Vanir Ausf B Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Test 1 Cromwell VII firing at Panther D Full hull down (2 meter berm) range 500m 577 hits * 281 -- 49% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) 278 no damage 3 partial penetrations * 189 -- 33% -- Front Turret 156 no damage 31 spalling 2 partial penetrations 2 penetrations * 107 -- 18.5% -- Weapon (gun hit/disabled) Comments: 1/3 of hit striking the front turret armor seems excessive given how much of the front turret area is covered by the mantlet (see pics below). Test 2 Cromwell VII firing at Panther D partial hull down (1 meter berm) range 100m 654 hits * 469 -- 72% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) 413 no damage 52 partial penetrations 4 penetrations * 123 -- 19% -- Front Turret 55 no damage 49 spalls 19 partial penetrations * 60 -- 9% -- Weapon (gun hit/disabled) * 1 Forward top hull no damage * 1 Ricochet Forward Top Hull penetration Comments: Hit distribution seems more in line with expectations. I don't know why there is such a significant difference with Test 1. This was the only test where I witnessed the infamous Panther shot trap do something, albeit only once. Test 3 Cromwell VII firing at Panther D partial hull down (1 meter berm) range 500m 566 hits * 379 -- 67% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) 374 no damage 3 partial penetrations 2 penetrations * 119 -- 21% -- Weapon (gun hit/disabled) * 68 -- 12% -- Front Turret 56 no damage 8 spallings 3 partial penetration 1 penetration Comments: Moving from 100m to 500m about doubles the likelyhood of a the main gun getting hit. No idea why. On the positive side the proportion of front turret armor hits looks about right. Test 4 Cromwell VII firing at Tiger I Late full hull down (2 meter berm) range 500m 553 hits * 297 -- 54% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) 297 no damage * 195 -- 35% -- Front Turret 151 no damage 38 spalls 5 partial penetrations 1 penetration * 43 -- 7% -- Weapon Mount (gun hit/disabled) * 14 -- 2% -- Right Front Turret (rounded side visible) 14 no damage * 4 -- 1% -- Left Front Turret (rounded side visible) 4 no damage Comments: Very similar distribution to the Panther under identical test conditions. And that is a problem, because while 1/3 of turret hits striking the Panther front turret armor not covered by the mantlet is excessive it is completely crazy for the Tiger because the Tiger's mantlet covers virtually the entire front turret area. The actual number of hits on the Tiger's front turret armor that do not first penetrate the mantlet should be 0 or very close to 0. Test 5 Cromwell VII firing at Tiger I Late full hull down on reverse slope (2 meter berm with Tiger on reverse slope, as opposed to further back from the berm on level ground in other tests) range 500m 648 hits * 364 -- 56% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) 362 no damage 1 partial penetration 1 penetration * 255 -- 39% -- Weapon (gun hit/disabled) * 27 -- 4% -- Front Turret 22 no damage 5 spalls * 2 Right Front Turret (rounded side visible) 2 no damage Comments: Placing the tank angled vertically increases the exposed area of the gun barrel and decreases the exposed area of the rest of the turret relative to the shooter so the direction of migration in hit location makes sense, although 39% of hits disabling the main gun does seem a bit excessive even in this situation (but I admittedly can't prove that ) The 2 penetrating hits through the mantlet suggests some type of weak point modeling. Test 6 Cromwell VII firing at Tiger I Late partial hull down (1 meter berm) range 500m 586 hits * 379 -- 65% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) 379 no damage * 140 -- 24% -- Weapon (gun hit/disabled) * 65 -- 11% -- Front Turret 50 no damage 14 spallings 1 partial penetration * 1 Top Turret no damage * 1 Ricochet Into Opening 1 penetration Comments: Distribution is nearly identical to Panther under identical conditions. That's a problem because once again even 11% of hits striking the front turret armor is 11% too many. Test 7 Cromwell VII firing at Tiger I Mid partial hull down (1 meter berm) range 500m. 530 hits * 356 -- 67% -- Weapon Mount 353 no damage 3 partial penetrations * 105 -- 20% -- Weapon (gun hit/disabled) * 67 -- 12.6% -- Front Turret 53 no damage 14 spallings * 1 Left Front Turret (rounded side visible) no damage * 1 Right Front Turret (rounded side visible) no damage Comments: Same as the last test except with a Tiger Mid. No surprises. Test 8 50mm AT gun firing at Cromwell VII partial hull down (1 meter berm) range 500m. 451 hits * 287 -- 63.5% -- Front Turret * 103 -- 23% -- Weapon Mount (mantlet) * 61 -- 13.5% -- Weapon (gun hit/knocked out) Comment: The Cromwell gets its comeuppance. I did not keep track of penetrations on this test (there were a lot which is why the sample size is a little smaller). Given that hit distribution on the Tiger and Panther was nearly identical to each other on this test I wanted to compare a tank with a much different turret layout. No real surprises although it is interesting that the gun was hit somewhat less often than the Panther and Tiger. Conclusions: I know the frequency of gun hits has been mentioned many times on the forum but I will let others debate that if they wish as I have no strong opinion on it other than I think perhaps gun hits should not result in a disabled main gun every time. What I do have a problem with is the seeming mismatch between the physical model of the Tiger and the underlying hit location. If you look at the Tiger in-game you will see that the mantlet does cover nearly the entire front turret as it should. But depending on various factors 12-39% of hits on the front turret are magically bypassing the mantlet to strike the thinner front turret armor behind it (the front turret armor is 100mm while the mantlet varies greatly but averages around 120-130mm). This makes a significant difference in Tiger survivability and it would be nice to see it fixed in the next patch* * unless someone can explain why this is actually correct, which someone probably will try to do because that's the way it works around here 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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