Steve Clark Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 I'm just wondering something. The wargame experience of some of us here is solely hex-based (eg, West Front, East Front, etc.), as oppose to C&C, Panzer General, etc. For those that have played on hexes and now play CM, will you go back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sniperscope Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Only if BTS falls off the face of the map. sniperscope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R-Man Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Nope. Why eat hamburger when you can have steak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Well, I play CM and I will play Third Reich! I love hexes and I love CM (if I ever get the full version!) My hard disk has enough free space to host CM and SPW@W and TOAW... Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jowa Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 That would be like going back to B/W T.V's or mono record players. :} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reckall Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Well, honestly speaking, East and West Front, by Talonsoft, have a lot of scenarios, excellent TCP/IP graphics and a good playability. They are in a different league, slightly worse but not so muich (and somethimes I LOVE the old "hexes and turns" system, makes me feel nostalgic, non to talk about the "tabletop minatures" graphics") And Tigers on the Prowl and Panthers in the Shadows by HPS are VERY detailed, accurate, with a lot of chrome and a "we go" system non quite different from CM. In my book CM must still provide more theatres (Exp. the Russian Front done by the book) and units before going head to head against games that, basically, gave you all WWII in a box or two. OTOH, CM standa heads and shoulders above the competition for immersivenes and overall game system. Can't wait for CM2!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeer Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Go back I never left. CM is the best computer strategy game out there but I still like SL/ASL. There is nothing like sitting around a table with a friend and playing SL/ASL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holman Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Interesting question. I imagine that most CM players enjoy games at other scales, and right now hexes are the only way to go for operational-level games. I love the CM system, but I'm definitely also waiting for 82ND AIRBORNE, the sequel to 101ST AIRBORNE IN NORMANDY. This is a hex- (or square-) based game at the level of individual soldiers. It's a different experience from CM: almost like a role-playing game, or like a very realistic X-COM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisl Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 My background is not only hex based, but cardboard. I never got into computer wargames (I find it odd when people here sometimes talk about wargaming as if it were a solely a computer thing). I would really rather not go back. I can play a full game of a fairly large scenario in less time than a single turn used to take, and without taking up a 4x8 foot sheet of plywood in the basement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supertanker Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeer: Go back I never left. CM is the best computer strategy game out there but I still like SL/ASL. There is nothing like sitting around a table with a friend and playing SL/ASL. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I used to play a lot of SL, and I also negotiate a fair number of contracts. So, I can tell you that arguing with an insurance company's lawyer about some tiny, yet precise, change to an indemnity clause is a lot like playing in an SL tournament. Depending on what your friends are like, that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisl Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Hehe. I've been learning the same thing. I'm on the technical side of some aerospace contract stuff, but the contract negotiators like me because I take some interest in the rules, too. But then I also like to play Diplomacy (with the wooden pieces is preferred). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibsonm Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Well CM sure beats arguing with someone about opportunity fire during bypass movement and rolling dice everytime I even thought of doing something (don't you just love ASL). Not to mention the time spent setting up the game and then trying to keep the stacks of units and info markers under control. However, CM doesn't cover some of the time periods that I like so I'll stick with Steel Panthers II and III for those. But again I don't think my micro armour collection will be deploying anytime soon. ------------------ Regards, Mark:-{) Anxiously awaiting the G4 PowerBook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berlichtingen Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 By background is in minitures, so I've never liked hexes. Will I go back to minitures? Never left. Will I go out and start buying computer wargames? No... well until CM2 that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailz Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by chrisl: ... I can play a full game of a fairly large scenario in less time than a single turn used to take, and without taking up a 4x8 foot sheet of plywood in the basement.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Does anyone else here have AH's The Longest Day? Now there is a monster! Days just to set up... kitchen table (not for the map... just the support sheets!) ...snif... ah, the nostalgia of it all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penubly Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Nothing can stand up to the hours I spent with my friends arguing LOS, etc. The fun of setting up and playing company size actions on a gym floor was the best. But CM is rapidly giving me the same quality experiences. It is a fitting replacement, now that most of my wargaming pals have gone their seperate ways. It is so convenient an opportunity to experience, now that I actually have to work to support myself and my family!! ------------------ Always with the negative waves, Moriarty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaffertape Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 I can picture playing SL again many years from now with my best pal as a nostalgia thing... That's about it though. GAFF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 I've tossed all my computer games except SP:WaW. Combat Mission has been my main focus. I want to really concentrate on this game. I have kept some of my board wargames, and still play them occasionally Air Force and Dauntless and Submarine...reminds me of my roots! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmonster Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 I'll be keeping all my "Front" games and "Operational" games and others due to the difference in scales and subjects. That said,..... they will be gathering MUCHO dust for quite some time! Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmonster Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 I'll be keeping all my "Front" games and "Operational" games and others due to the difference in scales and subjects. That said,..... they will be gathering MUCHO dust for quite some time! Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leclerc Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Steve Clark: I'm just wondering something. The wargame experience of some of us here is solely hex-based (eg, West Front, East Front, etc.), as oppose to C&C, Panzer General, etc. For those that have played on hexes and now play CM, will you go back?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Tactical wargames: No Operational and Strategic: Yes. Because 3D has no real value for these scales and Wego systems aren't very realistic when time scale is several hours or days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 Mostly I agree with Leclerc. For me, hexes never really felt right for tactical games, but for operational or strategic games I can't see doing without them. I got Operation Crusader several years back. It has an option for turning off the hexsides. Makes the map look better without them, but it made visualizing my moves more of a strain. No problem at all in that regard with CM because the movement system is completely different. But I think wego works just fine at any scale. Also acceptable is continuous-time that can be paused while you give orders, but I prefer turns. Michael [This message has been edited by Michael emrys (edited 07-06-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Clark Posted July 6, 2000 Author Share Posted July 6, 2000 I think the points brought up about scale is right on. I don't know what's the time duration for the Front games, but the Civil War ones are 20 minutes per turn during the day. I just don't see using the CM game engine to plan moves for the next 20 minutes (or longer for operational scenarios) and then hit go. The only way I can conceive this happening in an immersive 3D world is that the units are abstracted to companies or regiments, as oppose to individuals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leclerc Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael emrys: But I think wego works just fine at any scale. Also acceptable is continuous-time that can be paused while you give orders, but I prefer turns. Michael [This message has been edited by Michael emrys (edited 07-06-2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> problem with WEGO is once you gived your orders to your units, you can't modify them. I can accept that for a 4 hours sale as in Atomic VfV and W@W series; I WILL NOT BUY any wego system where I can't give an order to my division until the next day: it would be totally unrealistic. Continous time with pause sounds good but I doubt PBEM possible. Regards, Laurent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisl Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tailz: Does anyone else here have AH's The Longest Day? Now there is a monster! Days just to set up... kitchen table (not for the map... just the support sheets!) <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Always thought it was cool, but never got to play. It cost too much for a 14 year old when it came out, and the geometry of the board wasn't quite right to work in my mom's basement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iggi Posted July 6, 2000 Share Posted July 6, 2000 The thing I dislike about continuous time is that when the clock is running, the cpu is coordinating faster than you. IGOWEGO is the best compromise. The problem with all those hexgames that looked really cool was all those rules.The host of errata and the various interpretations.They were good for thier time. I honestly picked up the sense for the flow of power from Red Alert. Don't laugh, there's alot to learn from timing, prioritising and deception. It's the crux of either winning or being screwed. Big guns also help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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