Blashy Proved Wrong, Jollyguy As Allies Goes 2 for 3 Against Axis Heavyweights

[Jollyguy]

No, they're not all ganging up on me at once, playing in separate games. Here's a synopsis of interesting aspects of each game, I'm Allies in all three games, with no Southern Turkish invasion in all three, and no pussy scouting with corps/armies of neutrals. In Rambo and Terif's game it's no Sea Lion until Barbarossa, with Iron Ranger Sea Lion is okay :

Iron Ranger: France fell late, August, 1940. Iron Ranger (IR) then got bogged down with Malta, where I planted an entrenched bomber. Turns kept moving along, Malta held out, and then all of sudden Gibralter got attacked from both sides. I had my Canadian cruiser in port and it held two turns, but against determined sub attacks it visited the deep. Then the largest naval engagement I believe either of us has ever taken part in ensued. IR had manuevered his entire German fleet toward Gibralter, to meet up with the Italians. My entire navy was intact, and we slugged it out...like two old men as IR said. We were both so low on supply that the damage meted out was low on both sides. With only a spotting range of one there were many surprise engagements. I think we each lost a similar number of ships, maybe 5 each, then, arm weary, both backed off. It appeared IR had purchased a couple extra German subs, so we'll see how that effects his Barbarossa, which just kicked off.

2) Rambo: The interesting thing here is that he has two, count em', two, rockets arrayed against Malta. He told me I should leave, but I said I've always wanted to own my own island. I foolishly planted a BB in port, which hit an Italian BB, level 1, but then promptly got sank the next turn. Several turns have passed and the bomber holds, against the rocket and Luftwaffe attacks. I also lost a carrier near France in a sloppy move, and earlier found Rambo's starting sub all the way at the west part of the board, at which point we both got trapped in ice, his sub, and about 8 of my ships. It was the battle of the frozen pond, as we were both able to attack, albeit less effectively. I sank him, but my ships ended up at 0 supply, and it took many extra turns to get back to England.

Terif: Game's early. Terif was able to destroy a slightly weakened French army, and then moved through the Maginot, never having had to DOW Benelux. But the French got lucky and held even with Paris surrendered, until Late April or early May.

Bob

[ August 03, 2006, 09:21 AM: Message edited by: Jollyguy ]

[Liam]

That's amazing, cracking the Maginot without DOWing Benelux and capturing Paris?

Rambo using Rockets

IR fighting at the Rock

Originally posted by Jollyguy:

No, they're not all ganging up on me at once, playing in separate games. Here's a synopsis of interesting aspects of each game, I'm Allies in all three games, with no Southern Turkish invasion in all three, and no pussy scouting with corps/armies of neutrals. In Rambo and Terif's game it's no Sea Lion until Barbarossa, with Iron Ranger Sea Lion is okay:

Iron Ranger: France fell late, August, 1940. Iron Ranger (IR) then got bogged down with Malta, where I planted an entrenched bomber. Turns kept moving along, Malta held out, and then all of sudden Gibralter got attacked from both sides. I had my Canadian cruiser in port and it held two turns, but against determined sub attacks it visited the deep. Then the largest naval engagement I believe either of us has ever taken part in ensued. IR had manuevered his entire German fleet toward Gibralter, to meet up with the Italians. My entire navy was intact, and we slugged it out...like two old men as IR said. We were both so low on supply that the damage meted out was low on both sides. With only a spotting range of one there were many surprise engagements. I think we each lost a similar number of ships, maybe 5 each, then, arm weary, both backed off. It appeared IR had purchased a couple extra German subs, so we'll see how that effects his Barbarossa, which just kicked off.

2) Rambo: The interesting thing here is that he has two, count em', two, rockets arrayed against Malta. He told me I should leave, but I said I've always wanted to own my own island. I foolishly planted a BB in port, which hit an Italian BB, level 1, but then promptly got sank the next turn. Several turns have passed and the bomber holds, against the rocket and Luftwaffe attacks. I also lost a carrier near France in a sloppy move, and earlier found Rambo's starting sub all the way at the west part of the board, at which point we both got trapped in ice, his sub, and about 8 of my ships. It was the battle of the frozen pond, as we were both able to attack, albeit less effectively. I sank him, but my ships ended up at 0 supply, and it took many extra turns to get back to England.

Terif: Game's early. Terif was able to destroy a slightly weakened French army, and then moved through the Maginot, never having had to DOW Benelux. But the French got lucky and held even with Paris surrendered, until Late April or early May.

Bob

[Blashy]

I hope you took Axis in at least ONE game, cause the Allies can never win with the default campaign at this time.

Unless the player is new and makes rookie errors.

[Jollyguy]

Well, never may be too close to certainity, we'll see what happens. But keep in mind we do have two house rules intended to level the playing field, recommended by the Master himself. And basically these Terif created house rules are like patches in themselves, until the official patches arrive.

Against Terif I have little expectation of winning, just learning, and seeing how he did France was worth the price of admission. Of the other two games I believe I have the best chance against Iron Ranger, perhaps because he has fewer SC 2 games under his belt. But he did beat Liam as Allies, who beat me as Allies, so if I beat IR it's a W in my book.

Against Rambo you never know as he's so adaptable, but again, I'll learn. But in my mind I'm staying in practice for 1.03, which should address some of the balance issues.

Sure, I like winning, but I also like challenging games.

Bob

[Scook]

Unless the player is new and makes rookie errors.

Yep.

Playing Blashy now as Axis, and I think I am slightly intimidated. That was the worst showing I have given with the Italian Navy vs. anyone.

Good luck Jolly, give 'em hell.

[Blashy]

You don't need to Sealion to win as Axis and you don't need to take Turkey to win as Axis. Even with those two house rules in, the Axis will always win with an experience Axis player.

Scook, you forgot to mention this is playing my mod, so UK being aggressive in Africa is different since you have the historical arrival of CW troops.

As well the Italian navy (BB and CA) are at a slight disadvantage (historical) vs. the very experienced UK navy. Although you did kinda run into trouble head on .

[Liam]

actually, I beat Iron Ranger as Allies as far as I can tell, that game is unfinished though until I get word from him. It was only his 4th match though

Originally posted by Jollyguy:

Well, never may be too close to certainity, we'll see what happens. But keep in mind we do have two house rules intended to level the playing field, recommended by the Master himself. And basically these Terif created house rules are like patches in themselves, until the official patches arrive.

Against Terif I have little expectation of winning, just learning, and seeing how he did France was worth the price of admission. Of the other two games I believe I have the best chance against Iron Ranger, perhaps because he has fewer SC 2 games under his belt. But he did beat Liam as Allies, who beat me as Allies, so if I beat IR it's a W in my book.

Against Rambo you never know as he's so adaptable, but again, I'll learn. But in my mind I'm staying in practice for 1.03, which should address some of the balance issues.

Sure, I like winning, but I also like challenging games.

Bob

[Sombra]

@Blashy I would like to test your theory. If you have time and want to you can take the Axis

[Blashy]

Actually Sombra I have 2 default campaigns game to finish and then I am done with it.

After playing my historical mod the game makes much more sense historically, is more balanced, more realistic, goes pretty much all the time to 1945 AND is actually A LOT more fun.

[Jollyguy]

I don't agree with Blashy's statement either. I'm not saying the game is precisely balanced 50/50, but IMO it's much closer than SC 1 was after two patches, and for all players other than Terif I believe a competent Axis opponent can be beaten by a competent Allied player X% of the time. There are a lot more moving parts in SC 2 than SC 1, and with the two house rules in effect, particularly Turkey, IMO a good Allied player has a fair chance of beating a good Axis player. As Terif says, there are more ways for for an Axis player to mess up than the Allies. If the Axis player takes his eye off the ball at a crucial time, it can cost him, and perhaps the game.

And tactics are still emerging. Iron Ranger DOW'ed Denmark to get at Rambo's subs. If you ever played Rambo you'd know that taking out his subs is important, but DOW'ing Denmark to get into the Baltic, who'd have thunk? And Rambo using two rockets on Malta...it worked. My bomber got trapped, and he took Malta faster than I've seen it done so far, and with only one German and one Italian airfleet to soften it up.

So, I think Blashy's assertion is both premature and incorrect.

Bob

[jon_j_rambo]

Blashy needs to post some wins to become more believable.

[Blashy]

1- The game is not historical, that is correct.

2- No JJvR I don't need to boast about a game to make myself feel better... unlike you. I also don't always play to win, if I did I would not try differnent out of whack tactics vs. players, I would try them alone or vs. the AI first. I play for my fun, not yours.

[jon_j_rambo]

Whatever. Dude, to be credible in this community with strategy, you need to win with your strategy against a real opponent (your mod against AI doesn't count). And the best you could aim for is "credible"...because I AM "incredible".

My game speaks, barks, smacks, and does it all.

-Legend

[Blashy]

My mod is not for AI alone, sigh... It is intended for MP as well.

[SeaMonkey]

Rambonehead, I can vouch for Blashy, he is a capable player. Yes, he experiments alot, you don't? He's a beta, its his job to help level this game out, and yours too, if you really are an icon, and not incredulous.

Try something different for a change, explore the unknown, I know you Idahoans have a pioneering spirit. You have time to play a lot, give Blashy a break and some feedback, he's doing this for all of us, a true SCean.

Try his mod....you going to help or just CROW?

[Scook]

For what its worth, I like your mod Blashy. Legends like Member #10987 need to stand on the mountain, and ponder important stuff.

I am also guessing wins in general won't matter too, wins vs. certain names will count more.

[Canuck_TAR]

Member #10987.................never heard of him.

[Jollyguy]

The game with Rambo has taken an interesting turn, as games with him often do. He is now up to four rockets, at least tech two, as they’re hitting from four hexes away, making things uncomfortable for the denizens of London. In hindsight he was bound and determined to try this strategy, as he attacked France with low tech infantry, so my guess is he was marshaling mpps for rockets and research chits. He also hit Syria with units that had to have had at least level two or three amphib tech, both Germany and Italy.

However, the Allies have been busy on other fronts, like diplomacy. Rambo got one hit around the French campaign to knock Spain to 52% readiness. Being reactive I had not bought any diplomatic chits yet, willing to take the less than 1 in 100 chance of a 40% plus/minus chance of a huge Spanish readiness jump. So, I bought two chits for Franco, as that’s all I could buy, as I had three on Russia already, and eventually I got a 13% move…to 39% Spanish readiness. I wasn’t sure if Rambo knew that that Romania and Hungary will not join if Spain is less than 40% readiness (as mentioned in Terif’s SC 2 players guide), so I replaced that chit, but couldn’t buy more Until Russia hit. Then one of the Russian chits hit, so I bought another Spanish one; then, so many turns later, another Russian chit hit, followed by the final one also. So Russia was up to the mid 60% in readiness, and I ended up with five chits on Spain to try to preserve that 39%. At that point Rambo commented about Spanish readiness. I could afford all this, as the French had induced Iraq to start the convoys, and with Rambo hung up around Malta, I was still getting the Egyptian convoys.

So, as we sit, April 1941, Romania and Hungary have not joined, Russian readiness is in the 80%s, and I still hold Egypt, but that will fall soon, as Rambo has a fair German/Italian contingent down there. Iraq has joined the Axis. On the naval front I’ve sunk I believe three subs, as when you play Rambo you don’t want him to get too many of those. I have lost my bomber when it got trapped on Malta by those damned rockets.

Bob

[jon_j_rambo]

The Diplo has been an absolute nightmare this game. Jolly keeps getting hits, I've only had one hit, but got trumped by the mega Spain hit by the Allies, and these Russian hits.

[Jollyguy]

Yea, luck is a factor, but I'm okay with that, as it adds variability. In another pbem game I have going my Russian research is so bad that I've been max'ed out at 1000 for almost a year, with only one hit that entire time. If the Russian scientists don't get started in that one I could be in trouble.

Bob

[jon_j_rambo]

Spring 1941 ---

-Very, very weak Barby.

-Finally got Egypt!

-4 Rockets, 2-LF, and Italian fighter take target practice on London.

-Romania & Hungary join the turn after Barby, nice.

-Russia takes out Finland, easily.

[Jollyguy]

Yes, in my game with Rambo the Finns were subjugated easily, a rare event I believe in SC 2.

It was interesting to note that once Russia entered the game Hungary and Rumania readiness increased despite Spain being below 40% readiness (Franco is at 27% now, I got another hit). And then one of them got concerned when I DOW’ed Finland, and both eventually joined. I can’t remember when I purchased my last Spanish chit, but from a cost/benefit perspective probably not worth buying another one too close to Barbarossa if these two minors are likely to come in anyway once Uncle Joe does. And speaking of Uncle Joe, higher Russian readiness due to diplomacy hits meant the Motherland could go on a spending spree, but where the money was spread around has to remain a State secret.

Yea, those V-2 rockets of Rambo’s, having been transferred from the Malta campaign, are raining down on London, his form of the London Blitz. The Russians are reading about it all in Pravda, and anxious whether those experienced rocketeers will get transferred to the Eastern Front. Three turns into Barbarossa, and Rambo took his first Russian city, the northern one near Germany. In Egypt I didn’t reinforce once, I let a lone English corp and the Commonwealth troops fend for themselves as best they could.

In my other games Iron Ranger has kicked off Barbarossa, and just intercepted a portion of the RN near Spain, sending three of my ships to the bottom at the cost of one of his Italian BBs. But England itself is massively garrisoned and US readiness keeps edging up, so the threat of Sea Lion is past. In that game I still hold Egypt and Malta, and Spain and the Scandanavians are neutral. He took Tunisia a couple turns ago, and the Finns joined, with Leningrad still holding but probably not for much longer.

In my game with Terif if you remember he avoided DOW’ing Denmark AND Benelux, but I got one Russian diplomacy hit to makeup for it. He took Egypt and I think Iraq went his way, and my British Marines just took that Vichy territory with two cities, the one to the left of Tunisia. My bomber still holds Malta, and Scandanavia is neutral. Actually, as of April 1941, Terif has not attacked one Minor.

[Terif]

Yep, my Axis empire is peaceful and only reacts if attacked from the outside

[Jollyguy]

Quick update on these games:

Rambo: His four rockets are now deployed in Russia and he is moving forward slowly. I still hold the forward city by the Black Sea and Leningrad, he has the three other central forward cities. As a counter to his rockets Uncle Joe developed advanced fighters and long range air, which takes potshots at his V-2’s when possible.

Out West the Brits are dug in, and the US is in. He is moving on the capital of Vichy Algeria with two level 0 tanks but my British Marines are going to stand and fight and die, even though they could have evacuated earlier. He DOW’ed Yugo and goofed on his unit placement, and one of Tito’s damaged corps was able to dash to Budapest, forcing the surrender of Hungary. Tito held out several more turns, as I figured it was worth reinforcing, as he mainly had minor troops in the vicinity. The Danes held out several turns after surviving a 1 on DOW, and, he took Switzerland. I have Finland, he has all of the Med except Vichy Algeria.

Iron Ranger: We got a good tcp session in last night, following two weeks of PBEM. This is the game of big naval battles, we’ve had three near Southern Spain, all which he got the better of. The latest one involved the American navy, which was escorting a convoy toward French Algeria. He sank and army, two US level 1 GWR and AS cruisers, and a BB and a British cruiser. I sank an Italian BB and a German cruiser. The US has air in the Med now, which accounted for the Italian BB. Missed getting one of his subs by one hit. I still hold Malta, and after transferring my US bomber there had the British Marines take the leftmost Italian African city, after the US bomber spotted the area.

In Russia he took Moscow and the city above it, as I was thin, seeing as I had assembled a large Caucusses force. Once my paratroop was ready he took Iran, and the rest of my force moved into Iraq, which fell in about two turns. He thought about defending around Syria, but pulled out an army, HQ, and corp, after I took his leading corp. Turkey looks wide open, and my paratroop is preparing for his next possible next jump.

Meanwhile my Russian scientists have been productive, and figured out motorization 1 which helped move over the Iraq mountains, and in the last handful of turns before we logged-off I got up to level 4 tanks. So, with the Middle East cleared, I pushed forward with those tanks in center Russia even though it was the dead of winter. He only has AT 1, so the snow saved him, but my tanks exacted moderate damage.

In England he tried to bait me earlier. He sank a corp destined for Ireland and his combined German/Italian navy swarmed the western side of the Home Islands, while an Italian amphib hoped to find an empty Scapa Flow, which I had garrisoned. The RN weighed anchor for safer ports and the RAF repositioned, but I didn’t challenge him. England is now almost wall-to-wall units, so Sea Lion is defensed. So instead he invaded Spain, where he only has level 1 tanks. Winter hit, which is where we left it.

Terif: What can you say, flawless execution by Terif. He waited until September 1941to invade Russia, along with taking Tunisia, Syria, Benelux, and Denmark all in the same turn

But now that his Barbarossa is well progressed I can report that in this game I got the worst Russian research luck in about two dozen SC 2 games played. Not the type of luck you want when playing the Master. I went over a year of being fully funded with only one Russian advance. Such is the luck of the die throw. Then I got four in one turn, then mostly quite again. Then he showed level 4 tanks and level three AT and IW for his Brest garrison, so I felt I had no option but to overfund my AT and IW and hope I got some advances, as he was just going to steamroll me with high tech against my low tech units. I evacuated two of my front cities after he kicked off Barbarossa, otherwise they would have been wasted cannon fodder. He’s hitting me from Iraq with two air, and just took Iran with a corp. Out west I’m not quite ready to move, and the US is up to about 75% readiness.

Bob

[Terif]

Yep, our game seems to be a high tech game - Russia also is at Anti-tank 3 and has Infantry Weapons 2 (no tanks in combat so far) - but in version 1.02 this is more or less standard in SC2. It is very seldom Germany has not at least level 2-3 in all land techs at the start of Barbarossa. My scientists got a lot of ressources, so they only did their duty .. But these ressources were missing in the factories and since corps are king in SC2, not a single new tank nor an army has been built till now - only 1 german tank fighting in middle Russia .

Algeria has been liberated from the allied aggressors that invaded it in April 41, shortly after Tunesia got conquered. Iraq refused to believe the 5 axis diplomats (=chits) trying to convince them since early 1940, so Axis decided to demonstrate its power in a weapon test in Syria. Iraq was quite impressed and finally joined immediately .

Meanwhile Leningrad, Smolensk and Kharkov have been conquerd in the western part of Russia, Baku and its oil has been taken in Caucasus.