Sorry to say it, but suppression doesn't really work

[Bulletpoint]

So how do you know that his morale status is "Pinned"? Veteran doesn't display enemy suppression status. If you're basing your assessment as seeing the guy "Cowering" some of the time, you're probably overestimating the effect your fire is having. And even if you're hitting "Cease Fire" to check, "Pinned" only lasts 30s if the incoming slackens off.

I know it because when I click on the sniper, it shows "Pinned" in his suppression meter. And yes, that's on Veteran skill level. Try it out for yourself

[Bulletpoint]

Once more, just in case you missed it: Area fire is needed for suppression.

If you aim at the sniper, he'll duck. Then, with him out of LOS, your men will stop shooting, his morale will recover, he'll pop up and shoot your guys, in turn they will shoot at him, he'll duck, recover, repeat.

Area target will keep the incoming fire at his location even if he is out of LOS.

Nope, didn't miss it, but well aware of it. My example was using area fire.

[womble]

I know it because when I click on the sniper, it shows "Pinned" in his suppression meter. And yes, that's on Veteran skill level. Try it out for yourself

Well, that's new, and contrary to what the manual says. At least I think it's new, I think I played one game on Veteran before going to Warrior, back when BN first came out. Maybe I never pinned any units, or just forgot. Whatever.

[Pelican Pal]

Suppression can definitely be a fuzzy thing. Pinned units generally won't move, but they may return fire. Whether they return fire or not and for how long is, as far as I can tell, kinda random. Sometimes, even under withering fire, a few men will be brave enough to keep returning fire. In these cases the weight of fire is usually enough to kill them, but at longer ranges and in good cover this is not always true.

One thing to keep in mind though is as range increases the weight of fire needed to suppress someone increases pretty dramatically.

[MisterMark]

One thing to keep in mind though is as range increases the weight of fire needed to suppress someone increases pretty dramatically.

Does that apply to HE fire too?

[Pelican Pal]

Does that apply to HE fire too?

It technically does. What I'm trying to say is that as ranges increase the dispersion of what is fired increases and the time between fire hitting the target also increases. SO you need to think about how much fire is actually hitting the target and the time it takes it to do that.

Two imaginary examples of what I am talking about.

Lets say at 100 Meters a squad can fire 100 bullets and 80 of those will be on target, while at 200 meters 40 out of 100 bullets will be on target.

This effectively means that the amount of suppression is halved or that you would need 2 squads at 200 meters to equal the firepower of one squad at 100 meters.

So as your range increases the amount of your fire that will be effective is reduced. Thereby requiring more fire to make up for the lack of accuracy.

Secondly, as range increases the time between rounds hitting the target increases. This is due to the lack of accuracy as range increases, the time it takes bullets to travel, and the additional aiming time required to hit the target.

So at 200 meters not only are you only have 40 out of 100 bullets hitting a target, but it is taking 90 seconds to fire those 100 bullets. Whereas at 100 meters it only takes 60 seconds to fire 100 bullets and 80 of those are hitting the target. This allows the unit being fired on to recover from suppression more quickly.

Overall what this means is that the farther away the target is the more firepower is needed for the same effect on target.

As far as HE is concerned this is still all true. However, it is important to consider what is firing the HE shell and how big the shell is. In the ranges present in most CM maps you don't really need to worry about it because tanks can effectively hit targets quite quickly out to, and probably beyond, 500 meters. Although smaller autocannons can definitely suffer at those ranges. Really the best way to judge this is to try it out in game. When you have a unit firing at a target how many shells are hitting? how rapidly are they hitting? How does this compare to closer engagements?

Edit: To give you a less military way of thinking about this:

Imagine that someone is dropping 1 pound bags of flour on you. If they are dropping 1 bag every 30 seconds it isn't really a problem is it? You can easily deflect them away and they are just a minor annoyance.

Now imagine that they are dropping 30 bags every second. Now that is a real problem and you are quite liable to get hurt by them.

[LUCASWILLEN05]

I suspect you're reading too much into the game's lack of facial animations or movement graphics to reflect an individual pixeltruppen's feelings.

What we can actually see - rate of fire, say - is ambiguous with regard to the unit's simulated mental status. It's all a big, fuzzy ball of probabilities created by a host of variables that are difficult to determine from our end.

You may be looking at one data point of a trend showing that suppression isn't strong enough in the game. But the game's got too much going on under the hood to demonstrate that from the behavior of a single pixeltruppen ... at least one in the ambiguous situation you've outlined. But it's especially fruitless, I think, to ascribe a particular mental attitude to a pixeltruppen and then judge his behavior against that attitude. Of all the fuzzy, hard to determine factors, what any single virtual-trooper "feels" at a given instant is probably the fuzziest and most difficult to determine.

The fact that Private Schmidt is cowerng on the ground behind the best available cove he can find should give us a broad hint. On the other hand Private Schultz could be taking quick, unaimed shots. Both are effectively suppressed either not shooting at all or shooting ineffectively.