Bulletpoint Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 In most sources online, I find that the front hull of the Panzer IV H was 80mm, and the turret front was 50mm. But then I came across this report from the U.S. ARMY ARMAMENT RESEARCH, DEVELOPMENT AND ENGINEERING CENTER which states that the plates were 85mm and 65mm respectively. (page 20:) https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/AD1045347.pdf I'm no tank expert, but I know many on this forum know a lot about tanks, so I thought maybe some of you might be able to help out.. which numbers are actually correct? Thanks for any insights. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 (edited) The difference in the front hull pale might be LOS thickness as opposed to actual thickness, but I am at a loss to explain the discrepancy in the figures for the turret.....Will have to look in some books. Edited January 10, 2022 by Sgt.Squarehead 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexUK Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 Interesting document! Page 22 has a table showing different shell types penetration vs panther and p4. I haven't done any testing at all, but I seem to recall in-game better penetration than in table (particularly 76mm vs front turret panther)? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 10, 2022 Author Share Posted January 10, 2022 16 minutes ago, AlexUK said: I seem to recall in-game better penetration than in table (particularly 76mm vs front turret panther)? Yes, this is another interesting thing. Also the 75mm VS the Panzer IV gives very different results than we see in game. PzIVH immune to 75mm at any range? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted January 13, 2022 Author Share Posted January 13, 2022 On 1/10/2022 at 3:25 PM, Sgt.Squarehead said: Will have to look in some books. "Once upon a midnight dreary, as I pondered weak and weary, over many a tome of forgotten lore..." Did you manage to find anything in your book collection? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 (edited) Sorry, I completely forgot! Quick scan of Spielberger has the frontal armour as 80mm for the Ausf H (the earlier 50mm armour plate and 30mm Zusatzpanzer add on kit were replaced with a single 80mm plate), can't immediately see any numbers for the turret. PS - I've scanned through a couple now and a definitive figure for the turret front still eludes me.....It was increased to 50mm with the Ausf F, but I can't immediately find any figures beyond that. PPS - Interesting comment in the Osprey book: "In one way the longer 75mm guns were a very mixed blessing. In spite of the designers' efforts to conserve weight, the new weapons made the vehicle nose-heavy to such an extent that the forward suspension springs were under constant compression, with the result that the tank tended to sway about even when no steering was applied. The effect of this was compounded when the Ausfuhrung H was introduced in March 1943, as this model not only had 80mm armour on the bow, front plate & mantlet, but also had 5mm side-skirts and a turret girdle as defence against hollow charge ammunition." Edited January 13, 2022 by Sgt.Squarehead 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Backer Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 I haven’t found anything that would suggest a different figure than 80mm. I wonder if the added armour is some field expedient or shop alteration that was not part of the normal production run. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 (edited) I don't ever recall seeing extra armour plate on the turret face. Edited January 13, 2022 by Sgt.Squarehead 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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