wingedone Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 It's been a while since I have been on these forums. So long in fact, I had to re-register. Trying to decide whether or not to purchase the new CM. I have read extensively about the lack of a armor firing arc and issues with ATG that I have not had to deal with, with my CM1 versions for the last 10 years. Those are changes I expect to see, so they are not a big concern to me. But aside from those ongoing issues, I have noticed the following that concern me in the demo I have been playing. I have seen some notice about changes in updates and wonder if they have worked. 1) Death by artillery while in foxholes and trenches. In CM1 you were lucky to kill 1 or 2 guys with a direct hit. In CM2 demo, they die in big numbers without direct hits. Has there been any changes from the demo? Man, getting old sucks. Can't for the life of me remember B? Oh well, it will come to me, and I want to know about the foxholes and trenches. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 You need to wipe you memory before entering CM2 world, or just imagine their never was a CM1. In CM2 world, artillery is the most dangerous weapon in the game, it can win a game on it's own if played well, especially when playing as the Brits. As for foxholes and trenches, i've never actually met them, but i hear one is shallow and the other one deep (they offer more protection in CMBN v.1.10) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 If you have interest in wargames I can't see how you cannot buy the game(s). They are by far the best of their genre currently available COTS. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Wingedone, meet John Kettler. John, meet Wingedone. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 What Erwin said. (I am not however a veteran of CM1). Lawrence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Remember that "it wasn't that way in CMx1" doesn't mean CMx1 was right. If arty is more lethal in x2, then it's probably because they've had 10 more years to research how to represent it. (And we've had threads complaining that it's too feeble, too). Foxholes and trenches got a significant boost in protection, AIUI, in v1.10. Make sure your demo is the most recent version (post Commonwealth). The armour firing arc will be in BN by the end of the year as an upgrade (for a nominal fee), and is included in the new "family" CM Fortress Italy from release, which should be RSN, since they've actually announced it. Problems with ATGs, as far as I am concerned, stem from unrealistic expectations of their performance, possibly fed by failure to grok the transition between x1 and x2. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingedone Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share Posted July 5, 2012 Thanks for the responses. I do have version 1.10 of the demo. Gives me pause. I tried to write my OP so as to not be judgemental on CM1 versus CM2 because I am not in a position to judge. I just wanted to note that there is significant differences. Reminds me of something I posted here a long time ago when playing CMBB, B&T Taking the Train. After getting my butt handed to me by a Russian 76.2 AA gun that was surrounded by a stone fence, I decided to test what would happen if I just dropped mortars on it first. 110 rounds of 81mm, of which 1/4 hit inside the stone fence. 3 times I tried that. Nothing. Didn't faze them a bit. Kind of learned then, that in CM1, if you haven't seen it, you can't kill it. I was wondering how CM2 was handling it now. I tend to play as the Germans. Which means being on the receiving end of a lot of ordnance. Really do appreciate the input. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Reminds me of something I posted here a long time ago when playing CMBB, B&T Taking the Train. After getting my butt handed to me by a Russian 76.2 AA gun that was surrounded by a stone fence, I decided to test what would happen if I just dropped mortars on it first. 110 rounds of 81mm, of which 1/4 hit inside the stone fence. 3 times I tried that. Nothing. Didn't faze them a bit. Kind of learned then, that in CM1, if you haven't seen it, you can't kill it. I was wondering how CM2 was handling it now. I tend to play as the Germans. Which means being on the receiving end of a lot of ordnance. Really do appreciate the input. If you dropped 110 rounds of 81mm on a point target with no overhead cover in BN, you'd not be able to count the craters because they were obliterated by other craters, and your target would (if affected at all by 81mm HE; some armour's pretty tough) be a smoking ruin. Getting the FO to call the mission in might be the trick though, if they couldn't see over the wall; they can target "slightly" out of their official LOS, and if the gun could shoot out, I don't think you'd have much problem. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 <snip>110 rounds of 81mm, of which 1/4 hit inside the stone fence. 3 times I tried that. Nothing. Didn't faze them a bit. Kind of learned then, that in CM1, if you haven't seen it, you can't kill it. I was wondering how CM2 was handling it now. I tend to play as the Germans. Which means being on the receiving end of a lot of ordnance I experienced something similar but not quite the same. In a scenario, that shall remain nameless to avoid spoilers, a platoon of GIs came upon an infantry gun behind a low stone wall surrounding a couple of buildings. The space the gun and crew were in was a couple of action squares in size. While a rifle section kept their heads down they brought up a 60mm mortar. The mortar team could not see the gun or crew but could area fire into the centre of the walled area. The rifle section could see the gun but only saw the crew when they were not cowering. It took several minutes and most of the load of 60mm shells (I forget the full count) but they killed all the crew. Keep in mind that some shells landed on the roofs of the buildings and others outside the wall. Eventually the platoon over ran that position and found the gun in working order abandoned by the crew and no survivors. So, in CM2 you can defiantly kill soldiers that you cannot see. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 So, in CM2 you can defiantly kill soldiers that you cannot see. Hell you can kill soldiers you can't see, that you didn't suspect were present and weren't aiming at, using ammo that's designed to kill armour, not infantry. Stupid ricochets, misses, overshoots, overpenetrations and bursting charges. How come it's always the AI that gets that sort of lucky? (I know, I know, if I can't see them, I won't know when it happens in my favour... ) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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