fire!" Draw a line and the troops move to that line and face the correct way. Just a 02c worth.

[Manx]

Mishga,

yep, it's painful to watch sometimes. I mean, whats the point in pre-planning, or carefully guiding your squads into good firing positions, if when they get there, they are only operating at 20-30% of their combat capability.

Combat as always been about hitting the enemy with more firepower than they can bring to bare upon you. This is especially so in the case of modern warfare.

I was hoping that i might have missed some commands or series of commands that got round this, but that doesn't appear to be the case.

I hope BFC can come up with something to address this.

[Manx]

Originally posted by MiB:

Perhaps a "mode" for each squad, how they line up defaultly when they stop?

IE for quick marches you can have them default into 2 rows, or for moving to engagement they default by seeking the most cover they can find in a line, etc.

Agreed, or at least something along those lines.

However it's done, a squad coming under fire or making contact with the enemy should react a lot more realistically than it currently does.

[Cpl Steiner]

The game "Full Spectrum Warrior" handled this well. Depending on where you clicked for a movement waypoint, the squad would assume an appropriate formation - i.e. "Line" if taking cover behind a car, "Column" if stacking up at the corner of a building, or "Wedge" if just standing in the open.

I would also like to see little yellow circles or similar showing where each man in a squad will try to be at the end of the move, just like in FSW. I loved FSW for the way the men assumed realistic formations.

[SgtMuhammed]

You mean you don't like the CMSF gaggle formation?

If the game is going to have 1:1 representation then those guys have to act like they should. That means movement formations, bringing squads on line for a base of fire, firing as soon as you enter a room, using windows as entry points so you don't have to run around a building to find a door. With the old system your guys abstracted that they were doing what they were supposed to. In the new one they don't abstract they just don't do what they are supposed to, except get shot.

[Wiggum]

What does Battlefront says to that problem ?

[SlapHappy]

The "leave it to chance" formations for squads doesn't work with unabstracted squads.

They should have allowed you to give commands to each soldier in the squad individually. Then we would have seen some much better infantry tactics capabilities.

[Cpl Steiner]

If CM:SF could somehow replicate this screenshot taken from the "Full Spectrum Warrior: Ten Hammers" demo, showing the TL looking around a corner whilst the rest of the team hug the wall, MOUT in CM:SF would be so much more rewarding IMHO.

[Mishga]

It looks like that dude next to the TL is listening to his Ipod lol

[General_solomon]

Originally posted by Cpl Steiner:

If CM:SF could somehow replicate this screenshot taken from the "Full Spectrum Warrior: Ten Hammers" demo, showing the TL looking around a corner whilst the rest of the team hug the wall, MOUT in CM:SF would be so much more rewarding IMHO.

if i could get one feature added to shock force, it would be movement controls like FSW.

FSW and Shock Force are the only games i play.

FSW would have had a longer shelf life if it included an editor like shockforce. That, i would have paid 200 dollars to use.