Ratio of vehicles to infantry

[Rice]

In the typical CMCW scenario, how many squads per one tank is common? From what we've seen so far it seems like vehicles will be playing a massive role in this game, obviously the modern titles work like this too but after the Beta AAR it got me wondering about the average tank to infantry ratio. This probably depends on the Nation/Faction as well. And beyond CMCW, historically what would this ratio look like? Regarding Soviet formations, it seems like a Motorized Rifle Company typically has a platoon of tanks attached to it.

If anyone knows anything about this, it would be interesting to know more about.

[MikeyD]

I can't speak to a 'typical' scenario but I can tell you what I see in the TO&E.

1979, Battalion Mech Inf (Task Force). A mixed rifle company is made up of HQ, FO, two platoons infantry, one platoon weapons, and one platoon tanks. That works out to 10 M113s, 2 TOW vehicles,  and  5 tanks. Each inf platoon is made up of HQ, 3 squads and a fire support team. Its too late at night and I'm too lazy to count heads.

[The_Capt]

11 hours ago, Rice said:

In the typical CMCW scenario, how many squads per one tank is common? From what we've seen so far it seems like vehicles will be playing a massive role in this game, obviously the modern titles work like this too but after the Beta AAR it got me wondering about the average tank to infantry ratio. This probably depends on the Nation/Faction as well. And beyond CMCW, historically what would this ratio look like? Regarding Soviet formations, it seems like a Motorized Rifle Company typically has a platoon of tanks attached to it.

If anyone knows anything about this, it would be interesting to know more about.

Interesting question.  I guess it depends on the scenario.  We have a lot of force mixes in the TO&E as we grappled with the Team/TF/Group concepts that were happening on both sides.  So for right (and this is still Beta so keep that in mind) now it looks like:

US Tank Bn TF:  4:1 tanks-to-squads

US Mech Inf TF:  1.2: 1 squads-to-tanks (but this one is odd as there are sp weapons etc as well)

Soviet Tank Bn TF:  3.4 : 1 tanks-to-squads

Soviet MRB TF:  approx 2:1 squads-to-tanks (again support weapons)

But you also need to take into account that AFVs in the game are not simply armored wagons.  M113s and BTRs are probably the lowest on the totem pole but even the .50 on the M113 can be a threat at close range (played a scenario where a single M113 took out 2 x BMPs from the flank...gotta love APT rounds).  Then we move up to the BMPs, which are little monsters with those ATGMs and cannon.  Then AT systems M901, M150 and BRDMs, which can kill just about anything out to 3000m.  And finally, the mighty Bradley, which is what happens when a BMP and M901 have unholy congress in the back seat of an M1, rare in the game but when it shows up....

As to historical accuracy, well we tried to use actual Soviet and US time-period doctrine wherever possible.

 

[Erwin]

In Kelly's Heroes, Clint Eastwood clearly states that the inf support for 3 Tiger tanks is a full platoon.  So, that is definitive.

[mjkerner]

Lol, good one, Erwin!

[Rice]

2 hours ago, The_Capt said:

BMPs, which are little monsters with those ATGMs and cannon.

I know APCs and IFVs will play a massive role in this game, and honestly I expect the BMP-1 to outperform the M60A1 in most cases haha. My question was specifically about tanks obviously. Thank you for the super detailed reply. I appreciate it. It's interesting those both forces have a fairly similar composition is terms of ratio. When I play the U.S. I'll definitely be scared of BMP-1s as much as tanks in many cases.

[The_Capt]

2 minutes ago, Rice said:

I know APCs and IFVs will play a massive role in this game, and honestly I expect the BMP-1 to outperform the M60A1 in most cases haha. My question was specifically about tanks obviously. Thank you for the super detailed reply. I appreciate it. It's interesting those both forces have a fairly similar composition is terms of ratio. When I play the U.S. I'll definitely be scared of BMP-1s as much as tanks in many cases.

No problem, I forgot we have a "square TF" on the US side as well called Balanced TF with a ratio of 1.67 : 1 tanks-to-squads, so right ion between the Tank Bn and Mech Bn TFs. [note: ratio changes slightly if you count the engineers as infantry]

[MikeyD]

In my limited experience (EVERYBODY's experience is still limited at this point) M113 .50 cal make a surprisingly good show for itself against BMP-1. Its worse to be hit by ten .50 cal rounds than to be missed by one 73mm HEAT round. That's of course in melee combat where you're able to get close-in side shots. Its another matter when they're firing missiles at you from across the map.