Winckies Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Hi there, I am new on this forum, and quite new to CM BN too, but I'd like to talk with you about a project am working on, to see your reactions, and to know if some of you could be interested in. The idea of this project is to build a website that allows 2 players (not more for the moment) to fight each other in a 1 vs 1 mini campaign, using the QB system of CM BN. In a few words, the website handle a strategic map, in which you move squads turn by turn. Every time 2 squads are at the same coordinates, a fight begins, and you have to launch a new PBEM or TCPIP QB, with actual platoons and sections that are present on the map. Once the fight is over, you enter result on the website that delete destroyed platoons. I have many ideas, and plenty of time to work on this project, but before going too far, i thought that i could get your opinions and discuss about the idea. Is it something that already exists ? Is it something that you can be interested in ? Thanks to all that might help me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Churchmoor Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Is it something that already exists ? Not to my (limited) knowledge. Is it something that you can be interested in ? Very much. I don't play games against AI so multiplayer campaigns would be something cool indeed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
para Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Sounds very good 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poesel Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 That is very interesting and definitely something I would like to play. What would interest me is about which scale you talk about and what about realism? 'squads' and 'strategic' don't go very well together. Tracking losses in units is a lot of work. Movement and spotting rules need to be thought. And being 'historic' is another can of worms. I don't want to sound too negative as I, like I said, would like to play such a thing. But could you please be a bit more specific about what you intend to do? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Check with noob, Winckies. His operational system might interest you: http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=99018 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerryCMBB Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I think they also run campaigns over at A Few Good Men. Gerry 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejetset Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I've found that the campaigns at FGM are actually quite hard to get into ... they are usually full. However, Noob is developing a very promising Operational System that myself and some other members of this board are play-testing and having a very good time to boot. Noob's system might be able to integrate into what you are trying to do. We are playing using box.net which works A LOT like a web-page ... with ordered file systems, integrated discussion boards, the ability to allow only certain people into certain folders etc ... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winckies Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 I am really glad to see that the idea is well accepted ! I don't want to sound too negative as I, like I said, would like to play such a thing. But could you please be a bit more specific about what you intend to do? I wanted to see reactions before going deeper in my explanations, but now that you talked about that, let's go further :-) You perfectly caught my words, I have voluntarily talked about "strategic" and "squads" because, for the moment, I face one big problem : When a QB is over, you can't see details of who was killed and who is alive. All I got is a summary of the losses and kills (X men killed, X men OK, etc.). As far as I know, the only way to track losses among platoons is to watch the QB from the beginning. Then, even if you were extremly patient and you'd like to track each loss, and even if my website will allow you to enter the losses, each time you'll need to launch a new QB, you'll waste time again picking and removing valids and deads units one by one with the purchase system. This is why, for the moment, I have chosen to reduce the smallest playable entity to the platoon. The losses track remains a problem, but I've got two options to fix it (as much as possible) : First one is to ask each player to enter battle report in a form, and, the application decide, using the death ratio, randomly which platoon is removed. Exemple : you have 2 platoons A and B, for a total of 30 soldiers. At the end of the battle, you loose 20 soldiers and win the battle. You enter theses values on the website : 30 soldiers in action, 20 died. If the application see that more than 50% have died, it decides that one platoon has to be removed, and choose platoon A randomly. Second option, more based on the fairplay of players, but with the same idea: Still using the death ratio to know how many platoons have to be removed, I let the players freely decide which platoon is removed according to the taken casualties. Any other idea will be welcomed So, now about the "strategic" and "platoon" cohabitation. Don't hesitate to tell me that i am a ****ing retard if i say stupid things (remember, i am quite new ), but this is how i see this application working : At the beginning of a campaign, you buy many platoons, depending on the size of the campaign that you chose with the other player. By doing this, you can compose a complete battalion, or at least, companies of your choice. Then you move platoons on the map (the map scale is adapt to the size of the campaign, it can go from tiny 3x3 maps, to 50x50 if it's what you want!). You move platoons one by one, but I easily imagine a group options to compose your own companies and/or battalions in further versions. Do you still think it can be a cool project? Don't hesitate if you see a way to improve this system! By the way i've got a question, is it better to make an hexagonal based or a square based map ? I think hexagonal are best, but i'd like to have your opinion. Thanks ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gumboots Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 When a QB is over, you can't see details of who was killed and who is alive. All I got is a summary of the losses and kills (X men killed, X men OK, etc.). As far as I know, the only way to track losses among platoons is to watch the QB from the beginning. At the bottom of that stats screen is a "Review Map" button. You can see all the remaining units for both sides. Clicking on each unit will show you the surviving troops. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winckies Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 At the bottom of that stats screen is a "Review Map" button. You can see all the remaining units for both sides. Clicking on each unit will show you the surviving troops. Mh yes, but dead platoons totaly disappears from the map ! I think it's quite hard to be exhaustive on the losses. Then, there's still the problem of the QB setup with all deads units of your platoons ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poesel Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 If you really want to track losses down to platoon level you either need very dedicated players (who wouldn't need your system anyway, because they would know the name of each fallen soldier anyway) or a referee (and this is quite some work - ask noob!). So for a real 1 vs 1 system you would IMHO need to abstract a lot more. I would suggest you go with points. On the strategic map you move points around and when it comes to a battle each side can buy in the QB screen according to what he has. After the battle deduct destroyed vehicle points (these can be tracked by item - not so many of them) and infantry by percentage. If both sides make screenshots from the QB screen both can check if the others calculations are correct. This totally lacks realism as each battle has 'new' troops but you don't need a referee this way. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Hi there, I am new on this forum, and quite new to CM BN too, but I'd like to talk with you about a project am working on, to see your reactions, and to know if some of you could be interested in. The idea of this project is to build a website that allows 2 players (not more for the moment) to fight each other in a 1 vs 1 mini campaign, using the QB system of CM BN. In a few words, the website handle a strategic map, in which you move squads turn by turn. Every time 2 squads are at the same coordinates, a fight begins, and you have to launch a new PBEM or TCPIP QB, with actual platoons and sections that are present on the map. Once the fight is over, you enter result on the website that delete destroyed platoons. I have many ideas, and plenty of time to work on this project, but before going too far, i thought that i could get your opinions and discuss about the idea. Is it something that already exists ? Is it something that you can be interested in ? Thanks to all that might help me. Hi Winkies, you may be interested in a system i've created for a fully automated paperless and umpireless operation using the John Tiller Panzer Campaigns game as the strategical layer and Combat Mission to resolve tactical combat. I am currently running an umpired version of the system as a beta test, there are two teams of three players and i am the umpire, however in the course of running this operation i have discovered some interesting things about the Panzer Campaigns games that have allowed me to create the umpireless and paperless system i have mentioned, i am almost finished writing a tutorial to show other players how to use this system to run their own umpireless automated operational games using the Panzer Campaigns games software, the system incorporates the Panzer Campaigns editable OOB that can be edited at any point in a operation, an encrypted PBEM function and an operational scenario editor if you want to create your own operations, the tutorial i am writing is specifically about playing a small scenario using the free demo of the Panzer Campaigns Mius'43 game set on the Russian Front, the reason i'm writing the tutorial for that is because it's freely available to anyone that wants it via this link: http://johntillersoftware.com/Demos.php To use my system all participants must own a version of the Panzer Campaigns game for the theatre they are interested in, as there are numerous Panzer Campaign games for all the main theatres any version of CM can be used in conjunction with my system, however because the demo is free it is ideal to test it out in the field as the full games cost 49 dollars, so if you have CMBB it will be ideal, however there is a Normandy version of Panzer Campaigns called Normandy44 which my system applies to, as it does to all the games in the Panzer Campaigns series, so if you and a friend or group of friends like my system when i release the tutorial i have been in touch with John Tiller Software and they are offering a 40% discount if 5 copies of the game are purchased. Here is a link to the Panzer Campaign operational games available to purchase: http://johntillersoftware.com/PanzerCampaigns.html I am at the stage where i have nearly finished the tutorial on how to set up a Panzer Campaigns operation to use with CM, once i've finished that i need to write up some rules and for building the CM battles that will occur during the operation and a simple system for calculating casualties and how to apply tactical combat effects to the operational layer, once this is finished i will post a link to my website and be available to answer any questions people may ask. It will probably be ready by the weekend so watch this space. p.s. The free demo i have linked to comes complete with a scenario editor, OOB editor and manuals for theses functions and the Panzer Campaigns game so it is worth downloading to get up to speed with the software as it's tailor made for running fully automated ops, the most attractive part to it IMO is the combat engineering functions, including mine laying, bridge building and destroying, ferrying and fortification building, all of which will be functional in the operation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Check with noob, Winckies. His operational system might interest you: http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=99018 I removed that link becuase i've come up with a new system that will be posted soon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Thanks for that, noob. I wanted to check it out but couldn't get anywhere with it. I thought it might be my system. Looking forward to checking it out myself. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Thanks for that, noob. I wanted to check it out but couldn't get anywhere with it. I thought it might be my system. Looking forward to checking it out myself. Ok, here's a massive bone, i've been inspired to complete the tutorial now so i am going to throw an all nighter to get this out within the next 24 hours. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejetset Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Ok, here's a massive bone, i've been inspired to complete the tutorial now so i am going to throw an all nighter to get this out within the next 24 hours. Awesome Noob! I really think you have something here. Let me know if there is anything you need tested. Cheers! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
76mm Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 noob, very interested in checking out what you've come up with, so no sleeping until the tutorial is out! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 noob, very interested in checking out what you've come up with, so no sleeping until the tutorial is out! It's out already, you can see it at this link:https://sites.google.com/site/combatmissionh2hoperations/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winckies Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 Hi noob, Thanks for all your explanations, I do think you hold something pretty good! I'll continue my project anyway, because i think i can bring a different point of view, based on another technology (the web), and maybe we will be able to share ideas! I hope to release a pre-version of my project as soon as possible, maybe by the end of the month to get comments and suggestions early to improve it. I'll follow your project with attention, and try it with my friend, it looks really good! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Hi noob, Thanks for all your explanations, I do think you hold something pretty good! I'll continue my project anyway, because i think i can bring a different point of view, based on another technology (the web), and maybe we will be able to share ideas! I hope to release a pre-version of my project as soon as possible, maybe by the end of the month to get comments and suggestions early to improve it. I'll follow your project with attention, and try it with my friend, it looks really good! Your idea sounds good, i was going to use the quick battle function when i originally started to think about operational CM, however i was put off by the fact that in the QB unit purchasing lobby you cannot change a purchased units ammo levels, which makes the operational supply situation impossible to apply to a CM QB, i've mentioned this to BF and i hope they add that function to the QB lobby in future patches as QB's are a really easy and convenient way of creating CM games within an operational context. I would be interested in checking out your websites when they are ready. As for trying out my system with a friend, you might want to use the scenario editor that comes with the Panzer Campaigns demo, i linked to it on my site, that way you could create a tiny scenario as a test, the Panzer Campaigns OOB and Scenario editor are relatively easy to use and all the relevant manuals are in the Panzer Campaigns demo game, however it can only be used in conjunction with CMBB as its set on the Russian Front. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 OMG, I just checked the PZ Campaigns link. I have most of those games! I didn't really like the system so I didn't play it much. IL2 Sturmovik took over so 10 years ago and I never followed up on WW II computer land warfare games until CMSF. I played around in those oob's some as well. I'm definitely interested in trying this out, noob. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 OMG, I just checked the PZ Campaigns link. I have most of those games! I didn't really like the system so I didn't play it much. IL2 Sturmovik took over so 10 years ago and I never followed up on WW II computer land warfare games until CMSF. I played around in those oob's some as well. I'm definitely interested in trying this out, noob. That's good, do you have Normandy 44 or Market Garden 44 ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejetset Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Hi mjkerner, Let's give it a go. Noob wrote me saying that there was someone that already had the game that might be interested. (I have a sneaking suspicion that he was probably referring to you!) For the sake of noob (who needs information and feedback) and for the sake of fun, please confirm that your schedule will let you fire off one turn per day on average. It is a pretty solid system that noob has put together and it should basically allow the fabled "Combat Mission: Campaigns" dream to finally come to life ... well, at least in H2H play. Hopefully, an Op-Level is something that will eventually be included in-game with the Bulge or the Ost-Front release. (Bitch Bitch, moan moan! ... 'ya hear that team BF!!) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 thejetset, I'm not sure if I'm the guy that noob meant or not. I'm definitely interested, but I will have to hold off for at least 2 months due to real life and one ongoing commitment to CMBN. I truly don't think I could even handle one turn a week right now! But I wish you well if you find another player. If not, maybe early May??? Noob: I just checked and have Kurson Pocket and Market Garden (and at one time I had the West Front/East Front package, although Tiller games, I don't recall if they were from the same series). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noob Posted February 24, 2012 Share Posted February 24, 2012 Noob: I just checked and have Kurson Pocket and Market Garden (and at one time I had the West Front/East Front package, although Tiller games, I don't recall if they were from the same series). Market Garden is perfect, that will be the next operation i run, so if you want to participate your in, there is a Market Garden CM module in the pipeline so when that's out i will start recruiting. There's a patch for Market Garden44 to bring it up to version 106 at this link: http://www.hpssims.com/Pages/Updates/up_PZC/Updates_PZC.asp#MARKETGARDEN44 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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