Naval Action - Age Of Sail - Fps - Open World And Customisation

[Destraex1]

Just thought in relation to Combat mission and unique historical games that some like me may like the older types of ships in a game called NAVAL ACTION.

Requires DX11 though. The open beta is due in a few weeks to a month for pre-order guys

You get to command one ship only and either play in open world or I think perhaps single scenarios or PVP/PVE battles.

Ships are individually customisable I believe.

What as a tester I am excited about is that you get down and fire ranging shots from deck level before releasing your broadside.

* Can turn on and off individual gun decks and fire them in any order

* Can allocate the crew to prioritise different task

* Control the mast sails individually or auto

* Contol the helm\rudder obviously along with the speed of the ship

* Weather such as fog, storm seas among others

* Choose round types like roundshot, chain, grape\shotgun sort of shot

* Forts and I think other land things like ports and the like....

* IIRC game tracks every ball fired and damage like smashed cannons and leaks or sail damage/masts falling off etc are all there.

The ships are pretty much replicas of famous real ships.

So far seen are the HMS Victory (over 100 guns), USS Constitution(heavy super frigate 44 guns), HMS Tricomalee (a match for the USS Connie?), cutter, brig, mortar brig, Yachts, HMS Surprise (Russel Crowes ship in master and commander), Bellona (74 guns).

Here are a few shots of me testing. Enjoy

Anyone who loves Hornblower and 1700 - early 1800 age of sail ships might like this one. It's kind of unique.

P.S. I hope this is the right place to post. If I am breaking any rules just let me know.

I did not post a link as I see it is against the rule.... may be considered commercial.

[Destraex1]

A few more

[Destraex1]

again

[Destraex1]

Half these images are probably un-necessary I guess. Admins kill the thread if you wish.

[Destraex1]

I know a lot of combat mission players (like me) are not as much into the real time stuff. So be warned this is certainly real time, but damned slow due to it being a sailing game.

For what it is, like combat mission it is so unique that I thought it deserved our attention.

[sburke]

skates close to the edge, but not sure if it crosses - you'll know if you get your wrist slapped in a PM. Been there

I googled it and found a view videos on steam. I loved WSIM from Avalon Hill. My first impression was this looked really cool, then I watched the video for a bit longer and I am suspecting this is gonna be more like World of Tanks with ships.

[Destraex1]

Fair enough. It is sure not going to be the detail level that combat mission or a proper sim gets. But it is the best we have right now and probably for the foreseeable future.

I can though tell you that because it is sailing it is often the kind of game you can get coffee while your ship is turning about!

I played War of the Roses for the same reason.

But yeah if I get warned I guess I will know for next time.

WSIM from avalon hill sounds like a board game?

[Michael Emrys]

WSIM from avalon hill sounds like a board game?

Yep. They bought it from some other developer, Yaquinto IIRC. I think it ultimately got made into a computer game as well, but I admit to being pretty vague about the details.

Michael

[John Kettler]

Destraex1,

I'll get back to you after wiping all the drool off my display. Wow! I grew up reading and loved Forrester's Hornblower series, O'Brian's Aubrey/Maturin books and lots of other books on the Age of Fighting Sail, but this is far more immersive than WSIM, which I've played at tournament level and at which I took second in a major fleet action. The visuals in this one are tremendous (spherical Earth modeled in the game?) The vessels are in bad shape, though, considering they barely have enough crew (yellow fever, malaria?) on their gundecks to serve one piece, never mind the entire P or S battery. Please advise as to status of following: ability to fire as you bear; fire on the uproll; fire by sections; change ammo type; depiction of national gunnery doctine; ability to double or trouble shot, to fire cannonballs with grape on top. What about hot shot and carcass munitions? Can a sail be fothered over a shot hole? Is manning the pumps modeled? Any provisions for jury rigging as a result of storm or battle damage? What about springs, kedging and careening? Is crashing into/being crashed into by a whale a critical hit? Very important! Is skylarking supported?!

So many questions for a game I almost certainly can't play anyway!

Regards,

John Kettler

[Michael Emrys]

Is skylarking supported?!

And don't forget probability of taking a casualty if you miss your grip.

Michael

[Destraex1]

Wow was just checking on black sea and saw the reply. lol John.

I will try to answer your questions;

 

Please advise as to status of following:

ability to fire as you bear; fire on the uproll; fire by sections; change ammo type; depiction of national gunnery doctine; ability to double or trouble shot, to fire cannonballs with grape on top. What about hot shot and carcass munitions? Can a sail be fothered over a shot hole? Is manning the pumps modeled? Any provisions for jury rigging as a result of storm or battle damage? What about springs, kedging and careening? Is crashing into/being crashed into by a whale a critical hit? Very important! Is skylarking supported?!

 

* You cannot fire as you bear currently although it is early days. You can though fire singly from bow to stern manually by pressing space multiple times

* Ships roll and if you time it right you can fire on the up or down roll. It really makes a difference if you are at range or too close as well

* Ammo types currently are: Ball, double shot, chain and one of the Anti personel ones like grape. No grape on top of ball or trebble atm but as I said early days

* Hot shot is not in currently and has been hotly debated as something rarely used and dangerous to your own crews/ships health

* Depiction of national gunnery not in but may be depicted through crew quality when the open world comes out I guess.

* Carcass ?? This is not shooting goats out of the cannon is it?

* Manning pumps is modelled in the way you prioritise crew and the pumps can be damaged or destroyed

* Fothering over a shot hole is modelled by having a limited number of repairs to allocate to parts of the ship - this also covers jury rigging and battle damage

* Springs kedging and careening -- can you explain these ?? You mean anchor springs and cleaning the ship? Not in atm but as I said open world

* Crashing is modelled and causes huge amounts of damage - this is hotly debated at the moment as well

* Spherical earth modelled... Won't know until the open world comes out. I will look at the horizon though when next in game.

* Skylarking? lol.... I can say that AI is in and one can play vs AI currently in the set piece battles -i.e. ships vs ships not in open world - deathmatch really. 

 

 

As for the crew. Unfortunately at the moment this is a limitation because of performance. They also originally had recoiling guns and ports that open and close. But because of performance these have been disabled for now. A shame but one cannot expect perfection. The other thing that is unrealistic is that ships sink currently and do not take hours to sink at that. A session currently counts down from 1hr to do your business but generally lasts 30-40mins. 

 

As for not being able to play. This is a pretty slow game compared to most. They are not motor boats. But it is real time and you do have to aim and account for roll etc. At close range it can get hectic controlling the sails and guns. 

 

Here are some pictures of me on heavy seas. Can hardly see the other ships at some points.

 

Edited December 17, 2014 by Destraex1

[Destraex1]

[Destraex1]

I am reading aubrey maturin atm. Up to the third book in the series. Will read bothilo after which is supposed to be even better. Finished hornblower 10-15yrs ago and love the movies for the mentioned novels.

The hornblower TV series is pretty good as is the master and commander movie.

If you have any other recommendations I would be grateful.

 

 

Oh and guess what this is? Not in game yet but coming soon

Admins\devs are asking for performance references. It is being hotly debated as to how it should perform in game. Do you have any reliable accounts of its sailing ability?

Edited December 17, 2014 by Destraex1

[Destraex1]

Forgot to ask. How many men did your WIM models have on them?

[StieliAlpha]

Yep. They bought it from some other developer, Yaquinto IIRC. I think it ultimately got made into a computer game as well, but I admit to being pretty vague about the details.

Michael

The WSIM computer game dates back to the veeeery old times (early 90s or so) and was crap. Came out too late, after lot's of trouble and was even at that time not up to date anymore.Later there were two versions of "Age of Sail" in John Tillers Battleground series, which were quite ok but no big hits either.

 

BUT:

- There is a nice WSIM online game on www.youplay.it. Graphics are poor WSIM style, the rules are quite simplified WSIM rules and it has a very active community. Very good "Beer and Bretzel" online game, if you need a change. Quick, challenging, very competetive games. One on one or multiplayer.

 

- and there is "Velmad" at www.velmad.com. Absolutely BRILLIANT online game. A very much improved WSIM, with vastly improved graphics (but certainly not up to todays standards), quite detailed rules and a GREAT communication system (within one scenario, the players communicate with flag signals. If the receiver obeys is a different question.) The biggest drawback: The english speaking community faded away quite a while ago. Today it is virtually only Spanish speaking.

[John Kettler]

Destraex1,

 

Sorry for the brain melt, but I spent years with my nose in those books. The period is one of my favorites, I'm heavily read in it, and you might say I feel at home there, to the point where a past life investigation might prove interesting. Those ships give me such a thrill, and I try not to hate brother Ed, who's been aboard both HMS Victory and the Cutty Sark!  The Bolitho and Aubrey/Maturin books came way after my childhood, but the Hornblower books opened the world to me, in ways nothing else could. The effects still resonate in me, and I believe they had a lot to do with my interests in military history, weaponry and geography.

 

Hot shot was not a normal projectile for operations at sea, but they made forts a mortal terror to highly flammable ships. This is part of the reason behind the apt quote "A ship's a fool to fight a fort." Carcass, rather than being a glowing red cannonball, is a munition stuffed with incendiaries which ignite upon firing and burn all the way to the target. Rather dangerous shipboard but useful for bombarding cities and such, as at Panama. You understood springs, which is more than I could say when first reading about them. Kedging is a way of moving the ship in shallow water when there is little or no wind. The--wait for it--kedge anchor, which is lighter than the primary anchor, is placed in a boat, which then rows out ahead of the ship and tosses it overboard. "Hands to the capstans!" until the ship catches up to the anchor, whereupon the process is repeated. Careening does indeed consist of lightening the ship as much as possible, putting her beam over, doing whatever repairs and cleaning are needed, then righting her. Naturally, doing the whole hull requires reversing the ship and repeating the process.  Not quick or easy, but can save a ship when far from home. 

 

"Captain Horatio Hornblower, R.N." with Gregory Peck is a good film if you haven't seen it. Here's a long list which ought to keep you out of mischief, but you'll have to cull it to screen AoS films only.

 

If you can fire guns singly and can do so while moving past your target, then you can already "fire as you bear."  Theodore Roosevelt (yes, that one, then 23) wrote the brilliant The Naval War of 1812, about which I can't say enough good things. Other resources.

 

The Carronade

 

Carronade article reporting scientific effectiveness tests.

Brother George, who's very into Age of Fighting Sail and has been aboard the USS Constitution (grr) said this in response: 

 

 

Good find John!

The larger Carronades using 1/4 the powder of same-shot long guns were deadly and economical

o less powder used

o far smaller gun crew required

 

Guns of the Consititution, a remarkable super groggy history of the wildly varying gun battery of the USS Constitution.

 

British Smoothbore Artillery, so good my brother practically leapt out of my computer to thank me. Simply astounding!

 

http://www.stvincent.ac.uk/heritage/1797/battle/index.htmlThe Battle of Cape St Vincent

 

Nautical resources for fans of The Black Pearl films. The only reason I'm even relatively sane is that I've scarcely looked at any of it. Grog's El Dorado!

 

Lobscouse and Spotted Dog: Which, It's a Cookbook, Ain't It? is a cookbook whose topics derive from the Aubrey/Maturin novels. If you wish to taste the period, the authors have all the descriptions, context,recipes and instructions to see you through. Killick will be heard!

 

And if you've somehow still got a pulse, this catalog of the online holdings of the Navy Department Online Library Reading Room should prove your death knell, but you'll die happy.

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

Edited December 18, 2014 by John Kettler

[Destraex1]

Thanks for the resources and descriptions. I had wondered how careening worked. Always thought you had to do it on shore.

As for kedging... well they are not allowing deployment of boats currently to row you out of trouble. So kedging will not be in I dare say. But I do recognise the process and now know what to call it!

 

For my sailing experience. I am afraid it only amounts to some hobiecats and a month or so in a yacht.

 

I have a lot of material to go through there I have soooo many good books on sailing already since naval action popped into existence.

 

One thing you may be able to help with. Some are saying ranging shots should not be allowed in game and that full broadsides should be forced. 

Do you know of any sources that describe ranging shots before a broadside? I hold little hope though of this as really each gun captain would be doing his own aiming if at all.

You see currently in game you fire a little like a modern ship .... shot over, splash out. until you fire for effect. But some want a complete guess with a full broadside up front. At almost any range this is 

suicide especially for new players. Cannon do disperse at range as they should and the closer you are the better the effect and grouping.

I think the game would be impossible at all but the closest ranges without some way for the player to guage distance - which is hard enough with a flat screen with no depth perception.

Good players do let loose without ranging shots however.

 

Because the player is firing the whole broadside he like in combat mission acts as all of the gun section captains at once. So ranging shots I think are fair.

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3S6nTEw8O8

[Michael Emrys]

 

Lobscouse and Spotted Dog: Which, It's a Cookbook, Ain't It? is a cookbook whose topics derive from the Aubrey/Maturin novels.

 

 

Ha! I have that book. I don't recall ever trying any of the recipes, but it made for interesting reading. IIRC, the authors researched every dish mentioned in O'Brian's compendium, which must have amounted to quite a bit of work.

 

Michael

[John Kettler]

Destraex1,

 

You're most welcome. Careening  ideally requires a smooth sandy or gravel shore which allows the ship to get close enough to be lightly beached parallel to the shore. From that position, strong cables are attached to heavy trees, large rocks and the like, which are used as anchors; essential to pulling the ship over on her side. I don't recall the full details, but you get the drift.

 

Michael Emrys,

 

I made a Spotted Dick/Spotted Dog from the book, but I got tired of the arduous and messy process required to get the suet (I used beef suet, as called for in the recipe), so wound up with not enough melted fat in the pudding, which I steamed, making it altogether too dry. The discourse here on the subject is a good read, but I have it on authority of a proud Scotsman and scientist that it's called Spotted Dick because it was named after a Scottish nobleman, Sir Richard (I forget what; he told me). There's more to the story, but I'll have to get back to you. If you can't be bothered to make your own, Heinz has a canned version, which is obtainable from various places which supply British food favorites. I made my favorite Scotsman quite happy by sending him one. It caused many smirks and great mirth among the medical staff where he was recuperating at the time.

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

Edited December 19, 2014 by John Kettler

[Michael Emrys]

...Heinz has a canned version, which is obtainable from various places which supply British food favorites. I made my favorite Scotsman quite happy by sending him one. It caused many smirks and great mirth among the medical staff where he was recuperating at the time.

 

Wait a minute...are you saying that he was in the hospital because of eating canned spotted dick?

 

 

 

Michael

Edited December 19, 2014 by Michael Emrys

[Destraex1]

Spotted dick seems to be from 1850 or so.

 

The new snow. The Nuestra Señora de la Santísima Trinidad is now also in game also but I do not have enough points for it to show you guys.

[Destraex1]

[Destraex1]

[Destraex1]

From a dev post in the forums.... consider that every ball is tracked when fired when reading the below;

 

Ballistics and Damage model 4.0

 

To make the gameplay feel real and provide more tactical depth: we will be gradually moving to the final damage model, which has passed several iterations before.  To find out how previous systems worked please refer to the Damage 2.0 and Damage 3.0 posts on forums. The new system is in development. Testing of this new model will start by spring of 2015 or earlier.

 

Key new features

 

Penetration classes

Penetration exists now, but needs to be expanded for faster development and additions of new features. It also needs to be improved to allow for more customization of ships and weaponry. Cannons and ships will have a penetration class that will determine the ability to go through the armor. We believe that will provide more tactical diversity to combat. Ship armor will not be unified any longer. There will be weak spots to be exploited. Heavy planking at the waterline will make ship of the line more effective against lower level ships.

 

Angles and ricochets

Hitting a ship at narrow angle will ricochet from the ship hull. Longer guns with higher cannonball velocity will have better chances to penetrate at angles. This will make positioning very important. This feature is completely new and gameplay might change significantly and will require testing.

 

Exact colliders and positioning of internal modules

We are moving to the exact collision models that fully represent the shape of the hull.  Same will be done with important internal modules. To blow up a bow magazine or break a frontal pump you will need to shoot at the front part of the ship.

 

 

Pass through shots

Gun ports will be implemented in the damage collider models. If the cannon ball does not hit anything it will pass through the ship and could hit the next target

 

Crew damage

Crew damage will also change significantly as crew will no longer be a unified mass of people. Crew will be located deck-by-deck creating the situations where you destroyed everyone on the top deck leaving intact gun crews on the gundeck. This system also will allow for potential expansions of detailed crew management if the need arise. 

 

Ballistics changes

We were very unsatisfied with the ballistics of carronades and frog like double shot and have reworked the formulas to allow better customization of cannons and fast additions of new features.  Reload penalties will be added to certain types of shot. New system could also allow for types of powder charge type weight if this feature is be needed.  Gun sights experiments will continue and we will test a couple of implementations of the sights next year.

 

Carronades will receive long overdue love and will be a formidable close range choice of weaponry. 

 

 

Feel free to provide suggestions, feedback, and improvement ideas.

[Tactical Wargamer]

skates close to the edge, but not sure if it crosses - you'll know if you get your wrist slapped in a PM. Been there

I googled it and found a view videos on steam. I loved WSIM from Avalon Hill. My first impression was this looked really cool, then I watched the video for a bit longer and I am suspecting this is gonna be more like World of Tanks with ships.

I agree I have it and it seems to be a naval sim light. Nothing like JUTLAND. It sounds like the developers are making it a "Pay to win". Hope I'm wrong. The ships zoom around much faster than indicated in the pics. Say 13 knots feels like 30 knots!

Pretty though.