Dropteam gets drop-kicked in IMG review

[CrimsonDestiny]

Originally posted by Carcaroth:

That krrhh-ptui! goes to childish robot games (mechwarriors and such).

Silence, mortal. I sacrificed my first born to Mechwarrior 2.

Before going to far into trashing the review it has to be said that almost all reviews are unfair. The reviewer gets a truckload of stuff to review, ranging from games and other software to hardware of all sorts, logistically, he/she can't honestly be expected to give the hours upon hours of time to a game, of all things.

And let's face it, DropTeam is the kind of game that needs that large amount of time to really get into.

Unfair review, yeah. Unexpected, no.

[Monkwarrior]

I do agree with some things Dark said.

This game was sold to customers for a normal price and after installing it seemed there were still many bugs present. We were used as beta-testers no doubt in that (intended or non-intended). And yes I know what I'm talking about with 20 years of experience in the testing of professional software and gaming industry.

The review is lacking in many aspects, let's not waste time on it any more.

@Steve

Your first reaction in this topic was one I could relate to. It would have been wise to stop there, but you decided to go on a crusade against Dark. Not very professional IMO, but we are all human I guess (believe me I know ...).

How painfull it may be: Dark has a strong argument. Servers are still nearly empty and most gamers don't seem to notice this game and certainly don't stick around. As gamedeveloper/publisher you could ask yourself "what's the reason for this lack of populairity ?"

A big plus is the commitment of the dev-team. They really make a difference and listen very well to their customers

I stopped playing DT because I decided the setting of the game was not my cup of tea, but I will return when the ww2 addition will be there.

Looking forward to the ww2 addition, Monk.

[ October 25, 2006, 03:09 AM: Message edited by: Monkwarrior ]

[Battlefront.com]

Monkwarrior,

I do agree with some things Dark said.

This game was sold to customers for a normal price and after installing it seemed there were still many bugs present.

Find me a bug free release and then you'll have an argument that DT somehow underdelivered. I've worked on very big game projects in the past, and I can tell you that they sometimes shipped with (I am not kidding here) hundreds of known bugs/issues. I'd even go so far as to say that is the norm for larger projects. DT shipped with some bugs (again, as do all software products, game or otherwise), but the devs quickly fixed them. I know of some games that were crippled within weeks by killer bugs that were for one reason or another not fixed.

We were used as beta-testers no doubt in that (intended or non-intended). And yes I know what I'm talking about with 20 years of experience in the testing of professional software and gaming industry.

Yeah, but that doesn't make you right We beta testers (I was but a humble one, not anything more) were satisfied with the game's release version. So were the developers, so was Battlefront as publisher. Now, you can state that the game wasn't what you wanted it to be, but stating that it was released in beta format is as inaccurate as it is insulting.

As I said, DT was never intended to be a static game system. It's evolving and you guys aren't paying a dime for that. Few games can rival DT in terms of feature enhancements post release, so why penalize it for being different?

Your first reaction in this topic was one I could relate to. It would have been wise to stop there, but you decided to go on a crusade against Dark.

Er... so having a point/counter-point debate is now considered a crusade? I'm confused. I was always taught that if someone presents a position for discussion they should understand that someone may disagree with that point. And if someone disagress that person may wish to offer an alternative take on the topic at hand. If this is done with rational discourse it is considered a debate, if it is just a shouting match then it is called an argument (at best!). As far as I can tell I was engaging Dark_au in a debate. If the rules have changed and now it is somehow unprofessional and/or inadvisable to engage in an intellectual discussion based on rational and sound lines of argument, then I guess I've done something wrong. Otherwise, I think you stand corrected

How painfull it may be: Dark has a strong argument. Servers are still nearly empty and most gamers don't seem to notice this game and certainly don't stick around. As gamedeveloper/publisher you could ask yourself "what's the reason for this lack of populairity ?"

Sure, that's something that any good game developer should do. But sometimes it isn't because the game is bad, sometimes it is because the game appeals to a smaller audience. We sold tons of Combat Missions, for example. By wargame standards we blew the doors off of previous wargame sales and haven't had any competition since that is worth mentioning. Yet by game industry standards our sales record is like a few grains of sand on a beach. So, should we be asking ourselves "what did we do wrong" because we didn't hit someone else's expectations?

Now, I'm not saying "DT is perfect, we think there isn't anything we need to do to make the game better". In fact, the opposite is the case as you yourself have said:

A big plus is the commitment of the dev-team. They really make a difference and listen very well to their customers

This is the highest compliment a game developer can receive, IMHO. It's always good to see people, like yourself, valuing such dedication.

I stopped playing DT because I decided the setting of the game was not my cup of tea, but I will return when the ww2 addition will be there.

I think you've really hit the nail on the head, which is the same nail that I was debating Dark_au about. The setting isn't your cup of tea, therefore your not happy with it. Very logical and very understandable. That doesn't mean, however, that the setting is inherently bad. Hopefully the WWII version will work better for you.

Steve

[Toby Haynes]

Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

As I said, DT was never intended to be a static game system. It's evolving and you guys aren't paying a dime for that. Few games can rival DT in terms of feature enhancements post release, so why penalize it for being different?

Actually, to me that is one of the reasons why I put money down for DropTeam in the first place. I've messed around with the Demeter terrain engine several years back and wondered if anyone would ever make a game using it. Seeing a tank game emerge was a welcome surprise. Discovering that such a game would be extensively modifiable was the icing on the cake.

To then discover that the development team was as keen to push the game on as well was a major bonus. I really do feel that there is enormous potential for DropTeam (and that is not to say it doesn't already stand on it's own feet).

[Monkwarrior]

Steve,

I will not dismember your posts, because discussions like that will not be very entertaining nor usefull. However a few things I would like to point out to you.

You feel insulted: sorry again not very professional. Remember I'm not personal here, I'm just a customer with an opinion you don't share.

The tone and content of your reactions is of someone who wants and needs to be right (" I think you stand corrected" and "Yeah, but that doesn't make you right").

Let me spare you further trouble:

* You are very right

* DT was never delivered as a beta-project for a full price

* Your customers are always wrong

So now we have that out of the way let's focus on more positive things.

Any ETA or news on the ww2 mod ?

Greetingz, Monk.

[PoppinHobbit]

You guys sure got some built up spite...yeesh.

[Chilibird]

I agree. 0.o

What's wrong with just letting it drop?

[Battlefront.com]

Monkwarrior,

You feel insulted: sorry again not very professional. Remember I'm not personal here, I'm just a customer with an opinion you don't share.

Accusing a software developer of releasing a game before it is ready is not considered flattery, that's for sure. As I said, we released it in a state we were happy with. You were not happy with it, that's fine. You're entitled to your opinion and I can't argue against it since it comes down to personal taste. But that doesn't mean you are paying to beta test something.

The tone and content of your reactions is of someone who wants and needs to be right

And the content of your reactions is... what exactly?

It all is really simple. I disagreed with the reviewer, as did most everybody here. I got jumpped on for having an opinion by a single poster, and quite rudely too I might add. I engaged him in a polite and professional debate. Then you post that I'm unprofessional for having a debate, yet at the same time you're supposedly not getting personal (I don't buy it). So I politely, and quite professionally rebutt your post, then you get all huffy. Sheesh... it's almost like you don't want to hear from the people that make the games, only your own opinion. Oh, well except for this I suppose:

So now we have that out of the way let's focus on more positive things.

Any ETA or news on the ww2 mod ?

Nothing as of yet. It's coming along nicely though slowly.

Steve

[ October 29, 2006, 08:58 PM: Message edited by: Battlefront.com ]

[Battlefront.com]

PoppinHobbit

You guys sure got some built up spite...yeesh.

True, I don't like being told that I don't have any right to post my own opinions and correct facts on my own Forum. And gamers wonder why hardly any developers bother to converse with customers

Steve

[konstantine]

As a customer, I definitely appreciate the developer input feedback in both this and the CMSF forum. Now let's get some feedback in the CMBO forum. When can we expect the patch?

[Monkwarrior]

It's dropped

Monk.