manchildstein (ii) Posted July 29, 2003 Share Posted July 29, 2003 if memory serves, 'hammers with eggshells' was jasonc's way of describing a lot of the armored combat in nw europe in 1944-45. the basic idea was that most afvs had a sufficient gun or 'hammer' to smash the armor or 'eggshell' of another afv. by the same token, most afvs had themselves had an insufficient 'eggshell' to withstand the fire of the 'hammers' of enemy afvs. extrapolating this concept to 1941 in the east, we see that the soviet t26 and bt tanks, and the german wheeled armored cars and pzjg I tank destroyers are further examples of vehicles capable of scoring kills, but not withstanding any kind of hostile fire. the reason i bring this up is that, for me as a cm player it is 'sheer joy' to score a kill with a vehicle which itself is incapable of taking return fire. this kind of kill means that i have completed a successful manuever. and manuever itself is perhaps the most important access of a successful engagement. in short, i enjoy employing the 'thin-skinned' vehicles of either side. and one of the greatest challenges is that of gaining success with light armor in 1941, for such vehicles as those listed above a vulnerable even to machinegun fire, let alone cannons. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Originally posted by manchildstein II: the reason i bring this up is that, for me as a cm player it is 'sheer joy' to score a kill with a vehicle which itself is incapable of taking return fire.Sort of like winning at Russian Roulette. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Manchild, You are quite correct with your joy with manuvering, using, and especially succeeding with "eggshells with hammers". :eek: This highlights the tremendous benefits of near invulnerable frontal armor (NIFA). One needs to be careful with NIFA, but not nearly as careful as with eggshells. Also, even more enjoyable is using and succeeding with "eggshells with eggshells" (EWE). An EWE is an AFV that the enemy can easily kill from any aspect and that has a weapon that can only kill the enemy from a non frontal aspect. An example of an EWE would be a short barreled Sherman versus a Panther. If that puny Ronson can take out the Panther, the Ronson commander should be given a nice medal or two. Cheers, Richard [ July 29, 2003, 11:01 PM: Message edited by: PiggDogg ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undead reindeer cavalry Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 i love using sneaky eggshell tactics! nothing better than getting the enemy fooled right into the line of fire of some eggshell devils. those rear & side shots make my day! it's a lot like getting fast & sneaky move to the side or rear of SU-76s with some wimpy PZIIs. haha! hahaha! 20mm might! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppe Butcher Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Piggdogg,excuse me for butting in but I'm new here,and wonder if you can fill me in on this Poor Old Spike character who everybody seems to be talking about? All i know is that he's the retired Rugged Defense Ladder Leader and is apparently invincible,yet the word on the street is that you've had the guts to take him on in several recent fun games.Is he really as good as people say,or as perverted and mad as a hatter like others claim,or what?And did you win against him? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomm Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 I strongly protest against the eggshellyness of 1940er T34s when confronted with German 38mm guns! There. Edit: NO, I will not do a search! [ July 31, 2003, 07:52 AM: Message edited by: Rollstoy ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Originally posted by Steppe Butcher: Piggdogg,excuse me for butting in but I'm new here,and wonder if you can fill me in on this Poor Old Spike character who everybody seems to be talking about? All i know is that he's the retired Rugged Defense Ladder Leader and is apparently invincible,yet the word on the street is that you've had the guts to take him on in several recent fun games.Is he really as good as people say,or as perverted and mad as a hatter like others claim,or what?And did you win against him? He was only leading the ladder because of a poor scoring system. It rewards people who play much, but not neccessarily win often. The rugged defense scoring system is good for a community where veerybody plays about the same number of games. But in this case POS could lead with a win rate of somewhere around 2/3rds which is ridiculously low. Losing 1/3rd of your games against random people from a ladder is not impressive, remember that 80% or so of the players are very casual gamers.[*] The tournamenthouse scoring system was much better in balancing people with many and people with few games. POS is a person who reoccurs under different screen names on the BFC forums and gets banned regularily. Nobody would mind if he would behave under a new username but he screws it up every time. Poor soul. [*] I don't claim to be better than him. But many people with a lower rank arguably are. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Originally posted by manchildstein II: the reason i bring this up is that, for me as a cm player it is 'sheer joy' to score a kill with a vehicle which itself is incapable of taking return fire. this kind of kill means that i have completed a successful manuever. and manuever itself is perhaps the most important access of a successful engagement. in short, i enjoy employing the 'thin-skinned' vehicles of either side. and one of the greatest challenges is that of gaining success with light armor in 1941, for such vehicles as those listed above a vulnerable even to machinegun fire, let alone cannons. I agree but don't forget that thin vehicles are less effective in CM than in reality. The absolute spotting creates a lot more return fire than they would get in reality, especially when they are on the defense and sniping at individual targets. Also, CM is missing much of the camouflage benefit and the TRPs to raise anti-armor accuracy are pretty ineffective. In reality the eggshells would have the boresighted advantage for a good portion of a ridge, or a road. And they wouldn't lose the boresighting by driving back and then back into shooting position near the old one. But the speed advantage of the light vehicles is certainly there, so on the attack their effectivity is pretty close to reality, IMHO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Butcher, Hi, Mom. PoorOldSpike & I have played a number of BB games. Indeed, we are playing a BB game presently. Yes, he is "that" good and deserves his most high rating a Rugged Defense. Personnaly, I think that he should go back to RD & beat some butts. However, that is up to him & RD. I play CM pretty darn well, and I have learned a number of refinements to my tactics. He and I are well matched opponents. Yes, we have both beaten each other. He has won more than I have. Indeed, since I have learned (and he was most generous to share) some of his refinements to my tactics, our future games should be even closer. As far as POS's presonality. He is strident, very strident. He is a good guy if somewhat eclectic. However, everyone (certainly, me included) is somewhat weird. Thus, POS is like the rest of us, just more so. I like the guy. As far as POS's problems with BFC, that is up to the powers that be. I shall leave those issues to the parties concerned. Those issues are not my business. Personally, I do not rock the boat, but I am quite able to get my points across. Others don't necessarily follow or mimick my way of doing things. To each his own. :cool: Cheers, Richard [ July 31, 2003, 11:40 AM: Message edited by: PiggDogg ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted August 1, 2003 Share Posted August 1, 2003 Hi Mom. Bimp, bump, blimp, dimp, limp. Cheers, Richard 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 he is definitely not a good player. Even I could beat him. He refuses to play anything eklse than QB with a series of parameters very balanced towards eachother that gives him a chance of doing a lot of games. Just enough to keep on top of the ladder by winning just enough of them. Like redwolf said,he has taken advantages of the RD ladders scoring system. He also avoid playing the better players,like Fionn. Let me guess what OOB he uses now? Lots of Pak 40/MK IV's(off course all crack/elite with long 75mm guns in 1942)in a small map/village wooden/hills environment with about 25 turns and with the Russians attacking?? Try him to do a scenario with you or a QB with other parameters in 1944/45....bet he chickens out I even offered him to do a battle with forces made by other people to choose from,which he also refused to. Its a given fact that many of ther people on the RD ladder rathe see him dead cause he did a lot of harm to a first class community. I hope Madmatt sticks to his word and will contact his provider to ban him from the net permanently. henk 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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