Scenario "18 Platoon" working as intended?

[Bulletpoint]

I just finished the Commonwealth Forces mission called Platoon 18.

All enemy forces were randomly placed inside the small victory location rectangle, not a single enemy was outside using the bocage terrain, so basically the mission consisted of scouting empty terrain and then a "fish in a barrel" situation at the end.

The briefing does state that it's about a surprise attack, so it could be working as intended, but from a gameplay perspective I doubt this is what the designer had in mind.

I believe it was made by @JonS

Edited June 21, 2016 by Bulletpoint

[John Kettler]

Bulletpoint,

That may've been your experience, but it assuredly wasn't mine. My guys got shot to pieces by a foe very much using the bocage and other terrain as effective fighting positions.

SPOILER ALERT!

SPOILER ALERT!

 

18 Platoon has been rendered completely combat ineffective. All went well--until it didn't.

My unit drew first blood 21 minutes in, wiping out the gate guards and whatever that HQ unit was. Excellent. Built up a nice base of fire and was pounding away on Jerry. Regrettably, the wheels fell off the trolley thereafter, causing the next bound to collapse in a welter of shredded sections.

Apparently, the blasted hedgerow can only be gone through in the gaps, said gaps discovered to be well covered! Worse was to come. HQ went left and tried to come in the open SW corner but blundered into the open and came under LMG fire in its wreck of a trip to what was supposed to be a shell crater refuge. A few fateful Schmeisser Brrrps! later, the HQ disintegrated, especially after, for reasons unknown, it went right across the deadly gap (well past its crater) at the front of the farm. One rifleman survived. Earlier, another section came to grief trying to get into position to the right of the gap. It found the Jerry MLR (Main Line of Resistance) via RBD (Recon By Death), with one effective remaining. The other section went through that same exposed gap, got hosed and broke. Completing this debacle was my idiot, though earlier superb, mortar team, which also managed to step first into the path of the LMG covering the open corner, then got plastered by a Schmeisser firing through the hedgerow. So thorough was 18 Platoon's ruin that I contemplated surrender but plumped for a cease fire instead. Major British Tactical Defeat. The LOD (Line Of Departure) wasn't taken in time, so this may well unhinge the whole attack.

Regards,

John Kettler, DOC (Dead Officer Commanding)

Edited June 23, 2016 by John Kettler

[Bulletpoint]

Hmmm... compared to your experience, mine was a walk in the park. I think maybe there might be one faulty AI plan where the German troops don't deploy properly. A pity really, because the map itself seems good, with several good defensive locations that I expected would be a pain to take.

[Abbasid111]

I have played that scenario several times. It one of my favorite small scenarios and I believe that there are several AI plans involved. 

[Bulletpoint]

I can now answer my own question, after looking through the scenario in the editor.

The Germans do actually have several different setup plans, but they all stay within the rectangular bocage space with the farm.

I guess the scenario is working as intended, and it's supposed to be a surprise attack. The challenge for the British side seems to mainly be that he doesn't know there aren't any enemies in the countryside, so will still have to advance carefully while keeping an eye on the clock.

Or maybe the scenario is mostly meant to be played on the defence against the Brits. They do have AI plans to advance in various ways.

[JonS]

Well ... they didn't, until you posted that ...

Here's a tip: if you think you're the first person to notice something in four years, either a) you aren't the first, or ii) you've got the wrong end of the stick

 

[Bulletpoint]

9 hours ago, JonS said:

Here's a tip: if you think you're the first person to notice something in four years, either a) you aren't the first, or ii) you've got the wrong end of the stick

I'll take that as a "definitely maybe"

Edited June 27, 2016 by Bulletpoint

[Michael Emrys]

On June 24, 2016 at 8:15 AM, Bulletpoint said:

The Germans do actually have several different setup plans, but they all stay within the rectangular bocage space with the farm.

Er, not so. You got my curiosity up, so I loaded the battle and then called for a cease fire. Upon examining the map, I spotted two units outside the bocage surrounding the objective. I did this twice with the same result both times. If as you say there are multiple opfor plans, at least one of them involves the conditions I observed.

Michael

[Bulletpoint]

4 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

Er, not so. You got my curiosity up, so I loaded the battle and then called for a cease fire. Upon examining the map, I spotted two units outside the bocage surrounding the objective. I did this twice with the same result both times. If as you say there are multiple opfor plans, at least one of them involves the conditions I observed.

Michael

Hmm... I could swear I checked through all the German AI plans, and they didn't seem to have any "move out" orders. But of course I could be wrong. Will double check when I get home.

[Bulletpoint]

12 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

Er, not so. You got my curiosity up, so I loaded the battle and then called for a cease fire. Upon examining the map, I spotted two units outside the bocage surrounding the objective. I did this twice with the same result both times. If as you say there are multiple opfor plans, at least one of them involves the conditions I observed.

Michael

 

I just went back and checked it, and I was right. None of the German AI plans have any units outside the starting area.

The units you see out on the map if you load up the mission and press cease fire only appear if you press cease fire before taking the first turn. They will never appear there during a real game.

What happens is that when designing a scenario, you can deploy enemy units whereever you like, but if you then assign those units to a group, and paint a deployment zone on the map for those units, the units will instantly move to somewhere in that area once you start your first turn. So, on loading up the scenario, all the units are out in the countryside, but the moment you click the red button, they all teleport back into the starting zone.

[Badger73]

Same Scenario - different general question:  HOW DOES CMBN COUNT THE TROOP NUMBERS SHOWN IN THE END GAME AFTER ACTION REPORT DISPLAY?

My experiences with this scenario is that the total numbers displayed in the AAR exceed the number of troops deployed in the battle.  Am I mistaken?

 

 

* * * *  SPOILER ALERT  * * * *  Move along if you don't want to spoil the game for yourself   * * * *

The scenario I played consisted of the following troop counts:
- British = 1 platoon totaling 37 men
- Germans = 1 section totaling 15 men

The AAR display for a recent H2H game displays as follows.  In this case please disregard the monumental British cock-up outcome . . . . 
    British        German
      14    OK    23
      17    KIA     0
      19    WIA    1
        1    MIA     0
    ===================
      51   TTL   24
These results overstate the numbers deployed; end game British are overstated by 14 (38%) and Germans by 9 (60%).  What caused the inflated values?
Please note that I doubt this discrepancy is of the scenario designer's making.
The overall AAR level of victory outcome looks correct.   How is CMBN doing the math?  Thank you.

* * * *  SPOILER END  * * * *  

 

 

If you skipped the post, accept this non-PG offering of amusement instead

 

[JonS]

If I had to guess (which I do right now) I'd say it's counting off-map HQs.

[Michael Emrys]

6 hours ago, Badger73 said:

If you skipped the post, accept this non-PG offering of amusement instead

I feel a little better about Sarge after watching that. I actually cheered in the theater when he got blown away in Full Metal Jacket.

Michael

[Combatintman]

9 hours ago, JonS said:

If I had to guess (which I do right now) I'd say it's counting off-map HQs.

That was my first thought and is probably right - I have never seen CM get its sums wrong.

[Bulletpoint]

The reason is that the scenario uses a little trick to make sure neither the British nor the Germans will surrender, when playing the scenario against the computer.

The way it works is that the scenario designer places some reinforcements for both sides, but delays them so much that they will only appear after the scenario is over (which in practice means they will never appear).

However, these reinforcements will still make the AI think that it's stronger than it really is, so it won't surrender even if all its (on-map) troops have been killed.