mattwagner Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 Hi fellow Combat Mission addicts... Can any of you recommend a realistic modern tactical tabletop game? Preferably one that sticks to company level and smaller engagements. Also, modern, as in the last 25 years or so and preferably fits current US Army infantry(and combined arms) doctrine. I've been trying to find a copy of SPI's Firefight which I've heard fits that bill perfectly. I've gotten as far as finding out that Decision Games(www.decisiongames.com) still makes it, but 3 stores have already told me they're out of stock and their supplier doesn't have it anymore! Any recommendations would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CKibler Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 "Firepower", published by Avalon Hill in the mid to late '80's, was a man-to-man & vehicle-to-vehicle boardgame of (70's & 80's) modern combat. Had a very comprehensive forcelist, allowing for many nationalities. It's out of print I believe, but you might be able to pick up a copy. Can't say that I've played it though (at the time I was into ASL more). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 Oooh, it's THE Charlie Kibler, isn't it?! Hi! I have a copy of Firepower at home, never played it much. From what I remember you'd be fairly hard-pressed to model more than a platoon at its scale, although who am I to discourage the budding monster-gamer? ------------------ Leland J. Tankersley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vergeltungswaffe Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 Firepower was a good game if you don't exceed a squad in size. It gets somewhat unwieldy in the small area the boards simulate, otherwise. MBT and IDF aren't bad for company size engagements with a good selection of modern units. It is awesome to see Charlie Kibler on this board and know that you're a CM player. You and the rest of the people at Avalon Hill have contributed so much to my favorite lifelong hobby. I played SL from the time it came out, and still have it, along with everything ASL that ever came out. Computer gaming is terrific, but I really miss the great boardgaming years of sitting across from an opponent. Tell us what you're up to in gaming these days sometime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaffertape Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 An enthusiastic 'Welome to the Forum', Mr Kibler. GAFF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Mayer Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 Firefight was good in its day, but it's rather horribly dated now, at least in its weapon selection. It's from the era of T-62s and M-60s, with M113s and BMP-1s. It was an excellent theoretical tool though. On the PC or Mac you can get a copy of TacOps that also does a good job at the scale you're looking for. It's also a "laboratory" game given that it doesn't model too many "soft" factors like morale, but it's quite good, especially head to head. Other than that, the suggestions made above are about all you have to go with I think; board game sims of modern tactical combat haven't been that popular since the advent of PC games it seems. Used to be, in the era of SPI's heyday, you had games like Red Star/White Star, the two MechWar games, CityFight, etc. all the time.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt Steiner Posted November 28, 2000 Share Posted November 28, 2000 Hi Matt et al >Hi fellow Combat Mission addicts... Yep that would be me >Can any of you recommend a realistic modern >tactical tabletop game? I assume you mean Boardgame ? There are several sets of Miniatures Rulesets for this era if you are interested contact me by email and I will list a few. >I've been trying to find a copy of SPI's >Firefight Ah so it is the cardboard warriors you want 'Fireteam' by West End games was a Squad Level game with Soviets vs US Avalon Hill (RIP) had couple possibles 'Tac Air' 'Main Battle Tank' in addition to the already mentioned 'Firepower' BTW great to have C.Kibler & R.Mayer on the forum !! How are you chaps ?? I really do miss AH.......sniff....... Cheers ------------------ Sgt Steiner Belfast NI UK [This message has been edited by Sgt Steiner (edited 11-28-2000).] [This message has been edited by Sgt Steiner (edited 11-28-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 arent we forgeting something?????? SQUAD LEADER and ADVANCED SQUAD LEADER and last but no least Historical squad leader plus the ambush series by who?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattwagner Posted November 29, 2000 Author Share Posted November 29, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dogface: arent we forgeting something?????? SQUAD LEADER and ADVANCED SQUAD LEADER and last but no least Historical squad leader plus the ambush series by who?????? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hi, I know about SL and ASL, but I was under the impression that they are ww2 era games, though I suppose it wouldn't be too big of a diff. Ambush is by Victory Games, got it right here. It's a WW2 western front squad level game. Sort of a dirty half dozen type deal. Not exactly realistic, but it's kind of interesting to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pillar Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Matt Wagner, where have I heard that name before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidh Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 <<Matt Wagner, where have I heard that name before?> Comic artist and writer of 'Grendel' fame? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattwagner Posted November 29, 2000 Author Share Posted November 29, 2000 I've heard about a game called 'Ranger' published by Omega. Anyone have any info on this game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Matt- I found that ASL converted pretty easily to moderns. Treat helos as low-flying tanks, make all ATGMs fire first in a Fire Phase, but don't resolve fire effects until the very end of the Fire Phase, and you've pretty much got the two new weapon systems modelled. Everything else is just research and fiddling with factors until you get the numbers for squads, SW, and vehicles to where you think they are correct. Oh, and I used the excellent 'PF exponent usage' Rule for all LATW and squad AntiAir weapons. Give it a shot. Heck, maybe MultiMan Publishing will do a moderns version some day. And Mr. Kibler - thanks for all your work on all the games that I've played that you were a part of! Many thanks! -dale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maj. Bosco Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Uh... TacOps is not company and down. That's for battalions. Lots of them. I think the smallest unit represented is the platoon. Even for tanks. If you want to recreate a battle of oh say two or three divisions worth of troops then TacOps is an excellent game. I dl'd the demo only. It's a good game but I decided that I'm not that into recreating big ol fights. I like CM's scale, which incidentally deals with exactly the scale you want. 'Course this is all moot cuz you want a table top game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Los Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 I'd like to put in a good word for the Gamers Tacical Combat Series of games, Bloody 110, Force Eagles War, Gross Duetchland, A Frozen Hell, Leros, Semper Fi, etc etc etc. These are games with platoons and individual vehicles and you have to actually write out OPORDERS on OPSHeets before implementing the plans. Anyway, good games. Los Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Rudd Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 I can recomend Avalon Hill's Main Battle Tank and it's sister game IDF (Mid East). Both are great games. And I think you can still get them. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Maj. Bosco: Uh... TacOps is not company and down. That's for battalions. Lots of them. I think the smallest unit represented is the platoon. Even for tanks. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This is incorrect. TacOps models individual vehicles and squads/teams. Most of the scenarios pit either a company or battalion-sized US force against OPFOR (which may be as large as a regiment or more). TacOps will group (or "stack") like vehicles so you can issue orders to them as a group, but you can always break them down to individual vehicles if you want. ------------------ Leland J. Tankersley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoutPL Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 Force Eagle's War by The Gamers is probably the best tabletop game for modern combat I ever played. Simulates a Armor/Mech task force (battalion) going to bat against a Soviet MRR. Takes place in the middle east along the syrian/israeli frontier. Great game for praticing your armored warfighting skills at the company and battalion level. Game also came with a US ranger battalion to really mix things up a little. They inevitably get their butts handed to them by the way. I also bought the Bloody 110 game which simulates the fighting in the argonne during the Battle of the Bulge. I just used the map to play the Task Force Eagle game on, though. Great time fighting out WWIII at the battalion level. Game tried hard to look ahead too. Provided rules for giving the soviets reactive armor and thermal sights plus some other weapons in R&D with the US at the time. Most of which came to light, realworld. Great, authentic, realistic game, wish something similar came out for the PC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grognard Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 With others, I would recommend Avalon Hill's MBT (Main Battle Tank) and its sister IDF (Israeli Defense Force), along with Tac Air. Also along with others, I would like to welcome Charlie Kibler. I have spent many enjoyable hours moving cardboard troops across gameboards that featured his artwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMC Posted November 29, 2000 Share Posted November 29, 2000 I liked Firepower even though it was just a modern redo of the old Yaquinto game "Close Assault" which was a WWII game. The phased chit system for moves worked pretty well. MBT and IDF are also updates of old Yaquinto designs using the system from the "Armor", "Panzer" and "88" games. I only had MBT and thought it fun but a little deterministic. There was no variability in weapon penetration so things were like rock, paper, scissors. An example that I will never forget is an M901 ITV shooting ITOWs at my T-72s who were silhouetted on a hill. The ITOW chemical pentration number (being HEAT) was 140. The armor value of the T-72 glacis when hit from a lower angle was 141. My opponent took a couple of shots and even moved his ITV closer before realising he could never achieve a kill with the TOW because of the angle of attack. I'd also recommend the "Assault" series from GDW. It focused on Europe in 1985. There were modules that included the Brits and the Bundeswehr. Unit scale was platoons and map scale was 250m. Trying to tackle a company of Challengers with T-80s was really rough... The Ranger game from Omega was a solitaire patrolling game not a "real" wargame. I always wanted to get it back in the day but never got around to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattwagner Posted November 29, 2000 Author Share Posted November 29, 2000 Hi all, thanks for all the recommendations. Now I just have to see if I can find any of them, heh heh. Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts