Thoughts on The Proving Grounds

[LukeFF]

Glad thats settled then.  Its the theme I use.... its a magazine style I purchased. It is the most asthetically pleasing to be fair and Im happy with how it displays.

Sorry, but that's bad website design. You're confusing the user with two different presentations for the same item the player is looking for (i.e., scenarios). Stick with one of the styles but not both. 

[Bootie]

Criticism accepted.... I thought it was straight forward.  Anyways I will look into changing it but it costs money and its a bad time of year for me to be throwing money at the websites.  Your observations have been noted though.

[sttp]

[snipped video tutorial on TSD's new search functions]

Very nice. Yeah, I thought I must've been missing something re: the search feature. I guess I was expecting it to be over near the jump list and top downloads and all, so sorry about that. The site(s) seem great, so keep up the good work.

[Bootie]

Thanks pal.... its taking a bit of time to iron out the wrinkles and the like but moving in the right direction.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Bootie

[JonS]

... a magazine style ...  It is the most aesthetically pleasing to be fair and I'm happy with how it displays.

One observation about the magazine style is that it does look nice, but it is intrinsically promoting some content at the expense of others. That's the point of it. Which is fine for a magazine, but I'm not so sure it's such a great idea for what is basically a catalogue - I'm not sure you should put yourself in the position of promoting some designers' material at the expense of other designers.

I think my biggest bugbear with the Repository was the arbitrary, and highly inconsistent, categorisation and labeling, which made trying to find anything tricky, and I was never quite sure if I'd used the proper combinations of runes and incantations. Combined with the ... eclectic ... layout (where's that damn search box again. Oh yeah, bottom, left, I think.) and multiple clicking to dive down into content made it somewhat less than user friendly.

[Bootie]

Im not technically promoting anyone... the large posts are to highlight latest content and as soon as a new piece comes along it gets pushed down the list.

I guess it depends on how you use the area... do you want to see new content first or do you attend looking for a certain scenario.  I suspect most folk want the new content and basically mine the sites.

[JonS]

That's a bit disingenuous.

You picked the design.

The design promotes some content at the expense of others.

Technically, no, you aren't doing it, but the effects of your choices are.

 

I suspect that folks use the site in different ways on different days.

[Badger73]

Im not technically promoting anyone... the large posts are to highlight latest content and as soon as a new piece comes along it gets pushed down the list.

I guess it depends on how you use the area... do you want to see new content first or do you attend looking for a certain scenario.  I suspect most folk want the new content and basically mine the sites.

That's a bit disingenuous.

You picked the design.

The design promotes some content at the expense of others.

Technically, no, you aren't doing it, but the effects of your choices are.

 

I suspect that folks use the site in different ways on different days.

That's the challenge of web design.  The webmaster is so immersed in it, he's bent on tweaking long and often to avoid bland thinking and insipid pages.  The web-surfers, however, want clear consistency and speedy access.  Given Bootie's continuous yeoman efforts for The Few Good Men and the BFC community at large as well as his personal costs for web services, I have no doubt that things will evolve to good outcomes.  I think all feedback receives serious deliberation.  I know a topnotch end result is desired.  I look forward to what's in store.  Thank you both for your contributions on our behalf.

[Bootie]

Thanks for the feedback guys.... to be brutally honest Im no web designer.  The templates and programs Ive put together are all purchased from WordPress (at personal expense) which in itself is a blogging platform.  Now I know it doesn't appear that good or that intuitive to you guys but it is the best I could do.

I made the sites for me and the guys at The Few Good Men to share with the community if they wanted to use it... BF approached about moving the stuff from the repository over there.  Now obviously they liked the look of it and to be fair it is better than what they currently have.  So for now we are in a position where to rebuild would be a massive job and considering Ive already spent hundreds of hours designing and building the sites Im loathe to rebuild but what I will do is keep an eye out for wordpress themes/templates that better suit our purpose and hopefully down the line we can flick the theme over and everyone will be happy.  Until then Im at aloss as to what you guys actually want or expect me to do.  Sorry.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Bootie

[rocketman]

I do appreciate all the hard work you do and at your own expesnes at that. I guess one is always thinking of what an optimal solution would be, without taking into consideration that someone has to do the hard work. If you go back to my original thoughts in the firs post - would that fit into the current template for the webpage?

[Bootie]

I would need to look into it.. it would mean however folk would be required to sign up and actually have to use a log in and such like.  A whole new layer of admin I would need to look into.  Like I said it will evolve but there is just no way i can work through the tsunami of ideas and interpretations Im having aimed my way.  And I know everyone is trying to help but to please everyone you get contradictions... hell at The FGM website folk discuss forum width... I want it bigger... I want it smaller... LOL

[BarbaricCo]

As someone who has luck to have cmmods cover page for 10 days because no one uploaded anything in the meantime and one other mode, that I worked for weeks, only few hours on the front page - what to say? Is it fair? No.

Are the rules same for everyone? Yes.

 

Should there be a some kind of stuff picked content? Yes.

Would that be fair? No

 

Is the FTP download server with search function and organized folders perfectly fine for long time CM users?

Probably Yes.

 

Are there are missing things like upload updates, better positioned search field, categories, ratings etc. Yes

I recommend stuff picked content for mods that go unnoticed, search field on top and only list when user select sub category or top downloads showing only top for that category.

For Proving Grounds and Scenario Depot it would be good to have a few more screenshots or even better YouTube scenario presentation...

 

But to be fair new site is TEN times better than the old one. 

It also serves as a great presentation for new CM players of the richness of community created content.

And finally, if all of this is one Bootie volunteered show than only real thing that is missing is "Donate" button.

[BarbaricCo]

@rocketman Regarding first post, yes, 1 comment per 100 downloads is actually 10 times above industry average  and only real way for more feedback is if CM has more and more players.

On Your side - where is the link for scenario in the first post? And You know how hard is to find search button on PG

And btw scenario is really good. No problems or bugs, only I just don't know how to assault that bridge!

[Ivan Zaitzev]

Is there going to be a different section for campaigns or it will be like the current BF Repository?

[easytarget]

I looked around for awhile trying to find the playtest form, no luck?!  I feel like I'm missing something that should be really obvious to find.

Posted same question on the scenario I downloaded, figured first thing I should also do is locate this form, but stymied so far on that front.

Any help?

Thanks.

[RockinHarry]

I looked around for awhile trying to find the playtest form, no luck?!  I feel like I'm missing something that should be really obvious to find.

Posted same question on the scenario I downloaded, figured first thing I should also do is locate this form, but stymied so far on that front.

Any help?

Thanks.

The form is to be found on the uncategorized page http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/tpg2/category/uncategorized/

@Bootie: It´s likely better to have a direct link on the individual test mission pages, last line of mission description that reads "Email playtest form to .... at ...." ?

[easytarget]

Ah, thank you kind sir.  Looked everywhere for that darn thing.  

[Bootie]

Is there going to be a different section for campaigns or it will be like the current BF Repository?

http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/tsd3/search-2/#search/tag=CAMPAIGN

In the search field choose the flavour of CM you want in the category chooser.  ie.  CMBN and in the tag chooser choose campaign and that will list all campaigns for your game of choice.  At present we only have 1 Shock Force Campaign and 2 for Afghanistan as I havent had much time recently what with answering questions on the design to actually get on with doing the uploading and transferring from the repository.  

[Bootie]

The form is to be found on the uncategorized page http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/tpg2/category/uncategorized/

@Bootie: It´s likely better to have a direct link on the individual test mission pages, last line of mission description that reads "Email playtest form to .... at ...." ?

Yes I will look into that.

[sttp]

Yes I will look into that.

Had no idea you were doing the sites as a kind of side thing, basically as charity. So thanks for that. Interestingly, a few weeks back I subscribed to receive updates when new scenarios are posted at TSD, so I now get a WordPress e-mail every time even an 'old' scenario is transferred from the repository to your site... and it's very obvious you're working your butt off to get all those files (several hundred, I guess) moved over. Will keep those facts in mind before offering suggestions or criticisms. 

 

[Bootie]

Ok Ive been playing with TPGII and have come up with an idea... can you guys visit TPGII and see what you make of it.  Like I say a work in progress and at present only the CMBN tab links in to scenarios.  

[RockinHarry]

Ok Ive been playing with TPGII and have come up with an idea... can you guys visit TPGII and see what you make of it.  Like I say a work in progress and at present only the CMBN tab links in to scenarios.  

+1

Way to go.

What actually happens to a mission that has tests completed? Can the uploader delete it again, mark it as finished, or as was the case at TPG, can shift it over to SD with little effort? (Edit: That was the case when the last uploaded revision did not require any further tweaking)

Edited November 28, 2015 by RockinHarry

[Bootie]

All they need to do is inform me that its ready to go across and I do the rest.

[Badger73]

Ok Ive been playing with TPGII and have come up with an idea... can you guys visit TPGII and see what you make of it.  Like I say a work in progress and at present only the CMBN tab links in to scenarios.  

 

I like the direction taken.  Don't think you need to provide so much real estate per game.  Consider a 2x3 matrix with just the game graphic.
    CMBN - CMFI - CMRT
    CMSF - CMA - CMBS
Less scrolling (always optimal) for site visitors.

Also, only Black Sea, Red Thunder, and Normandy hyperlinks appear active.  No "jump" occurs for Italy, Afghanistan, nor Shock Force.

Thank you for your efforts.

Edited November 28, 2015 by Badger73

[Bootie]

 

I like the direction taken.  Don't think you need to provide so much real estate per game.  Consider a 2x3 matrix with just the game graphic.
    CMBN - CMFI - CMRT
    CMSF - CMA - CMBS
Less scrolling (always optimal) for site visitors.

Ok will have a look at re-jigging it later.

Also, only Black Sea, Red Thunder, and Normandy hyperlinks appear active.  No "jump" occurs for Italy, Afghanistan, nor Shock Force.

Thank you for your efforts.

It will only jump if its got something to jump to.