Ace Pilot Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Why are there no dedicated scouting units in CM? I ask this question based only on my experience with the board game Squad Leader. The rules for a Scout (a single individual) were designed to permit the player to send out a Scout with the purpose of uncovering ambushes, snipers, find enemy occupied buildings, etc. What’s the rationale for not having something similar in CM? Why does an entire half squad, or other unit, have to be risked? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Did they really send out individuals on their own in real life? sounds a bit dodgy to me, unless you're talking about a sniper. CM has sharpshooters so you could probably use one of those. I think it's a bit more realistic to me to use a half squad than an individual. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 My impression—based on no particular authority but acquired just in general reading—is that two or three men were usually sent out for scouting. On the other hand, for aggressive patrolling or any situation where they were apt to run into trouble, entire squads or platoons were used. In that case, single men would be on point, but usually within visual range of the larger group. Also, single men or pairs would be doing flank and rear guard. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 There's probably a correlation between scouting/Recon unit size and scale. One could speculate the average scouting unit for a whole Division was at least company strength - which would just about put them at standard 'Quickbattle Meeting Engagement' size for CMBB. A scouting unit for a Battalion might be Platoon size? Scouting for a platoon would be team size? Much smaller than that and you're all the way down to the lead guy out in front of his squad walking point! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 two man tank hunter teams make great scouts -tom w 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 No Scouts? It's because their leaders couldn't get CRB checked in time. Campfire's burning, campfire's burning etc. [ May 13, 2003, 01:37 PM: Message edited by: flamingknives ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Pilot Posted May 13, 2003 Author Share Posted May 13, 2003 Several have mentioned that the unit scouting will change in size based upon the parent unit. Makes sense to me. But since CM deals with squad level units, I would assume that CM should have “point” units that scout for the squad and can reveal enemy ambushes without exposing the entire squad. Perhaps this is abstracted in the game and each squad does have a point man out. Because of the need to remain in contact, though, this point man never gets much beyond the little area the squad occupies. Anyone know if this is how it was done in Europe and Asia during WWII? Or were scouts sent out quite a ways ahead of the squad, where they had the opportunity to act independently? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Why does an entire half squad, or other unit, have to be risked?How does a single guy, separated from the rest of the bunch, give any information to his buddies? Walkie-talkies weren't common in those days. Have you seen Thin Red Line? There one man sneaks & crawls ahead to find out where the Japanese bunker is. Then he heads back to inform the company. In CM this just wouldn't work, because in most cases the scout would just get killed. On the other hand, player would instantly get all the information delivered to him even if the scout couldn't return alive, so it wouldn't matter. It is better to assume this kind of recon to have already taken place in CM assault scenarios, the information being given in the briefing. A man walking ahead of a squad could be assumed to be taking place in an abstracted way already. CM could maybe use some kind of "formation" commands, like those in Age of Rifles, so that you could tell whether you want your squad to move up in a column (for advancing through forest paths) or a line while shooting, and if you want to have a man ahead, you can do that but if he encounters the enemy, he's pretty much dead. But micromanaging these things for a battalion would just cause a brain meltdown. You don't really want to get to the level of telling them what coloured socks you want them to wear, unless you just have a dozen guys under your command. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nippy Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Have you seen Thin Red Line? There one man sneaks & crawls ahead to find out where the Japanese bunker is. Then he heads back to inform the company. In CM this just wouldn't work, because in most cases the scout would just get killed. Don't forget time restrictions too. With an average battle time of 30 to 45 turns, by the time your recon man/unit sneaked into the enemy lines, spotted units, and reported back, the battle would be just about over. However, one way to simulate Recon is through the use of Operations. For example: Soviet Assault: 4 Battle Operation Battle 1: 15 turns - Soviet player gets some jeeps and one Recon Platoon Battles 2 though 4: 30 turns - Surviving Recon units withdrawn from map. Regular forces arrive on map for the main assault. Any enemy units and fortifications spotted in battle have their last known location marked on the map. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Personally, I don't think those silly khaki uniforms, with shorts, green gaiters on pulled up socks, Canadian Mountie hats and a bunch of different coloured badges on the sleeves would look right in CMBB. What would they be armed with...Swiss army knives? Regards Jim R. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Originally posted by Kanonier Reichmann: What would they be armed with...Swiss army knives?Mind you, those knives kept Hitler from invading Switzerland. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 After the incident with the goat, Hitler is reported to have had a morbid fear of knives, even going so far as to use a spoon to spread his peanut butter. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted May 16, 2003 Share Posted May 16, 2003 Originally posted by Sergei: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Why does an entire half squad, or other unit, have to be risked?Have you seen Thin Red Line? There one man sneaks & crawls ahead to find out where the Japanese bunker is. Then he heads back to inform the company. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeauCoupDinkyDau Posted May 16, 2003 Share Posted May 16, 2003 We are the Borg. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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