Chad Harrison Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 If you get a German tank hunter team, you get all sorts of cool things! Panzerfausts, grenade bundles, panzerwurfmines, and ATMM! And each one (maybe not the grenade bundles) can take out any tank on one hit! Then you get some Russian anti tank teams expecting them to be able to hold their own. Yet, you get some grenades and a few moltov cocktails. I have been able to maybe take out a tank here and there with Moltov's, but it always takes a lot of them from more than one antitank team! I have numerous times worked very hard to get those teams in close to armor, only to watch them throw all of the Moltov's and not a single effect against the tank, other than the tank backing up at times. Am I missing something, or are they just not effective tank killers? Chad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 I've noticed some tank types seem to dislike molotovs much more than others. Open-top types positively hate them, I've even got one or two catastrophic explosions out of the deal! Work best in city environments, of course. But in general they work just about as well you'd expect a glass bottle full of petrol would work against a tank. Now we see why Russia suffered 14 million(?) dead during the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auggy Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 I've KO'd a few tanks but not that many. I see em as more of a last ditch weapon that is your only asset left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiozox Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Managed to kill a PZ3 crew member (probably the commander) in the pavlovs house scenario, the crew panicked and bailed out as my men sprayed them to the next world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falkao Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 In the Citadel demo scenario, the only time I played as the Russians I managed to take out one MkIII (at the 4th molotov) and one MkIV (2nd molotov), both from the flank and at about 25m... they seem fine to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishu Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 It should be tested sometime.. I believe it works better on early tanks than later tanks. The idea was to try get the molotov break over the engine deck which wasn't very well protected against something like that in early tanks. ...but as long as you have satchels, you're fine In one game one pioneer group soloed out T34, one BT5 and went to finish off second BT5 which was stuck for some reason after few 20mm from Lahti L39, but refused to be abandoned or knocked out. T34 and BT5 blew up on one satchel and the last BT5 was finished with grenades. Obviously grenades works, at least.. albeit it took few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mg42 Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 At first I thought Molotov Cocktails weren't very useful but then i took out a Kingtiger with only two of them. Now I have a lot of respect for them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Harrison Posted October 9, 2002 Author Share Posted October 9, 2002 I did not doubt that the Moltov Cocktail COULD destroy any given AFV, my point was that you have to play for a long time to get that to happen! Halftracks and open top AFV's are the best targets obviously. My point was just that the German anti tank squads get so much stuff, and the best weapon that the russian anti tank teams get is two SMG's. I have had more success with them against infantry than vehicles! Chad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Poppa Pump Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Chad, Seems to me your question is more about play balance. It does seem that the German have the advantage of better anti-tank weapons. Have you seen a Russian tank hunter with an RPG? I believe they are available sometime in 1943. If you can get one into position (around 30 meters) they are deady against just about anything. For play balance it would be nice to have a bazooka team available for the Russians (at either an extremely high rarity penalty or simply not available with rarity on). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkybax Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 To MikeyD. 24 millions of deads. 13 milions civilians. But they won. And the 05.01.1945 on the Reichstag in Berlin there was a red flag. We owe something to them, I suppose. Bye. Funkybax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Well, the Germans had a much better incentive to get on top of the anti-tank problem than the Soviets. I think it made sense in Real Life™. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pak40 Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by Chad Harrison: Am I missing something, or are they just not effective tank killers? ChadIf a bottle of diesel gas was truely an effective AT weapon then we'd see lots of tanks use incindiary rounds as AT weapons instead of AP rounds. Just a thought. I think the FOLLOW command might play a part in knocking out any AFV. It may help in getting your team in closer to the vehicle and greaty increase the the chance of scoring a hit on a "soft" spot of the vehicle. After all, Molotovs can only really be effective against a tank in placed in the right spot or maybe used in bulk. But the closer you can get should increase your chances of hitting the vehicle. I have yet to use the FOLLOW command but I shall experiment with it soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JunoReactor Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by funkybax: To MikeyD. 24 millions of deads. 13 milions civilians. But they won. And the 05.01.1945 on the Reichstag in Berlin there was a red flag. We owe something to them, I suppose. Well said. Raw numbers do not mean much, but multiply every single person you have seen in your lifetime by some factor and imagine every single one of them dying or dead in the war... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishu Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 bigpoppapump, Russians did have some captured panzerfausts/panzershrecks (mostly fausts) and Bazookas as part of the lend lease deals with the western allies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Lucke Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by Andreas: Well, the Germans had a much better incentive to get on top of the anti-tank problem than the Soviets. I think it made sense in Real Life™.Yah, when you outnumber yr enemy 5:1 in tanks and 10:1 in ATG's, there isn't a real push to develop man-portable AT weapons. Unless you count the radio: "Privet Battalion? We need a company of T-34's to deal with the single StuG to our immediate front, over." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Pak 40 writes: "If a bottle of diesel gas was truely an effective AT weapon then we'd see lots of tanks use incindiary rounds as AT weapons instead of AP rounds." The U.S. did just that! The Sherman 75mm gun was so ineffective against Tigers and Panthers they resorted (out of desperation) to smoke shells and White Phospherous rounds to help even the odds. The germans really didn't like the American smoke shells. And at least in '45 fighter/bombers were dropping Napalm onto German heavy tanks. Admitedly, that's an order of magnitude greater than tossing a 16 ounce bottle of gas at something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dd Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Having actually been set alight by a molotov cocktail dont knock the "psychological effects" associated with either yourself, or your vehicle, being set on fire. Ive seen lots of folk panic even under test conditions with fire-extinguisher close to hand. Fire is very much something the human mind is condition to fear, add to that beign stuck inside a metl coffin stacked with explosive ammo, unable to go outside due to lots of little bits of lead trying to get you and... As I dont have the game yet (waiting on US copy to get to the UK) i cant tell - but how often do molotovs cause crew to bail out without actually damaging the AFV. Is this modelled at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunnersman Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by Andreas: Well, the Germans had a much better incentive to get on top of the anti-tank problem than the Soviets. I think it made sense in Real Life ™.What's with the trade mark after "Real Life". Anyone? Just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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