Mauser Markus Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 I really hope that later releases of CM have better looking tracers. Especially when you zoom in close, the bullets come out looking like huge 2 foot wide fake bright color blobs. It really detracts from the amazing graphics of the rest of the game. Some scenes look like they are right out of a movie they look so fantastic, but then comes the big tracer blobs and then it looks like we are in a Buck Rogers comic book. I think the tank rounds look fantastic. But they just need to improve the bullet tracers. When you zoom out, they look not much better, even though they are considerably thinner. It's true they help you see where the fire is going/coming from, but they still look fake. Tracers should leave a fading trail, with a bright point at the front kind of like a comet traveling in an arc due to gravity, and they should be bright white, not gaudy rellow and red. There has to be a way to pull it off! Just one more reason to be patient, sit tight and keep playing the demo until improved versions are realeased in a year or two. $53 is a lot of money to spend on a game that just isn't quite as good as it could be. Don't get me wrong, this game has got some unbeatable characteristics, but I just have this nagging feeling that it needs a little more polish before it makes the "all time best seller" list. For example, a "core" units campaign option with troops that can be built up, customized, and upgraded with prestige points purchases would be fantastic for us mainstream ("gamey" as you call it) Panzer General fans. It may be unrealistic, as some put it, but hey, it's FUN! Why gripe about something that makes a game more FUN for some people. Do you fans want this great product to make it into the permanent collection of every hot blooded gamer on the planet or not? This great game is a diamond in the rough, why argue against options that could refine this game and make it appealing to more people. They could always include the option to turn "core units" off for those people who are annoyed by it. But include it just for FUN!!! FUN is what games are supposed to be! FUN should not be sacrificed for the sake of "gamey" vs. "non-gamey" semantics arguments. Total "non-gamey" games are often so serious that they are the least FUN games of all! No game, not even CM, can claim to be perfectly "non gamey". But any game can be improved by attracting a larger audience, but you have to make a game flexible to be appealing to a broader audience. Give the option of "gameyness" to the people who play the gamer rather than completely take the option away because of a desinger's or programmers personal opinions of what makes a game "gamey" and what doesn't. Everyone has a different opinion about "gameyness" anyway, so why get so caught up worrying about it. Just make the best damn game there ever was, bar none. They almost have it, but not quite. They just need to include as many options as they can to satisfy everyones cravings and then they will have the all time best war game series going, period. And I'll faithfully buy every expansion pack they make from now until the day I die. But for now, I just have to sit and wait with rest of the world who hasn't taken the bait yet. I have to pass for now...but I'll keep checking back and be on the lookout for later releases. (All the while keeping my checkbook handy and ready for action.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiram Sedai Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 regarding tracers. I don't think the game actually uses them. What is shown is a graphic representation of the two sides shooting each other. Something I read a while ago. ------------------ Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. - Blaise Pascal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rob/1 Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Yes it talks about this in the CM manual that evry thing you see is just a repsntion of computer punched numbers. Not the other way around. ------------------ Game master of Robs CMC Join Robs CMC2 today! Email me at RobsCMC@hotmail.com Rob -------------------------- For more info on Rob's CMC go to Robs CMC HQHome of Robs CMC Members of my CMC should join my CMC chat bord. Robs CMC Board BHQS board Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor Malan Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Mauser Markus, I would suggest you search on some of the topics you mention, because BTS has answered them several times (I specifically remember 'tracers', and 'campaigns') In my opinion, trying to be all things to all people is what usually undoes games, not makes them. Oh, and you might be flamed by some of the more die hard CM enthusiasts, so you might want to duck! ------------------ The conception of such a plan was impossible for a man of Montgomery's innate caution...In fact, Montgomery's decision to mount the operation ...[Market Garden] was as startling as it would have been for an elderly and saintly Bishop suddenly to decide to take up safe breaking and begin on the Bank of England. (R.W.Thompson, Montgomery the Field Marshall) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Havermeyer- Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 You know what I really like... ...carriage returns... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mauser Markus: Tracers should leave a fading trail, with a bright point at the front kind of like a comet traveling in an arc due to gravity, and they should be bright white, not gaudy rellow and red. There has to be a way to pull it off! Just one more reason to be patient, sit tight and keep playing the demo until improved versions are realeased in a year or two. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This is the funniest post I have read in a long time - it is truly hilarious. Even better than Hiram's 'Hi mom' - I almost spewed the Champagne over the keyboard. You should consider a life as a comedian! ------------------ Andreas <a href="http://www.geocities.com/greg_mudry/sturm.html">Der Kessel</a > Home of „Die Sturmgruppe“; Scenario Design Group for Combat Mission. [This message has been edited by Germanboy (edited 12-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Uh bub, did you happen to take notice on how many posts this board has? Over 150 THOUSAND! Since you are a brand new player, there is no need to really trash your arguments, but there are THOUSANDS of people playing and LOVING this game. And not making the all-time best sellers list? BTS sold-out of its initial stock of 2 months in just 2 weeks. The tracer graphics were done like this, red and yellow, so you can SEE them and so you can tell who's firing at whom. Red for Axis, Yellow for Allied. About core units. In fact, it is VERY unrealistic to have core units since most units in a war only saw action in a campaign or two. Hell in Vietnam, most soldiers only did one or two Tour of Duties. They didn't fight through the entire war. CM's battles are more like firefights rather than full fledged campaigns. A little more polish? We are on our SIXTH patch since it's release back in July. And these patches normally just tweak the AI or fix some hard to find gameplay bugs. Besides this game took THREE years to develop, BTS has polished this game WAAY much more than any other company would even ever dream of. I'm sorry if you're put off because CM's game system isn't like all the previous wargame systems. But this is what makes CM shine. Because it is different. PS. OK guys, let'em have it! ------------------ "We're not gonna just shoot the bastards`, we're gonna cut out their living guts, and use them to grease the treads of our tanks." "We're going to murder those lousey hun bastards by the buschel." "The Nazis are the enemy, wade into them, spill their blood, shoot them in the belly." "We are not holding our position, let the hun do that." "We are advancing constantly, we are not interested in holding onto anything except the enemy." "We're gonna hold onto him by the nose, and we're gonna kick him in the ass." "We're gonna kick the hell out of him all the time, and we're going to go through him like crap through a goose."--George S. Patton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Capt Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 For the love of Pete! OK I am willing to listen to a good critique and believe everyone is entitled to their opinion but this is freakin ridiculous. CM is a quantum leap forward in wargaming. It has taken the player from the "God on high position" into the trenches, where we can here the blood, mud and fire. It has presented an AI which for the most part is frightening in it's ability and rolled the whole thing into a good looking package. I've been playing computer wargames for 16 yrs and trust me this game will be looked upon as the "seed" concept for future wargaming. Now all you can do is bitch about the "look" of the tracers and whine about the lack of a "gamey" campaign!!!!???? Don't get me wrong CM is not perfect but if you are going to provide input to make it better at least make it intelligent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Germanboy: This is the funniest post I have read in a long time - it is truly hilarious. Even better than Hiram's 'Hi mom' - I almost spewed the Champagne over the keyboard. You should consider a life as a comedian! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ain't that the truth, Andreas? I was like, OH BOY where to begin??? Nothing like an uninformed newbie coming in here and saying what he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rob/1 Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Maxium just a correction both side have red tracers it just depend what side you are on. ie if you are allied you see axis fire as yellow if you are axis you see ALlied fire as yellow. Have you not played for both sides yet Maxiums? It only been out for 5 month! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 I suggest you put down the drugs Rob, indeed the Allies' tracers are ALWAYS yellow as is the Axis tracers ALWAYS red. Unless indeed, you are dyllexic. [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 12-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolguy101 Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 actually regarding the tracer colors the allies and axis did use diffrent colors. ive read accounts where they new they weren't taking friendly fire behind enemy lines because they didn't have those color tracers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rob/1 Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Maximus: I suggest you put down the drugs Rob, indeed the Allies' tracers are ALWAYS yellow as is the Axis tracers ALWAYS red. Unless indeed, you are dyllexic. [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 12-15-2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I do drugs eh! Well I unlike you play Axis and allied and (maby this is diffrent for Macs and P.C) My CM has both side depending on wich side you are on ie if you are the player that side see red and the other side is yellow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jshandorf Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Geesus.. Does it matter? As long as one side is different from the other is all I care about. Ack! Jeff ------------------ I once killed a six pack just to watch it die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rob/1 Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Good pont that was stupied. Fighing over tracers hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jshandorf Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 From a historical sense tracers were rarely used in ground combat situations. Usually tracers were calibered in the AA rounds for obvious reasons. The reason tracers were rarely used in ground combat should be kind of obvious. If you can see where your shots are going THEY can see where your shots are coming from. Jeff ------------------ I once killed a six pack just to watch it die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Rob, Rob, Rob, Rob, Rob! I do play both sides, again I ask you to put down the drugs. The Allies FIRE yellow tracers. The Germans FIRE red tracers. It doesn''t make a hoop and a holler difference on which side you play! If you play the Germans, they will fire red, if you play against the Germans, the Germans will fire red. If you play the Allies, they will fire yellow. If you play against the Allies, the Allies will still fire yellow. How many different ways can I say this??? Maybe it's your glasses? Clean them or something. Maybe it is different from PC to Mac, but this is the first I've heard of it. Besides, IIRC, CMHQ ran a graphic feature WAAY back, even before the Gold Demo, detailing the different tracer graphics. [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 12-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Havermeyer- Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 I couldn't agree more with this poster. Combat Mission will never be considered good, without the following: Campaigns, "core" units, blood and body parts on the ground, B-17s, actual ships off shore, BFG9000s, magic coins, potions, scrolls, word puzzles, X-wings, real-time multi-user options, first person perspectives, sex scenes, and the chance to buy a freaking Brummbar! AND ALL IN ONE GAME FOR LESS THAN $35 (INCLUDING SHIPPING)!!!!!!!! ...Otherwise, I'm not buying it until they issue at least 1 patch, and come out with CM(pi). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiram Sedai Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Maximus: Rob, Rob, Rob, Rob, Rob! I do play both sides, again I ask you to put down the drugs. The Allies FIRE yellow tracers. The Germans FIRE red tracers. It doesn''t make a hoop and a holler difference on which side you play! If you play the Germans, they will fire red, if you play against the Germans, the Germans will fire red. If you play the Allies, they will fire yellow. If you play against the Allies, the Allies will still fire yellow. How many different ways can I say this??? Maybe it's your glasses? Clean them or something. Maybe it is different from PC to Mac, but this is the first I've heard of it. Besides, IIRC, CMHQ ran a graphic feature WAAY back, even before the Gold Demo, detailing the different tracer graphics. [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 12-15-2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, thanks Maximus. That was educating for me. Think you can stop with the personal attacks on Rob/1 yet? You can pick on me instead. I'm an easy target. You can try to spell dyslexic if ya want. ------------------ Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. - Blaise Pascal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooleen Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 I am a newbie, and this guy is f'ing crazy. I have been playing diff. war games for years, but never NEVER have I played a game as good as this one. Let these guys play their Half-Life and Roller Coaster Tycoon. The AI alone in this game for the most part is the best I have seen for any game any time. Secondly, the MOD community and forums provide more tech. support and replay value than any game on the market. The only other publisher I've seen with this much dedication to their product was Bungie (Myth I and II: www.bungie.net) but they sold out to Microsoft and I digress. Flame ON! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Tom Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 I do sort of understand where you are coming from. Jumping into CM from PzGeneral or SP is a big step. However, asking Steve and Charles to sacrifice reality purely for fun, would be like asking one Degas to paint a bunch of Dogs playing Pool, or a portait of Elvis. He might sell more copies, but, he has sacrificed his integrity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samhain Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Re: Havermeyer--Huzzah! A marketing genius is born ------------------ Hope you got your things together, Hope you are quite prepared to die. --CCR [This message has been edited by Samhain (edited 12-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hiram Sedai: Well, thanks Maximus. That was educating for me. Think you can stop with the personal attacks on Rob/1 yet? You can pick on me instead. I'm an easy target. You can try to spell dyslexic if ya want. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, I said it once, and he still doesn't get it and accused me of only playing one side. So unless he's smokin' somefink, he's lost it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeski Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Hi Mom! (Sorry for the rip-off but that was hilarious and this one is locked for sure) Now what color is a tracer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>You know what I really like... ...carriage returns... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Havermeyer, that was brilliant. Carriage returns, even! DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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