ActionMan Posted February 6, 2007 Share Posted February 6, 2007 I was just playing Villers-Bocage - Tiger! Hot Seat with my teenage son. He was most disappointed when Wittmann's Tiger was immobilised at the very end (60 sec) of turn 4. It appears to have been stopped by my M3A1 half-track, armed with a 0.3" and a 0.5" machine gun. It was then very easy for my Crommwells to get behind it and take it out. Wittmann was killed shortly after abandoning the knocked out tank. How is it possible for a half-track to stop a Tiger, or was it an AI generated immobilisation to represent the poor mechanical reliability of the Tiger? :confused: The tank was still on the road, so it would not have been due to bogging. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyEnglish Posted February 6, 2007 Share Posted February 6, 2007 Can't see how in 'real-life'... http://www.fprado.com/armorsite/tiger1.htm The 13.(Tiger) Kompanie, of Panzer Regiment Großdeutschland, reported on the armor protection of the Tiger: "During a scouting patrol two Tigers encountered about 20 Russian tanks on their front, while additional Russian tanks attacked from behind. A battle developed in which the armor and weapons of the Tiger were extraordinarily successful. Both Tigers were hit (mainly by 76.2 mm armor-piercing shells) 10 or more times at ranges from 500 to 1,000 meters. The armor held up all around. Not a single round penetrated through the armor. Also hits in the running gear, in which the suspension arms were torn away, did not immobilize the Tiger. While 76.2 mm anti-tank shells continuously struck outside the armor, on the inside, undisturbed, the commander, gunner, and loader selected targets, aimed, and fired. The end result was 10 enemy tanks knocked out by two Tigers within 15 minutes" (JENTZ, Thomas L.; Germany's TIGER Tanks - Tiger I and II: Combat Tactics; op. cit.).Haven't been playing CM long enough to know how or if it could happen in-game though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil aka Major Tum Posted February 6, 2007 Share Posted February 6, 2007 Originally posted by ActionMan: I was just playing Villers-Bocage - Tiger! Hot Seat with my teenage son. He was most disappointed when Wittmann's Tiger was immobilised at the very end (60 sec) of turn 4. It appears to have been stopped by my M3A1 half-track, armed with a 0.3" and a 0.5" machine gun. It was then very easy for my Crommwells to get behind it and take it out. Wittmann was killed shortly after abandoning the knocked out tank. How is it possible for a half-track to stop a Tiger, or was it an AI generated immobilisation to represent the poor mechanical reliability of the Tiger? :confused: The tank was still on the road, so it would not have been due to bogging. From my limited experience, did the Tiger get 'shocked' i.e a crew memeber killed first? Dont think the AI is that advanced either. But strange things happen in this game, which is why it makes it so great. I bet that if you played it again that you could not re-create this! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 The MGs wouldn't immobilize the tank in CM. But pretty much everything else can. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skolman Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 It might be possible that the 50.cal immobilized the tank but the chances for this are very low. How was the ground condition in this battle? In combat mission it is possible to bog down even on a road. In that case it might represent an engine failure or something. That´s why i like CM so much; through some kind of abstraction thy achieve maximum realism! Cheers Skolman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bert Hamoen Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Seems unlikely to me that a Tiger can be immobilized by a MG. Even if the MG was a .50. But very unexpected things do happen. Like a Tiger getting killed with one shot by a Stuart from the front: armour penetration at weakpoint. Flukes like these were appearently put in to represent a hit on and through the bow MG position or teh position of the driver. No surprise, that my opponent did feel a bit unlucky when it happened. In the later CM games these things were scaled down considerably. You should play the remake of the Villers Bocage scenario for CMBB: one big shooting gallery. Very hard for the german side to even lose a tank ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 It bogged, people. That's all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted February 11, 2007 Share Posted February 11, 2007 Are we talking real life or game? The .50cal can immobilize a tank in real life after enough probability to hit track links, probably thousands of hits. In CMx1 it is hardcoded that it cannot, I'm pretty sure. A 20mm can. MGs under the CMx1 MG model cannot. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ActionMan Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 I presume by "bogged" you mean the generic CMBO representation of an immobilisation. The Tiger was on the road and the ground conditions were not muddy. Does this represent a mechanical failure? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barkhorn1x Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 I too am in the midst of playing the VB Operation and I gotta tell ya there is a bunch of stuff flying all over the place. Perhaps it was another tank getting in a long range shot while you were focused on the "main action"? Barkhorn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Originally posted by ActionMan: I presume by "bogged" you mean the generic CMBO representation of an immobilisation. The Tiger was on the road and the ground conditions were not muddy. Does this represent a mechanical failure? "Bogging" and "immobilization" are abstractions that include mechanical failure, so you could think of it that way if you like (although the game does not include relative mechanical reliability of various models of vehicles). Vehicles in the game sometimes do bog on dry roads - there's been a lot of whinging about this on this board over the years by people who believe that bogging should not be possible on a road. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barkhorn1x Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 Just finished the VB Operation - Axis Total Victory! How could it not be w/ all of those Tigers driving around. BTW, I managed to lose every single Tiger except Wittman's. And I hardly hung back w/ him. Here is his crews score: 44 Inf. casualties 7 HTs 6 Cromwell's 1 Carrier 6 Firefly's 6 Stuarts - that's 26 vehicles or about 1/3rd of the total KO'd! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ales Dvorak Posted July 9, 2007 Share Posted July 9, 2007 Originally posted by Neil aka Major Tum: I bet that if you played it again that you could not re-create this! And that's the point. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locksley Posted July 13, 2007 Share Posted July 13, 2007 I miss this game 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Manuel Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 Originally posted by Barkhorn1x: Just finished the VB Operation - Axis Total Victory! How could it not be w/ all of those Tigers driving around. BTW, I managed to lose every single Tiger except Wittman's. And I hardly hung back w/ him. Here is his crews score: 44 Inf. casualties 7 HTs 6 Cromwell's 1 Carrier 6 Firefly's 6 Stuarts - that's 26 vehicles or about 1/3rd of the total KO'd! Wow you killed 6 Fireflys with Wittman's tank alone (Bobby Woll is some gunner)! They must have been shooting very inaccurately to not have killed you at some point. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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