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The point of half-tracks ?


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Most of what I have read seems to indicate that the M3 was a cheap and easy to work on vehicle with good reliability.

The German HT's on the other hand are considered to have better off road ability (because of their longer tread length. It would be more realistic to consider them 3/4 tracks than 1/2 tracks.) but achieve this using a much more complex and difficult to manufacture steering system design.

The open top HT proved too vulnerable to air attack and shell splinters. Towards the end of the war the Germans had a very modern looking replacement on the drawing boards. It used the the pzkpfw 38t chasis lengthened with an extra roadwheel and was fully enclosed with rear doors and a 20mm turret. However, as with most of Germany's late war projects, it became just a pipedream.

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Originally posted by flamingknives:

@ Hans:

Mine was called that first. tongue.gif

I don't know I did that one a few months ago based on a scenario in the Marine Gazette, about combat engineers-unfortunately the AI wouldn't behave and the scenario, complete in all respects sits there unused. Every once and awhile I look at it and try to figure out how to get the dang thing to work.

I'm rename it Small Battles, All in a day's work, NOT!

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Here's my two cents on halftrack tactics.

If you have a few you can load up a squad in the rear and then wait for developments. You will be ready to deliver fresh reinforcements at any point in the field. With the armor and .50s you can get closer than a truck.

I keep them away from areas with tanks, guns, and HMGs. But there are always places where you have mainly infantry to deal with, and the HTs shine there.

As mentioned before by someone, you can run across open areas as long as there are no tanks around, or plenty of smoke.

Basically, I just hold them for the missions that come up where they work well, otherwise, I just set them in relatively safe places, covering obscure enemy lanes of travel. It's kind of like fishing, you sit there doing nothing, then all of a sudden you catch a few.

Will

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"Why (especially) did the Germans go from the 251 to the 250 which (in CM at least) carries half as many men?"

Remember, the U.S. has the ubiquitous M3 troop transport halftrack, but also the M2 halftrack based on the same chassis but with a shorter/lighter bed area. in-game graphic not withstanding, the M2 didn't even have a rear door! The first was designed to haul infantry squads, the latter was designed for recon duties and later hauling 6 pdrs about..

In the end the U.S. came to the same conclusion as you on the halftrack's utility and had already stopped halftrack production my mid-44, if memory serves.

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I guess the thing I still can't understand is the universal carrier. If you're going to design a tracked APC primarily for ferrying soldiers, and if you have a thinly-stretched industrial base like Britain, why would you build UC-sized vehicles when you could build half as many somewhat larger vehicles to carry the same amount of men? (I assume that a "half-capacity" tracked vehicle required rather more than half of the resources required to build a full-sized one, since each vehicle requires a complete drive train, steering mechanism, etc.)

To put it in CM terms, why would would you base your mechanized divisions on team-carrying vehicles instead of squad-carrying ones?

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Originally posted by Martyr:

I guess the thing I still can't understand is the universal carrier. If you're going to design a tracked APC primarily for ferrying soldiers, and if you have a thinly-stretched industrial base like Britain, why would you build UC-sized vehicles when you could build half as many somewhat larger vehicles to carry the same amount of men? (I assume that a "half-capacity" tracked vehicle required rather more than half of the resources required to build a full-sized one, since each vehicle requires a complete drive train, steering mechanism, etc.)

To put it in CM terms, why would would you base your mechanized divisions on team-carrying vehicles instead of squad-carrying ones?

But did they have a operational concept of mechanised infantry? Was it not "motor" thisandthat? I'm not really the right man to speculate here I guess, but it seems to me that the UK/CW did not seriously contemplate - in a coneptual sense - mechanised units until very late in the war, say 44. And then the Kangaroo appears, concentrated in special armoured transport regiments, and US LL Halftracks are seen equipping the now armoured infantry.

If so, the UK would not have developed any squadsized armoured carrier because they saw no need of one, nor a place for one within their concept of mobile warfare. A small fast scout/supply/medical vehicle was perhaps all they ordered from the industry.

The carriers were, as far as I know, never assigned to carry motor battalion infantry. They appear in scout platoons, in liaison units and as GP vehicles.

Or is this impression wrong, anyone more UK-grog-ish?

Cheerio

Dandelion

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Dandelion has the right idea for the UC, although it was used in some places as personnel carriers. There was also another type of vehicle - the loyd carrier - which was designed to carry full squads, but generally ended up as a gun tractor.

Although the British did design the first example of an APC, the MkIX, they then left off until the acceptance of the US halftrack and the later development of the Kangaroo. Up until then, softskins were used to transport the infantry.

Motorised infantry was lavishly equipped with trucks, with armoured carriers for scouting, carrying ammo, command vehicles etc.

In terms of transport, a British infantry unit was often better equipped than a German mechnized unit of the same size.

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