British Army in the East--Could've Happened!

[John Kettler]

I have no idea whether this is possible by swapping things from CMBN into CMRT, but it's simply too amazing not to share.

In reading Bradley Smith's most informative Sharing Secrets with Stalin, I came across a Grade One bombshell. On September 28, 1941 Stalin specifically requested the British send several divisions to Russia to fight alongside the Red Army. Britain wanted to be in the Caucasus Front, so as to be positioned to wreck the oilfields should it come to that. Stalin said there was no war there; that Britain should instead go to the Ukraine Front--where there was a war.

On December 8, 1941, Stalin tried again, this time proposing the British troops he sought be sent to the Leningrad Front. When the British failed to jump, he instead proposed placing them on the Estonian Front, which he thought they'd find more congenial.

Britain obviously never took up the offer, but Bradley Smith deems this was a truly significant fork in the course of East-West relations, arguing that had Britain really put up and shared even a part of the direct combat burden, Stalin would've had a considerably different take then and post-war on Britain and, by extension, the Allies en bloc. I emphatically agree.

Be these as they may, my notion is straightforward but may well be utterly impractical. The idea is to port British forces into CMRT from CMBN and use them to create a whole new range of Op Bagration gaming possibilities, scenarios based on a British troop commitment to Russia circa 1942 which would then be projected forward in time, yielding , by the most convenient of circumstances, the very TO&Es which CMBN and CW have for the CW forces. Were such a thing doable, I believe it would be thrilling for the CW player to be freed of the terrain constraints bedeviling ops in both Normandy and Holland. Long range DF gunnery would become important, and artillery would perform more closely to historical levels, thanks to much greater map sizes. Tacair would become more effective because of the great openness of the land, making hiding from it harder and AA accordingly more important. AA Crusaders could actually do AA work. Of course, someone else will have to sort out the vexed Bren AA tripod mount business!

Regards,

John Kettler

[George MC]

It's already been done but not with CMRT but using CMBN

[Der Alte Fritz]

If I can remind you John about the US Airforce Group that operated out of Russia for a while in an effort to bomb the Pleosti oilfields. Ably recounted in the book "The Poltava Affair"

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=113&t=46840

[Michael Emrys]

Britain obviously never took up the offer, but Bradley Smith deems this was a truly significant fork in the course of East-West relations, arguing that had Britain really put up and shared even a part of the direct combat burden, Stalin would've had a considerably different take then and post-war on Britain and, by extension, the Allies en bloc. I emphatically agree.

What's your thinking on that, John? For my part, I am skeptical. Stalin might have warmed to the UK a bit if they had taken him up, but it would be temporary. If Stalin was really capable of long-term bonding with the Western Allies, he already had every reason to do so. The cost in lives, hulls, and matériel of the Murmansk runs was enough to show they were serious brothers in arms. But once the common enemy was out of the way, East and West were back to dagger point again.

Michael

[bruce90]

As a side note, I can recommend Simon Sebag-Montefiores' books on Stalin. Great read.

[Sequoia]

In summer/fall 1941 the Commonwealth had their hands full enough with Rommel, plus they had just occupied Iraq, Vichy controlled Syria and Lebanon, and cooperated with the Soviets to invade Iran. Additionally there was plenty of justified concern about the Japanese so no I don't think it really could have happened. Japan attacking the Soviets would have been more likely. There's a recent board game "Strike North" covering this possibility.