Edwin P.

Humit Intelligence Tech With each level of intelligence tech you can establish an intelligence network in a country or improve an already existing intelligence network. Each Intelligence Network in a country gives you a percentage chance(5% in a major country/10% in a minor country or conquered territory) per turn to get a report summarizing the number of units in that country. There is a 1% per turn that an intelligence operation in a major country may uncover the extent of their technological advances. Example: Germany achieves Intelligence Tech Level 1 It may decide to establish an intelligence operation in the UK or Russia or US or Canada or Egypt. It chooses the UK. There is a 5% per turn that it gets an intelligence report of units in the UK. Intelligence Report Country: UK Corps - 2 Army - 1 Armor - 0 Air - 4 Bombers -1 Ships in Port - 2 HQ - 0 There is a 1% per turn that it gets a technology report on the UK Jets - 2 Longrange - 1 AntiTank - 0 If Germany had 2 Intelligence Networks in the UK the chance of getting these reports increase to 10%/2%. Example 2: Say that the UK had 1 Intelligence Tech Point to use. If it assigned it to France it could find out when the Axis units in France are few. If it assigned it to Russia it could see the number of German units in Russia. The System would use a screen like the tech screen to create intelligence networks. Only in this case the screen would list countries and territories. Futhermore, intelligence networks can't be moved from one country to another. -------------------------------- Four Intelligence Techs 1. Humit - Human Intelligence .......10% or 5% per level to get report on enemy strengths in selected countries. 2. Signit - Signal Intelligence .......1% per unit per turn to see location of enemy unit(s)...Example: 1% to see Armor Unit1, 1% to see Armor Unit2, 1% to see Armor Unit3. 3. Partisan Support .......Increase chance for partisan units by 10%(20%Winter) in selected enemy conquered country... Example: France, Spain, Norway, Turkey, Iraq, Ireland, Findland, Greece, Russia, UK, Yugoslavia. 3 Chits in Norway = 30%(60%winter) per turn. 4. Counter - Counter Intelligence .......Reduces effect of the 3 enemy intelligence techs in countries you control by 1 level. -------------------------------- [ September 18, 2003, 04:52 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Retaining the same map and same basic game system here is my concept of SC2 SC2- Simple to Play, Hard to Master 1. Revolutionary AI SC2 includes a revolutionary adaptive AI that wages war with the best strategies of SC players. Tired of a predictable AI? SC2 has a library of over 200 strategies to select from to secure victory. SC2 also stores a record of the past strategies that its opponents used so it is better prepared with each battle it fights. With five levels of intelligence the AI gains access to more strategies at each higher level. 2. Realistic Fog of War In war nothing is known with certainty. SC2 recreates this environment and models the effects of weather, radio communications, combat air patrols, decoy units and intelligence operations. 3. Weather In SC2 watch the arrival of Russian winter as its moves north to south. In the Sahara see swirling sand storms hinder the capabilities of your units during the hot desert summer. In the Atlantic moving winter storms shield naval units from observation and may damage ocean going troop transports. 4. New Technologies and a New Investments Screen SC2 adds 10+ new research and investment options for players to pursue: synthetic fuels, cold weather equipment, the A-bomb and much more. The investments screen allows the player to allocate expenditures to obtain immediate improvements. Example: Spend 250MPP and equip 10 of your units with cold weather equipment. Spend 250 MPP more and equip another 10 units with cold weather equipment. 5. Interactive Events SC2 models over 200 historical based events in a unique decision tree model that allows you to respond to diplomatic opportunities, political opponents, governmental crises and resource constraints. [ September 21, 2003, 12:15 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Dan Fenton Excellent listing of the major areas for improvement. [ September 16, 2003, 10:49 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Just played a game at Intermediate with Romania neutral and in Russia I cut off five HQ units - 3 German and 2 Italian which were supporting 6 German and 3 Italian armies. The AI needs to allocate HQ units better. There was no need for 2 Italian HQs adjacent to each other on that Front. At least one of the HQs should have been operated west to oppose the Allied invasion. For Italy, I believe the AI should allocate to a front (Western Front, Eastern Front, Italian Front) or sector (Norther Russia, Southern Russia) at most 1 HQ unit per 5 units on a front/sector with priority for fronts with the most enemy units. Example: There are 5 Italian Units in the Russian Front (Russia, Finland, Romania), 5 Italian units in the West (France, Spain) and 5 Units in the Italian Front, and there are 2 Italian HQ units available. The AI sees 2 enemy land units in France, 20 units in Russia and 5 units in the Italian Front. The AI should allocate 1 unit to the Eastern Front and 1 unit to the Italian Front. Proposed Italian HQ AI Rules Rule1: 1 HQ unit per five land/air units per front. If ratio > 0.20 then operate HQ units to new front/sector until ratio is reached. Rule2: Priority to fronts with most visible enemy land/transport units and most Italian units. Rule3: If ratio of HQ unit per Italian units >=0.5 then operate/move HQ to Italian Front. (Why - not worth it risking 1 HQ unit to support 2 combat units.) [ September 16, 2003, 10:46 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Excellent observation. Perhaps the AI could evaluate its position and adopt a Moscow or Head South or Divide the Country strategy. It would then reinforce that front with air units, HQs, new units built on occupied cities and units operated in. If it selected the divide Russia strategy and this was successful it could then decide on a Moscow or Southern strategy. With Russia divided Russia can't build more units in the south. So: Past Marshes --- To Moscow ------- Take Moscow ------- Surround Moscow --- Head South ------- Concentrate Air on Rostov ------- Concentrate Air the Sevastopol --- To Voronezh & Divide Russia ------- Then To Moscow ------- Then Head South --- Attack on a Broad Front (Current AI) In fact, I would say that a Novice level AI should always attack Russia on a Broad Front. At higher intelligence levels give the AI a greater chance to make an intelligent choice. [ September 16, 2003, 10:01 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

I agree. When I first started playing the game's 1939 Scenario it was beating me soundly as Axis and Allies (it still beats me in the later scenarios!) It concentrated on the most important part of the war - the war in Continental Europe and it uses corps and armor quite well. The problem with designing an AI is that it is a never ending process. If you do not set any time limits on it to avoid scope creep then the product be it a game or an advanced warehousing management ERP module will never get out the door. As a designer you have to decide what are the most important elements to the AI and focus on those elements. The other items are added to a long list of things to add/improve once the most important items are resolved. In addition, you have to decide whether to release new features as a free upgrade to the current product, as part of a new product/optional module, or as part of a prepaid maintenance plan. [ September 16, 2003, 06:48 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

I agree, another reason why it fails against an experienced player in Russia is that it lacks the production base of a typical human Axis player. Example: 1. It never conquers Vichy France, but it attacks it. 2. It never conquers the Nordic countries. 3. It always delays attacking Denmark. Most humans attack Denmark on Turn 1. 4. It never takes Greece in 1 turn. An improved game where the AI has the capability to conquer the Nordic Norway & Sweden and conquer Vichy France would make the game more interesting for the Allied Player. Of course, updating the AI is one of the hardest and most time consuming modds that one could ask for. [ September 16, 2003, 06:44 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Panzer39 Most interesting

What can the Axis AI do better on the Eastern Front? What improvements would you make? In my opinion its attacks during the first half of the year are excellent, but it faulters when the Russian can finally build a line. This post is an attempt to collect a list of suggested improvements to the Eastern front AI for use in a future Version (SC1.08 or SC2). -------------------------------------------- 1) First, the AI does not seem to concentrate Air Power like a human player. It usually keeps a few air units far from the main front and Air units close to the front are not concentrated. Perhaps this is a function of the AI not being able to concentrate its forces on a single major thrust. 2) Second, the Axis AI needs to do a better job of investing in Tech. I don't know how many tech chits the Axis buys or when but my guess is that it is nowhere near the number that the average human purchases. 3) Am I correct in saying that the AI does not use HQs like a human player? It appears to me that the AI keeps the HQ units too far from the front lines and tends to operate them out too fast. 4) Humans normally buildup a large army on the eastern front. The AI invasion force seems to be much smaller. [ September 16, 2003, 01:23 AM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

JerseyJohn The comparison you posted between the UK Navy and the Italian and French navies is excellent. I never thought of it that way. Yet another reason for the Random vs Historical Variant option that Shaka Carthage suggested. [ September 15, 2003, 09:33 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Shaka of Carthage I like your refinement of Jersey John's proposal. 1. Its simple 2. It gives you the option of playing with random or historical tech development. JerseyJohn Have faith, your post came up with a relatively simple variant to the game that Hubert just might consider; 1. Random vs Historical Variant for Technology 2. Each major country would have their special field or fields shaded. They'd then need to place one chit in each of those areas to have the guaranteed result after a maximum dry spell; the second through fifth chits in those areas would work as normal chits, possibly triggereing a random advance. Kurt88 Is this what you mean by a decision tree event? When: If no technological development after 26 turns when at least 1 tech chit has been invested in that area. Pop-up Example 1: Prime Minister, our scientists report that they need additional financial support to complete the development of the new [Anti-Tank] system. Do we: 1> Tell them we can not spare them any more resources, we are fighting a war. 2> Shift resources from production to support their research. Our war effort needs the [Anti-Tank] advance they are working on. Effect: If (2) then Country loses 125MPP and has 80%% to gain a tech level in that area. Example 2: When: Country is pursuing research in two areas. Prime Minister, our scientists in [Area 2- Air Defense] tell us that with the assistance of our top engineers working on [Area 1- Jets] they would advance much faster. Do we: 1) Tell the scientists that [Jets] are more important. 2) Transfer the engineers as soon as possible. Effect: If (Option 1) then 50% engineers assigned to area (Air-Defense) are discouraged and research in area (Air-Defense) suffers a 1% penalty to research. If (Option 2) then [Jets] suffers a 2% penalty to research and [Air-Defense] gains a 4% bonus to research. My Comments I like the current implementation of random tech development. I also like the concept of being able to select to which area they would assign their best engineers and scientists. Perhaps, in a non-historical game, each player would have the option to select a single primary research area at the start of the game. Research in this area would receive a 1% or 2% bonus. Anti-Tank and Armor would receive a 2% bonus. Jets and Rockets would receive a 0.5% or 1.0% bonus as development in this area is more leading edge (Developement of a new gun requires less resources than the development of a new type of aircraft) Russia might select Anti-Tank and would receive a 2% bonus to research in this area. Germany might select Jets and receive a 1% bonus in this area. [ September 15, 2003, 02:05 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

JerseyJohn, Kurt88 and Panzer39 Most interesting ideas, its something I will have to ponder for a day or two. In the meantime. JerseyJohn, I see that Germany would get advances in 7 areas automatically. If I were Germany I would not have to invest any MPPs in research and could use the savings to purchase another 1750 MPPs worth of Units - 7 Infantry, 14 Corps, 6 Air Fleets, etc. Am I correct? Russia would get automatic advances in Anti-Tank and Armor but would this be enough to offset the German advances in these other areas and the extra 1750 MPPs that Germany would have available from not investing in research? Personally, I would require that a nation invest something in a research ares before the automatic clock starts ticking. You might even want to give players a choice of where to place their best scientists and engineers. For example - My best engineers go to Anti-Tank so the maximum amount of time for an advance here is 8 months for Tech Level 1. I put my second best engineers to work on Armor so the maximum amount of time here for an advance is 16 months, and with my 3rd best engineers working on Jets the maxiumum amount of time for an advance here is 24 months. This forces players to choose their priorities carefully. Another option to make things more historical might be to allow certain countries to conduct research in one area while they are at peace. Example: If the US had a research chit in bombers they might start the game with Bombers Tech Level 1 or 2 or 3. Panzer39 your idea is also interesting and the outcome is more random that JerseyJohn's but not as open ended as the current system. What your idea really does is to eliminate the chance that someone might get an advance in 1 to 10 turns - so no more Einstein's making a discovery that changes the course of the war. Thus most discovery's will occur in a narrower band of time - ie 20 to 30 turns not 1 to 30 turns. More comments to follow. [ September 14, 2003, 10:56 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Simpler Version of Events - without decision tree Rules/Variants: Events On/Off 1.2 Norwegian Simple Events 1.2.1 Norway Alarmed at Invasion of Switzerland When: 5% if Germany invades Switzerland Effect: An independent Norway joins the allies. 1.2.2 Norway Alarmed at Invasion of Sweden When: 5% if Germany invades Sweden Effect: An independent Norway joins the Allies. 1.2.3 Norway Alarmed at Invasion of Low Countries and Ireland When: 5% if Allies Attack Low Countries Allied Pop-up: London Times: The Norwegian government expressed its deep regreat and shock at news that Great Britain and France invaded neutral Belgium. The Prime Minister of Norway followed this with a warning to the Government of Great Britain that any futher adventuers will force Norway to seek the protection of other countries. Effect: If the Allies attack Ireland then Norway joins the Axis. 1.2.4 Norway Rejoins Sweden When: 5% if Germany attacked Vichy France or Switzerland and Allies attacked Low Countries and Ireland. Effect: Swedish borders expand to include Norway. Popup: London Times: The prime ministers of Norway and Sweden signed a mutual defense treaty today in the city of Stockholm. 1.3 Swedish Simple Events 1.3.1 Germany attacks Neutrals When: 5% if Axis attacks Switzerland, 25% if Axis attacked Switzerland and Norway. Effect: Sweden mobilizes extra Army and Corps when activated. 1.4 Spain Simple Events 1.4.1 Spain Alarmed by German attack on Vichy France When: 5% if Germany attacked Vichy France. Effect: Spain gains extra corps along border with France when activated. 1.5 Turkey Simple Events (only 1, for more see 1st posting) 1.5.1 Turkey Annexes Vichy Syria When: 5% when France Surrenders Effect: (80%)Turkey's borders expand to include Vichy Syria (Beirut), (20%) Turkey's border expands to include Vichy Syria and Iraq. 1.6 German Simple Events 1.6.1 German Submarine Units Off Coast of Canada When: 10% each game Effect: The two German subs in the North Atlantic begin the game 10 hexes (50%) or 16 hexes (50%) south of their normal starting position. 1.7 Polish Simple Events 1.7.1 Free Polish Air Force When: 5% when Polish Air Fleet is in UK or France when Poland Surrenders. Effect: Allies gain Free Polish Air Unit (Aka Fee French). [ September 14, 2003, 07:00 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Kurt88 and JerseyJohn Many thanks for your comments and words of support. I do not know if my ideas are practical, in terms of cost vs benefit as some of my ideas are rather grand (independent AI for Turkey). I do; however, have hopes that these events may influence the direction of SC2. [ September 07, 2003, 10:45 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

I like the current rule on transports being able to attack anywhere. It means that you can't concentrate your defensive forces at only a few spots and gives your opponent the chance for a surprise landing, in Greece from Cairo or in Portgual from Manchester or Oslo from London. It makes for a much more interesting and unpredicatable game. The only changes I would consider changing is having a transport at sea lose 1 strength point for every turn beyond the Xth turn at sea (reflecting loss of combat effectiveness) or having transports suffer damage if at sea in the North Atlantic during the winter months. To appease those interested in realism you could have two types of transports. The cheap version you have now, which could be used for short range invasions, and the more expensive transport fleets (used by the US Marines in the Pacific) which could be used for long range invasions. However, personally I would keep the transport system as is. Its clean, its simple and it works. [ September 07, 2003, 03:15 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

TCP Pilot Many thanks for the feedback. I made the cost low in terms of MPP because, in my opinion, it does not require a lot of cash to support a coup. IF material support was provided thru military units; AKA Spanish Civil War, the cost to Germany in terms of MPP should be much higher.

The objective of this post is to list decision tree events which would make for a more interesting game. If implemented most of these events would appear once in every 20 to 50 games. This series of 26+ events introduce Turkey as an active AI controlled country. These events add a set of "what if" variables to the war without increasing the complexity of the game. I choose Turkey because it was the largest European nation in terms of population and territory to remain neutral during WWII. It suffered the largest loss of territory in the aftermath of WWI. As such it had the most potential for altering the course of history. Event 01: Turkey Offers Support to Allies When: 1% per turn (from Axis DOW Vichy France or Axis DOW Switzerland UK until Germany DOW Russia). If Vichy France and Switzerland are not attacked this event will not occur. Allied Player Pop-up: Prime Minister, Turkey has offered to support Allied forces if we give them Egypt, Iraq, and Syria. Do we, 1) Reject the Turkish offer. (Turkish AI activated. Turkey will build units and move armies/corps to the border with Syria and Iraq. It will always keep one unit in each Turkish city. 2) Accept the Turkish offer. UK controlled territories in the Middle East (including Egypt, Beruit & Iraq) become Turkish controlled and Tukey's borders expand to encompass these territories. Turkish AI is activated. The AI will produce, research, move and attack independently of the Allied & Axis powers with the primary objective of reclaiming the former colonies of the Ottoman Empire; Syria, Iraq and Egypt. Turkey becomes an Allied Supporting Neutral. Allied air, naval, and transport units can transit Turkish territory. They can operate air units units to/from Turkey and trace supply from Turkish controlled cities. The value of the UK Merchant Marine in the Med increases by 15MPP per turn due to trade with Turkey. The allies do not control Turkish units or production. Nor can they attack from Turkish territory. Axis Pop-up (seen by Axis Player) London Times: The United Kingdom has returned its Middle Eastern colonies to the Government of Turkey, the successor to the Ottomon Empire. Event 2: Iraqi Coup Plotters request German Assistance. When: 1% per turn after France falls and prior to 1943. Axis-Pop Up: Iraqi officers have asked our ambassador to assist them in overthrowing the King of Iraq. What do we do; 1) Do Nothing (No Coup) 2) Give the conspirators limited assistance - 10MPP and 3 turns later: (30% Coup Succeeds and Iraq joins Axis, 55% Coup crushed by goverment forces, 10% Coup crushed and Iraq joins Allies, 5% Iraq joins Turkey and Turkish AI activated). 3) Insure that the consiprators are successful - 20MPP and 3 turns later: (60% Iraqi coup succeeds and Iraq joins Axis, 35% Iraqi coup fails, 5% Turkish troops enter Iraq to annex Iraq and Turkish AI activated). If the Turkey AI is active and there is a Turkish unit on the Iraqi border then German financing of a Iraqi Coup causes a check for Iraq to join Turkey as Turkish troops will enter Iraq to restore order. The chance for this is 50%. This check overides the check for the results of the Iraqi coup. Note: If Iraq joins Turkey then Turkey gains 30MPP per turn and the Turkish AI will be activated as an independent 3rd power. The AI will move and produce new units while it is an active 3rd power. This means that it will move units to the border of Syria so that it is prepared to sieze Beruit if Germany attacks Vichy France and Beruit is not garrisoned. Event 3: Turkish Allies request Military Assistance from UK When: 1% per turn if Turkey is an Allied Supporting Neutral and the UK controls Gibraltor or the Suez Canal. Prime Minister, The Ambassador from Turkey is requesting that we provide his government with arms. Do we; 1) Reject this request. (50% Turkey declares its neutrality. Allied troops can no longer transit Turkish territory or trace a supply line to Turkish Cities. Allied units are expelled from Turkish territory & trade with Turkey stops.) Allied Pop-up (if Turkey declares Neutrality) London Times: Turkey is insulted by British refusal to supply arms to its friend and ally. Their government has ordered all allied forces to leave Turkish territory. 2) Send Turkey a minimal amount of military assistance. (90% UK loses 40MPP & Turkey gains 1 Corps, 10% Turkey is insulted and declares its neutrality (see above)) 3) Send our friends the most amount of resources we can spare. (UK loses 80MPP - Turkey gains 1 Army Unit(33%) or 2 Corps(33%) or 1HQ Unit(34%)). Axis Pop-up (if UK sends aid to Turkey) Italian intellience repports that the UK is shipping military supplies to Turkey via Turkish flagged merchant ships. Event 04: Turkey Attacks Syria When: (5% if Germany attacks Vichy France + 50% if Turkey controls Iraq + 20% if Turkish AI is already activated) and no Axis or Allied troops occupy Beriut. What: The Turkish AI is activated and moves a unit to occupy Beruit. If this occurs Turkish borders expand to include Syria. Despite this invasion Turkey remains neutral vis a vis Germany and the Allies as neither party wishes to go to war over Syria, a small country with no natural resources. Event 05: Turkey Invades Iraq When: If Turkish AI is active there is a 3% per turn that AI will decide to conquer an independent Iraq. This event does not occur if Iraq is controlled by Turkey, the Axis or the Allies. What: Turkey DOW Iraq. Effect: Turkey gains Iraqi plunder once Iraq is conquered. Turkish AI will use all Turkish units except for units guarding Istanbul and Capital to invade Iraq. Event 06: Turkey Approaches Germany When: 2% per turn if Turkey AI is active and (Turkey controls Beruit or Iraq) and Axis has not DOW Turkey. Sir, The Turkish ambassador asks us to provide them with the results of our military research. He assures us that this will assure Turkish Neutrality. Do we: 1) Deny the Turkish Request 2) Share some of our research with Turkey. (Give 1 random tech advancement to Turkey and if Turkey supports the Allies there is a 50% they end allied support and declare neutrality.) 3) Share our research and give the Turks an Air Fleet. (Turkey gains 1 tech advance and 1 air fleet. If supporting the allies they end this support and declare neutrality.) Event 7: Turkey Offers to Buy British Warship. If Turkey Controls Iraq and Egypt there is a 5% per turn that Turkey will offer to purchase a British Warship. Allied Pop-up Event: Prime Minister, the Turkish Ambassador reports that his government wishes to purchase one of our warships in exchange for Iraqi oil. Do We: 1) Reject the Deal. 2) Sell Turkey a Cruiser ( Turkey gains 1 cruiser that appears in the Suez port in 5 turns, UK Loses lowest strength Cruiser in its fleet and UK gains 10MPP per Turn in mediterrean merchant shipping.) 3) Sell Turkey a Battleship (Turkey gains 1 Battleship in the Suez port in 5 turns, UK Loses lowest strength Battleship and UK gains 20MPP per Turn in increased Merchant Shipping) 4) Offer Turkey an Airfleet. (Turkey gains 1 Air Fleet and 1 level of Long Range Tech(if the UK has reached this tech level), UK loses 1 Airfleet and gains 20MPP per in increased Merchant Shipping) Note: If allies subequently DOW Turkey then UK loses the extra MPP production. Event 8: Turkey Offers to Sell Russia Oil When: 3% per turn if Turkey controls Iraq and Russia is a war with Germany. Comrade, the Ambassador of Turkey offers to trade us Oil in exchange for assistance from our engineers. Do we; 1) Reject their offer. 2) Accept the offer of our neighbors. (Russia gains 20MPP per turn in Trade and Turkey gains 1 Tech level in Industrial Production). Event 9: Russia chooses Turkey over Germany When: If Russia has lost control of Moscow and Turkey controls Iraq, Syria, and Egypt. Comrade: The President of Turkey has offered to Assit us in the defense of Mother Russia if we will give them all lands south of Stalingrad and access to our scientists and engineers. Do we: 1) Reject this offer. 2) We have no choice, Accept their offer. If this offer is accepted then: - All allied forces can now trace supply lines to Turkish controled Cities. - All hexes South of Stalingrad become Turkish controlled and contribute to Turkish Produciton - Turkish Corps unit appears in the three Russian/now Turkish cities south of the Causcus mountains. (Value: 375 MPP) - Turkey mobilizes for war and gains 3 Free Army units and 1 free HQ unit adjacent to capital. (Value: 1150MPP) - Allies can control Turkish Units and Turkish Production for 20 turns subject to limitation that 1 Turkish garrison unit is left in every city of Turkey, Syria, Iraq and Egypt and the three cities south of Stalingrad in the Causcus mountains. - If a Turkish unit controlled by the Allies liberates a capital city that country becomes Turkey controlled and the Turkish unit can not move out of the captured captial city. - Russia can build units adjacent to cities that can trace a supply line to the capital of Turkey. - After 20 turns the Turkish AI assumes control of its units and production and Russia can no longer build units adjacent to Turkish controlled cities. At this point in time the Turkish AI orders all Turkish units to garrison Turkish controlled countries. - Ie you are at Warsaw and half your Army decides to return home - Turkey gains access to all Russian Technology Advances. Event 10: Turkey offers to sell Germany Oil When: 1% per turn If Turkey controls Iraq Sir, the ambassador or Turkey wishes to offer us Iraqi Oil in exchange for assistance from our engineers in retooling their factories. Should we: 1) Reject the offer 2) Accept the offer to obtain the Iraqi oil. (Turkey gains 1 tech level from Germany in preference of: Industrial, Anti-Tank, Anit-Air, Armor, Jets,c Subs, Long-Range. Germany gains 10MPP per Month from trade with Turkey.) 3) Offer Turkey an Air Fleet instead of Technology. (Turkey gains 1 Air Fleet, Germany loses 1 Air Fleet and gains trade bonus of 10MPP per month). 4) Offer Turkey an Tank Unit instead of Technology (Turkey gains 1 Tank Unit, Germany loses 1 Tank Unit and gains trade bonus of 10MPP per month) Event 11: Turkey asks Bulgaria to rejoin Turkey and avoid Russian Conquest. When: 1st Time: 20% After 1942 if Russia controls Kiev and Turkey controls (Iraq, Beruit, and Egypt). 2nd Time: 50% If Turkey controls (Iraq, Beruit, and Egypt) and 3+ Russian troops are in Romania. Axis Pop-Up Turkey has offered Bulgaria the chance to rejoin Turkey as an autonomous province before the advancing Russian troops reach its borders. Do we, 1) Reject this offer 2) Accept this offer and urge them to move quickly, before Russian troops cross our borders. If accepted Bulgaria joins Turkey and Turkish borders expand. Turkey gains plunder from Bulgaria. Axis units are expelled from Bulgaria. Turkey controls any Bulgarian units in Bulgaria. Bulgarian units outside of Bulgaria are disbanded. If Allies want to enter Bulgaria they must declare war on Turkey. If the Axis accept this offer it shortens their Eastern Front and denies plunder to Russia while protecting Greece and Albania from a Russian invasion. If Accepted: Allied Turn Pop-up: London Times: Bulgaria withdraws from the Axis alliance and rejoins Turkey as an autonmous province. Turkey promises to continue its policy of neutrality. Event 12: Turkey Demands that the Axis turn over Greece When: 25% if Turkey controls Bulgaria. Axis Pop-Up: Sir, the Turkish Ambassador demands that we withdraw from Greece and recognize Turkish soverignty over Greece. Do we, 1) Reject their offer (5% Turkey declares war on the Axis and joins Allies, 20% all Axis trade with Turkey stops - See Event 10). 2) Accept the offer and evacuate our troops. Let the Turks deal with the Greek partisans. (Turkey's border expands to include Greece and Axis units in Greece relocate to the nearest Axis controlled city.) If Accepted: Allied Turn Pop-up London Times - Turkish Troops liberate Greece from Axis forces. The President of Turkey promises to rebuild Greece and welcomes Greece into the republic of Turkey. Event 13: Turkey offers to support Russian Partisans When: 10% If Germany controls Russia and the UK is still Active. This chance increases by 5% for each territory that Turkey controls: Iraq, Beruit, Egypt. 50% If Germany Attacks Turkey Russia Surrenders. Allied Pop-up: Prime Minister, the Turkish Ambassador reports that his government is wary of the growing German threat. If the UK provided Turkey with technological assistance then Turkey would be willing to lend covert support to Russian resistance forces. Do we: 1) Accept 2) Reject Effect: Chance for Post-Surrender Partisans in Russia increases from 0/0% to 25%/75% per turn, and if one partisan unit appears there is a 15%/25% for another unit to appear on that same turn, and a 15%/25% for a third partisan unit to appear. Turkey gains access to all UK technology advances. Event 14: Turkey Attacks Russia When: 2%(+1% per combat unit above 16) per turn after 1942 if --- Russian Forces control (Kiev and Minsk) and ---Axis controls (Paris, Oslo, Warsaw, Rome and Berlin) and ---Turkey has 16 or more army/corps units (6 are garrisioning Turkish controlled cities) and --- Turkey controls (Iraq, Beruit, and Egypt) Effect: Turkish AI prepares for an invasion of Russia and gains 1 Free HQ Unit(Random Value of 4 to 7). AI Will move units to Russian Border and units via transports to Russian shores. Once units are in place it will declare war on Russia and invade Russia as an AI controlled player via land and sea with the objective of seizing control of resource rich Southern Russia. The Turkish AI will seek to seize Russian resources and cities in the Caucaus mountains up to and including Stalingrad. If it can acheive this objective it will then fortify its position against a Russian counter attack. At this point in time it should have the strength to build 1 army or two corps each turn in the Caucaus mountain region. Event 15: Turkish Military and Logistics General. When: 1% per turn afer Turkish AI is activated. What: A Turkish General with superior logistical skills and command skills becomes a 3 star general. Effect: Turkey Receives a free HQ Unit with a random rating of 5 to 9. Allied and Axis Pop-up Cairo Times reports that a British educated general has assumed command of the Turkish Army. This general graduated from Sandhurst with top honors and served as the military attache with with Turkish embassies in the UK, Russia, and Germany. He is the recipent of several medals for outstanding performance in combat and received the Victoria Cross for combat actions during WWI. Event 16: Turkey Demands Italy relinquish control of Albania When: 80% when Turkey controls Bulgaria and Greece. 10% when Turkey controls only Bulgaria. Axis Pop-up: Prime Minister, The Goverment of Turkey demands that our forces withdraw from Muslim Albania and allow Turkish forces to restore Turkish rule. If we refuse the goverment of Turkey may consider that a declaration of war. If we accept they offer the opportunity to trade with their new provinces. Do we 1) Reject the Turkish Offer.(80% all trade with Axis powers stops - see Event 10) 2) Accept the offer and evaucate our troops. (Italian/Axis troops are relocated to nearest Italian city and Turkish borders expand to include Albania. Italy receives 10MPP per turn in trade from Turkish controlled Albania.) Allied Pop-up if Italy Accepts; London Times: Italy withdrew its forces from Albania today as it turned over control of Albania to Turkish forces. The cheering residents of Triana welcomed the arrival of the Turkish troops. The president of Turkey welcomed the return of Albania to Turkey as an autonomous province. Note: The more countries that Turkey controls the more aggressive their foreign policy becomes. Thus the AI is 80% likely to demand control of Albania when it controls Greece and Bulgaria. It was only 10% likely to demand control of Albania when it controlled only Bulgaria. Event 17: Turkey offers to Evacuate Italian Troops from Tobruk. When: 1% per turn after US forces land in Sicily or North Africa and Turkey controls (Egypt) and Italy controls (Tripoli and Trobruk). Prime Minister, The Turkish goverment has offered to provide transport our forces in North Africa to Italy if we give Libya to them. Do we: 1) Reject their offer. 2) Accept their offer. (Italian forces in Libya are relocated to Italy. Turkish borders expand to include Libya - Tobruk and Tripoli.) Allied Pop-up, if Axis accepts offer; London Times: Cheering crowds welcomed Turkish troops that marched into the cities of Tobruk and Tripoli after Axis forces disappeared overnight. The President of Turkey welcomed the people of Libya to Turkey as an autonomous province and promised to build schools and hospitals. Event 18: Turkey invites Romania to leave the Axis alliance. When (if Turkish AI is activated): 10% After 1942 if Russia controls Kiev and Minsk and Turkey controls Iraq, Egypt, and Beruit. 25% After 1942 if Russian controls Kiev, Minsk and Odessa, and Turkey controls Iraq , Egypt and Beruit. Mr Prime Minister, Turkey offers our country the opportunity to join Turkey as an autonomous province. Should we; 1. Decline the offer. 2. Accept the offer and prevent a Russian invasion. (Non Romanian axis units are relocated to nearest axis city. Romanian units in Romanian are now controlled by Turkish AI. Turkish borders expand to include Romania and Turkey gains Romania plunder.) Allied Pop-up (If Romania accepts): London Times: The Government of Romania has withdrawn from the Axis Alliance and joined the Turkish Republic. The president of Turkey welcomed Romania into the Turkish Republic and stated that Turkey will continue its policy of neutrality in this war. Event 19: Turkey Asks Germany for Iraq, Egypt and Beruit. When: 25% After 1942 if Germany Controls Iraq, Egypt, and Beruit and Russia controls Kiev and Minsk. Sir, The Turks have offered to transport our forces in the Middle East home if we would give them control over Iraq, Egypt and Beruit. Should we: 1) Reject their offer. 2) Accept their offer as we need troops to reinforce the Russian front. (Turkish borders expand to include Egypt, Iraq, and Syra. Axis units in the middle east are relocated to Bari or Athens or Sophia.) Allied Pop-up (if Turkey gains control of Egypt from the Axis powers). Cairo Times: Turkish troops marched into downtown Cairo today to the cheers of a million people. The president of Turkey welcomed the people of Egypt into the Turkish Republic. Axis troops had withdrawn from the city overnight. Event 20: Turkey Ships Oil to Japan When: 1% per turn when Turkey controls Iraq and Egypt. Effect: Turkish oil tankers bring oil to Japan. Turkey gains 20MPP per turn due to trade with Japan. This trade lasts until Allied naval forces embargo Japan (1% per turn in 1943, 2% per turn in 1944, 4% per turn in 1945, and 20% per turn in 1946) or Turkey loses control of (Suez canal or Iraq). Allied and Axis Pop-up Our intelligence services report that Turkey is shipping oil to the Japanses. Event 21: Japan is Grateful for Turkish Oil When: If Event 20 (Turkeys trades Oil with Japan) has been in effect for 20 turns. Effect: A grateful Japan provides engineers to improve Turkish factories. Turkey gains 1 tech level in Industrial Production. Allied and Axis Pop-up Our intelligence services report that Japanese engineers have helped the Turks to increase the productivity of their factories by 20%. Event 22: Japan is grateful for Turkish Oil When: If Event 20 has been in effect for 40 turns. Effect: Turkey gains 1 Air Fleet (and 50% for 1 to 2 submarine fleets that appear in port of Suez and Cairo). Allied and Axis Pop-up Our intelligence services report that the Japanese helped the Turks to field a combat air wing and trained Turkish pilots in air to air combat. Event 23: Germany gives Turkey Military Aid. When: 10% per turn after 1942 if Russia controls Minsk and Kiev, Axis controls (Paris, Rome and Warsaw) and Turkey controls Cairo, Beruit, and Baghdad. Minister, May I suggest that we give Turkey military equipment. It might encourage them to declare war on Russia. Do we; 1) Reject this suggestion 2) Send a shipment of military equipment to Turkey. (Germany spends 75 MPP, Turkey gains 1 Corps.) 3) Send Turkey 100 Tanks. (Germany spends 250 MPP, Turkey gains 1 Armor Unit) Effect: This may increase the chance for Turkey to DOW Russia as the chance for Turkey to DOW Russia is dependent on it having 16 or more units in its army. Event 24: Victorious Turkey Offers Peace to Russia When: 50% per turn when via Event 14 Turkey garrisons Rostov, Stavropol, Grozny, Stalingrad, and Tiflis. Effect: Turkey offers to sign a peace agreement with Russia if Russia recognizes Turkish control over the Cuacus region. If Russia accepts the Turkish border expands to include Rostov and Stalingrad and the hexes south of those two cities. Allied forces are expelled from Turkish territory. Turkey stops all attacks on Russian/Allied units. The Turkish AI then begins preparing for a campaign against the Axis to recover the Balkan countries by massing troops on the border with the Axis and in Transports. Event 25: Turkey on the March When: 10% per turn if Turkey controls Stalingrad, Grozny, Rostov, Cairo and Baghdad, Turkey is at peace with the Allies (via Event 24), the UK is not conquered, Germany controls Paris and the Turkish army exceeds 30 units. Effect: Turkey AI prepares for war against Germany with the aim of restoring Bulgaria, Romania, Greece, Albania, Yugoslavia and Hungary to Turkish control. The Turkish invasion will be massive, Turkish forces will pour forth from Istanbul. Transports will line the coastal hexes of Bulgaria, Romania and Greece, and surprise Turkish Ships and Subs will shield the invasion force in the Mediterrean. Event 26: Turkey Offers Peace to Germany When: 25% per turn if Turkey controls Hungary,Romania, Bulgaria, Greece, Albania, Yugoslavia, Egypt, Iraq, Syria. Effect: Minister, The Turkish Amnbassador suggests that if the Axis Alliance recognizes its control over its historic lands and provides the Turkish goverment with access to all technology advancements that we possess then Turkey would likely sign a peace treaty and cease hostilities against the Axis. Do we: 1) Reject this offer. Our armies are strong and we will drive the Turks into the sea. (50% Turkey makes new offer - We will accept a peace treaty without requiring a technology transfer. Accept/Reject.) 2) Accept this offer and give the Turks what they ask for. (Turkey and Axis are now at peace. Turkey receives all German and Italian Technological advancements. Turkish borders expand to include all conquered nations - Hungary,Romania, Bulgaria, Greece, Albania, Yugoslavia) Alled Pop-up (if yes) New York Times: Germany and the Axis have signed a Peace Treaty. Event 27: Turkey Offers to Take Control of Egypt & Syria & Cyprus When: 10% (1 in 10 games) when UK controls Cairo and Beruit Prime Minister, The Turkish government requests that Egypt and Syria be returned to Turkish control. Do we: 1) Reject their offer. 2) Accept their offer and evacuate our troops to England via the Suez Canal. (Egpyt, Syria and Cyprus become Turkish controlled and the borders of Turkey expand to encompass these area. UK Troops in Egpyt and Syria are removed and appear in the South Atlantic in 5 turns. Turkish AI is activated.) Event 28: Turkey Requests the Return of Syria When: 20% (1 in 5 games) when UK Controls Beruit and Germany Controls Cairo and no Axis troops are in Syria. Prime Minister. The Turkish Ambassador requests that we turn over control of Beruit and the surrounding lands to the Turkish goverment. He suggests the Axis will not attack Beruit if it is a part of Turkey. Do We: 1) Reject their offer. 2) Accept their offer. We can not defend Beruit. The Axis forces are advancing and perhaps the Turks will be able to stop them. (Turkey now controls Syria and the city of Beruit. If Russia is at war with Germany or the UK controls Iraq then allied units in Syria are relocated to the nearest Allied city. Otherwise allied units in Syria are disbanded and Turkey receives the income generated. Turkish AI is activated and will garrison Beruit). Event 29: Turkey Attacks Vichy Syria/Beruit When: 5% After France surrenders (1 in 20 games) Effect: Turkish AI is activated and moves Turkish units to Attack Vichy Beruit. After taking Beruit it will garrison the city and move units to the border with Iraq. The attack on Vichy Beruit does not activate Vichy France. Allied/Axis Pop-up London Times: The government of Turkey launched an attack on Vichy Syria declaring its intention to reclaim land stolen from it after World War I. Military experts expect that Beruit will fall to Turkey within 1 to 2 months. Turkish AI Notes The goal of the Turkish AI is to restore dominion over the former territories of the Ottoman Empire, to the extent that such actions will not lead to another defeat like it suffered during World War 1. 1> AI Goal 1: Defend Capital of Turkey 2> AI Goal 2: Defend Istanbul 3> AI Goal 3: Defend Other Turkish City 4> AI Goal 4: Conquer/Garrison Beruit and Baghdad 5> AI Goal 5: Conquer/Garrison Egypt if it can obtain ownership through Event 1 or it is not garrisoned by the Allies or Axis powers. 6) AI Goal 6: Advance into an unoccupied Tobruk. 7) AI Goal 7: Advance into unoccupied Sofia (Bulgaria). 8) Deter Russian Invasion by stationing corps on the border with Russia. IF (Turkey Controls Egypt, Syria, Iraq) and (France has been liberated) there is a 20% that the Turkish AI will launch a campaign to conquer Italian controlled Libya (50%) or (50%)Italian controlled Greece then Albania. This reflects the fact that the Turkish Generals see an opportunity to be on the winning side and gain the spoils of war. Turkish AI Production Priorities 1> Operate units to prevent Capital from being surrounded if enemy forces approach it. 2) Reinforce Existing Units 3) Build New Units Unlike other nations the Turkish AI will not invest its limited resources into researching new technology except for perhaps 1 chit in Anti-Tank, Anti-Air and/or Industrial Production. In addition it will never build bombers, battleships, or carriers prefering to concentrate its resources on building armies and corps. Game Changes to Effect the Above Suggestions 1. AI for Turkey: To control its actions while it is an Active Neutral country. 2. New Status for Country: Active Neutral - an active neutral nation can produce units, move units, attack, issue DOW, and conduct research without being part of the Allied or Axis alliance. 3. New Status for Neutral: Supporting Neutral - a supporting neutral offers transit rights and repair facilties to allied air, naval, and transport units (not land units) and will supply allied units that can trace a supply line to its capital. but is otherwise neutral. An enemy unit in a supporting neutral country can not be attacked without a DOW on the Supporting Neutral country. Allied & Axis units in a supporting neutral country can not attack. If a Supporting Neutral nation become a Neutral nation then all allied units within that nation are immediately expelled to the nearest sea hex if they are a Naval or transport unit or to the nearest allied city hex if they are an air unit. Example: A damaged British ship can be repaired at a supporting Neutral's port. Example: UK Air Fleets can operate to and from a supporting neutral country. UK Air Fleets in a supporting neutral country could not attack enemy transports that are within strike range. Example: A UK carrier or transport can move through the Straits of Istanbul if Turkey is an Allied Supporting Neutral country. It could not move through the straits if Turkey were Neutral or an Axis Supporting Neutral country. 4. Event Routines and Pop-ups for Decision Tree Events and News Pop-ups. 5. Updated AI for Axis and Allied Powers [ September 12, 2003, 06:43 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Many thanks, Much appreciated.

Regarding GalCiv's Expansion Packs: A Christmas (non-free) Expansion Pack for SC would be a surprise - new techs, events, new units, new variations - improved AI - Unpredicatable AI - north sea transit hex - visible weather - improved FOW - Same Map - Same Game System [ September 03, 2003, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Many games such as Never Winter Nights and Civ3 have expansion packs (such as Play the World and Conquests) that build on the basic game engine with improvements that are more substantial than found in a typical patch. I know that the powers that be are working on SC2, but I would certainly purchase an expansion pack if SC2 is expected in 2005 or later. SC > SC Expansion Pack (SC Gold) > SC2 [ September 02, 2003, 10:33 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

SeaMonkey I really like your idea on the Searc aspect of Naval Warfare. Finding a ship in hexes that are 50 to 200 miles across is not easy. Especially if they do not want to be found and you take weather into effect. It's also another reason why I like hexes instead of sea zones. Why? Hex movement allows you to sneak around a unit and makes detection so much harder. Perhaps you could have units move under one of two modes. The standard would be the defualt. A second mode - running silent/quiet - would decrease the chance of a unit being spotted but would also allow the enemy to get the first strike 50% of the time in the event of an unexpected encounter, unlike the current situation where they always strike second.

Now, if only the interface could change based on if you are losing or winning the war. From Bright and Clean to one marked by bullet holes. Interface 1: Winning the War Interface 2: Outcome of the war is undecided Interface 3: Losing the War [ September 02, 2003, 05:05 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

I agree, Retain the simplicity of Strategic Command. As for more units; 1. Air Defense - perhaps only if it affected air units flying over the unit or you had an air unit with a range of 2 or 3 that was an interception only - ie fighter only - air units with minimal ground attack capability that were dedicated to air defense. Or: Air Fleet - Attack and Intercept (400MPP) - Range Medium Bomber - Attack (500MPP)- Range Max Air Defense Fleet - Intercept Only (300MPP) - Range Short Air Recon - Recon Only (150MPP)- Range Medium 2. Marine - yes for attacks against a unit on shore with the ability to advance into the hex of an eliminated coastal unit- but have them suffer 50% to 90% losses if they fail to eliminate the shore unit and advance onto the beach. Army Unit - Army Transport Can Not Attack a unit on a coastal hex. Marine Unit - Marine Transport can attack a unit on a coastal hex and advance into that hex if the unit is destroyed. Suffers 50% to 90% losses if attack is repulsed. 3. Airborne - yes - especially with a lower strength on the turn that it lands - ie 5 as was suggested. Must start turn at Max Strength. Max Range 5 hexes (250 miles) Can not move on turn it lands. Loses readiness each turn it is out of supply. I think that the maximum entrenchment value should increase if you disband an engineer unit on that hex. This would allow players to expend resources to fortify important hexes, at a cost in resources and time (1 turn build engineer unit, 1 turn to disband it and fortify the hex). Thus it would only benefit players that plan their defense in advance. Naturally if the hex is conquered the hex should return to normal. I also like Jersey John's idea of having a higher Industrial Tech give you access to a new type of unit -Tank Army/Mechanized Infantry Personally I would like to see advances in two areas (says Sub 4 and Sonar 3) give units more capabiities. Ie With Subs 4 and Sonar 3 a sub unit can attack other Sub Units. Or Sonar 4 gives you a greater chance to spot submarines. [ September 02, 2003, 06:46 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

Thanks for your Feedback Moon Much appreciated. I wasn't suggesting that you charge for patches. I was trying to say I would release a major patch as a major PR campaign. GalCivs new updates are provided free to existing users (as is your policy and hearts of iron's policy), but it's released in such a way as to maximize the PR effect and attract new users. I mention them because I like their marketing concept. As for Amazon, I worked for a publisher and they listed their older slower moving products thru an Amazon storefront by linking them to related existing titles/products (in SC case think HOI, etc). For about $3 per order they got sales at a lower cost than Amazons standard 50% to 55% discount. Example: $30 Book. Sales Fee of $3 vs Wholesaler discount of $15. They believe that they reached customers who would not have found their products otherwise. Anyway, many thanks for your feedback its good to know that someone is reading these posts every hour, and best of luck with your product line.

Jersey John All good points. As for underappreciated vs underdeveloped perhaps I should have said under marketed. ------------------------------------------ Question: Would you pay $65 if it gave you access to 4 or 5 or more downloadable games? Galciv sells in retail stores for $39.95 (the developers probably make $20 on each sale). After you buy it you are given the opportunity to subscribe to their Drengin network which gives you access to all of their previous games, beta versions of games in development. The added cost only $30. For which you get access to several more games. From a financial point of view its a way to get income from those that have purchased the game at retail. --------------------------------------- Another idea to try, if Battlefront wanted to sell the game direct is to advertise it on Amazon.com via their Storefront option with the sales revenue (less a small order processing fee) going directly to Battlefront. The key on Amazon is that you can have your product linked to specific Titles via their ISBN. So pick a WWII title and link SC to that product so the customer sees a link to the SC store (ie Battlefront Store at Amazon)when they pull up that title. Just an idea presented for consideration.