anoldman

H... I am back. Sorry - AOM (NT)

I was thinking about how even with TCPIP things take awhile and it is hard to get through a full game. So I thought of making a SPEED PLAY rule something like: 1- Players agree on time per turn. 2- Both players agree on a Unit that will be an amount to be fined if exceed time. 3- If a unit fine is incurred then Unit is sent to a sacrificial spot for destruction or just to an out of the way location for rest of war. That is the gist of it and here would be the rules I would use to make that happen: ****************SPEED PLAY RULES****************** ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ At start of game Players decide on value of X and "Delay of Game Fine": Example-- X = 5 minutes, 10 minutes, whetever two opponents agree on. Delay of Game Fine = 1 Corp or 1 Army or 1 Tank unit etc... The higher the fine, the more bite you put into ending your turn before X time. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- SPEED PLAY would work like this: (I) Player 1, whose turn it is currently, sends out "START" msg. (II) Player 2 sends out "5" msg and begins watch for X. (III) <optional> Player 2 sends out 1 minute countdown msgs. (IV) Player 2 sends out "2 MINUTES" warning msg, then "1 MINUTE WARNING!" (V) Player 2 sends out "TIMES UP!!" msg. (VI) Player 1 must end his turn BEFORE Player 2 sends out "TIMES UP!!" msg or he suffers a "Delay of Game Fine". (VII) If Player 1 recieves “TIMES UP!!” msg, then he responds with a "ACKNOWLEDGED FINE" msg. (VIII) Player 2 sends out "Fine=1 Time=5" msg. This starts an additional X period of time for Player 1 to complete his turn, and the process repeats from STEP (I). Player 1 pays an additional fine if he again does not complete his turn and so on. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ *How to collect a fine:* (A) Player 1 recieved a single fine, and ended his turn before incurring another. ( At start of Player 2 turn, Player 2 sends out payment directions BEFORE taking any other action. Directions include: o The unit to be purchased o The location it is to be purchased at o The method of transportation to destination* o And last, the final destination of the unit. © Player 1 writes down directions, and sends back "Understood" or "Got it" or whatever. (D) Player 2 then sends back "START" and the Speed Play process begins with Player 2's turn. Player 2 then ends turn. (E) At start of Player 1's turn, before Player 1 takes any other action, he must purchase the agreed upon fine, name it “FINE 1”, and follow the given directions to send off his sacrificed unit. Player 1 then send out “FINE PAID” msg when complete. (F) Player 1 then sends out “START” msg, and begins his turn with the Speed Play process beginning again. *NOTE: Method of transportation can include Sea Transport. This adds additional cost onto “Game Delay Fine” and is further deterrent to exceeding given time for your turn. You may not require fined player to use Operational Movement. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PROBLEM 1 - Player does not have enough funds at the start of his turn to pay fine. ### Then Player 1 may not spend any money on reinforcments or research or new units until he has paid his fine. This may be tracked by Player 2 simply watching his opponents funds level. PROBLEM 2 – Player’s unit “fine” did not reach the designated sacrifrice location in a single move. ### Player 1 sends out final location of unit before beginning his turn. Player 1 is obligated to continue to send sacrficed unit by most direct route until it reaches its destination. Player 1 continues to send location updates to Player 2 at the end of every turn in which it has not reached its destiantion. PROBLEM 3 – Unit to be sacrificed ran into an enemy unit or disclosed enemy positions along its route. ### Player 2 has responsibility to name start point and end point of unit. Player 1 has duty to send to location by most direct route. Player 2 has responsibility to weigh danger of unit disclosures or chance encounters when he selects start and end points. PROBLEM 4 - Player doesn't send fined unit etc... ### Stop playing the person by TCPIP or throw SPEED PLAY RULES out the window... *************************************************************** So, what do you think? I think it would be a fun way to speed up the games and provide some penalty for not ending your turn on time. I think an X = 5-10 minutes and a Fine = 1 Infantry Corp would be about right. Thanks for pointing out any problems with what you see above or just giving me your feedback. Thanks --An Old Man =)

LoL... Wait till you play your first TCPIP game Dad... Then the addiction really kicks in! Send me a message if you would like to give TCPIP or PBEM a try. My school email is down until friday but here it is with an alternate as well: kshriner@gmu.edu silvercourage@hotmail.com I am in Alexandria, Virginia so EST. Look forward to playing if you get a chance! Wish I had a dad who had been addicted to video games... --An Old Man P.S. Offer is actually open to all. I am no grognard and appreciate a sense of humor in my games. I am 1 win in PBEM, and 1.5 wins in TCPIP, but by no means a master of SC. I just like to play and have gotten some good luck so far... [ December 18, 2002, 01:15 PM: Message edited by: An Old Man ]

I think Zappsweden had a good point that I missed earlier about the long term effects a bomber can have when he said: "An air strike on a city or sea port where it goes from level 10 to level 0, will cost the enemy immediate loss+lower income for 10 turns. i.e 10MPP+(10+9+8+7+6+5+4+3+2+1)=65MPP!" This starts to make sense to me as I could see how it could begin to add uyp over time.(although I think it would take 2-3 turns to do 10MP?). I think Zapp also said that this would be more if it were attacks on mines? Why would mines be more costly to the enemy though Still just 10 same as ports or cities right Zapp? Based on all the great feedback I think my strategy for English bomber is: 1. Use bomber for sub hunts or possible 2 cruiser 1 sub attks by germany. 2. When Italy joins or close to join, dop bomber down to Med to attack Italian Navy and gain some xp. 3. Return Bomber to england after fall of france and bomb the city and port on the NW tip of France. I could also see the value in purchasing a bomber if Germany is tangled up in Russia or is not going for Sealion. Draining of German resources could be a great help for the Russians. Thanks again for all of the great replies! --An Old Man

Personally I think that complete German grey (or Italian brown) over the entire war map is not neccesary for an Axis "Victory". If at the end: Germany still exists : Marginal Axis Victory (Still better than history!) Germany and Italy Exist : Marginal Axis Victory "+" or even Minor Victory Germany exists & has more territory then at start : Minor Axis Victory "+" Germany & Italy & More : Axis Victory Complete Domination : Overwhelming Axis Victory Obviously comparison of final score given by SC is strong indicator as well. Anyhoo, just wondered what others thought was success for the Axis (or the Allies, although I would think it is just the inverse? ). In any case, thank you Hubert for this very addictive game! (Espicially when played TCPIP! If you havent played this way you simply must or you will not have fully enjoyed SC IMHO... I have only played one person this way but it was really exciting! ) Happy Holidays to all you SC'ers! --An Old Man

Wow! Thanks for all the great replies! =) It definately confirms my suspicions. For me I think the British bomber (only one in the game at start in '39 Fall?) has 2 options from now on: 1. Sell for $225 (Rambo) 2. Operate down into the Med to help crush the Italian Navy (since no fighters unless Germany sends one or two down). Thanks again for all the replies and if anyone has a 3rd option I am interested. I also disagree with Researching - Heavy Bombers. I would rather research Jets or Industrial Technology. Also, in v1.6 I think research is a more of a gamble. It seems to me the allies don't have the resources to put in research in the beginning when it is most likely to reap benefits (earlier you put in, more chances you have to hit the 5% etc.) If I had to adjust research I would either: A) Complex method - Switching form Rocket Research to Jets = similiar fields so more resources switch (say 50%), Sonar to Heavy Tank = unrelated so less gained in switch (10% for example). OR: Leave it as is although penalty for being further along in the field than my opponents seems a tad odd. Thanks again for all the great replies! --An Old Man

I have not had much use in the past for bombers and nor do I hear much traffic on the boards about the use of bombers in any appreciable way in anyones battle plans which leads me to question the use (maybe just play balance?) of bombers. They cost more than fighters but get chewed up at an unreplaceable rate, and usually don't seem to do as much damage to enemy units as fighters. I understand that being careful not to fly them into contested areas might slow down their losses, but the damage they do to enemy cities or ports seems simply unequal to the cost. I seem to get about 1-2 average on a bombing run against an undefended city and occasionally I still take losses. It doesn't seem worthwhile to get 1-2mp's from the enemy in any given run if the cost of an Infantry Corps is 125mp's or so, and the enemy is getting 150+ mp's a turn in anycase. A fighter striking a Infantry Corps unit does at least 10mp worth of damage if he knocks the Infantry down 1 unit, 20 for 2, and If I can get a tank, army, or *drools slightly* an HQ, then I can cost the enemy even more MP's and in anycase I may even delay the use of the unit for a turn while it repairs. Finally, even if intercepted, fighters usually hit the enemy fighters for at least one or so. My fighter takes a pretty good hit, but if it had been a bomber intercepted, then the bomber losses would probably be higher & probably wouldn't have caused a 1 hit on the enemy fighter in return. Bomber escorts seem sort of a poor choice because of the problem of it counting the escort as an attack vs. the interceptor (which then uses its' terrain defense and mauls not only my bomber but also my fighter!) So I am just using them wrong or are they just not that worth it? Thanks for any replies, --An Old Man P.S. I know 1.6 changed a lot of things but did it change the "fighter attacks, is intercepted, and gets to use its terrain bonus" bug? This most definately occurs. Thx.- AOM [ December 15, 2002, 01:06 PM: Message edited by: An Old Man ]

Well said CVM. And may I add in his defense that CVM is dedicated to SC, always helpful even to wargaming newbs like me, spends alot of time working up some fun AAR's, and has never pulled out his "age card". Bah! -- An Old Man

Immer Etwas , I am curious as to what your name stands for or means? I have never heard that before. Also is "Emmerwatas" some sort of slang or slur? I know sometimes I make a mistake although I usual add a (sp?) if unsure. I guess my point is I find these boards so refreshingly helpful and non-flaming even to newbs like me that I was a little taken aback by the the strength of your reply to Jollyguy. I don't know the facts, maybe you and Jollyguy go back aways, maybe Emmerwatas is some sort of offensive remark that I am not aware of. I hope not. I hope it was a misunderstanding compounded by the inability of email to show the facial expressions and inflections needed to fully understand some posts. ******************************************** OK MY MED QUESTION HERE: I am a little confused over this Med debate as I have not had the same expierence in my games (1 real PBEM player, 5-10 or so AI Games of different settings). I have seen the Allies preposition their forces to make a crippling strike on the two Italian vessals not in port. (btw, BUG in ports? Dang dangerous to attack a ship in port in my expierence. I know they get a +1AD and +2ND but jimmineys! =)) The Allied vessals make their strikes in a way that requires the remaining Italian ships to leave port if they wish to attack in return. If the Italians come out the British/French destroy them, if they stay in the Allies retreat to near "Little Island X"(urp, =( sorry for my wargaming newbness here, I am refering to the British island base south of Scilily). Between a English Bomber based out of Algiers, and maybe a French/British Fighter out of Little Island X, I have found the Med to be not nearly so one sided. Every plane the Germans take to send south to Italy is one less for France or some other expansion front. Anyhoo, interested in replies. Also, if anyone would like to demonstrate this to me by PBEM I would be happy to do that as well. Just send to kshriner@gmu.edu and please call the file: yourlastname-T1-Axis.zip ...this will allow me to keep my games straight. Also, please let me know which version you are playing (I have both 1.5 and 1.6 in seperate directories, I have not played much with new 1.6 although it appears to give Allies a small boost?) =) Look forward to replies or emails! --Kevin Shriner (An Old Man) P.S. If you want to PBEM please know I am not a hardcore wargamer. I am fairly light about winning or losing and enjoy a friendly humorous opponent. You may judge my expierence by my inability to name the little british base south of Scicily and the fact that I have only a basic grasp of main players, units and dates of WWII... so Woot!

I second the above opinion as well as the symptoms... Great game. Money well spent. Thanks to Hubert and all who made it such a hoot to play... --An Old Man P.S. SuperTed, lets go with the next AAR my friend! London is burning for Gosh sakes!

I also have ahd little success with England first strategy. Most success i have had is rapid low country -> France, then Baltic -> Russia massive push. England has (unrealistically I grant you) never threatend to transport over some armies to challenge my 4 Corps on the western front (one corp in each of major western cities of Paris, Low Countries and the two german cities. So anyhoo, I think Russia fist for me as well.

I agree entirely with Sol Invictus on this one. I am glad that simply taking a capital is not enough and that if the country still had an army with a sizable bit of strength and coordination there wouldn't be an instant surrender. Can't wait and keeping fingers crossed that Alexandria, Virginia Post-Master's are on top of their duties today! I almost tried to skip out of work... dang, conscience got in my way! Isn't there a pill I can take to get rid of that sort of personal character flaw? Woot to all those with their little grubby mits on the full SC game! --An Old Man [ August 02, 2002, 11:40 AM: Message edited by: An Old Man ]

Hmmm... Shameless bump of this thread because I am in full agreement. It seems to me that you have the upperhand at this point SuperTed but I am interested to see if the tide turns against you. Great writing, lots of fun to read, goooo...SUPERTED! Woot! -- An Old Man

I have used this strategy as well with slight variations. When italy comes into war I send one Army to take the french city to the south and send the other one to the northern italian port. Isend my fleet south to prepare to destroy British fleet. Next turn (Italy has no money to transport troops the first turn), I start my attack on the british fleet, and load up all coastal units into transports and head toward turkey gap. 3rd Turn I declare war on turkey, park a cruiser in the trukey gap, and land a corp on the east side of turkey. I then shoot through my transports. (I am buying only corps for italy at this point and sending them for the gap when ready) on turns 4+ I have my transports stationed off shore of the mines and oil fields ready to go. With my German forces ready, I declare war, land my italy troops and start destroying the mines/oil fields. My italian forces have 0 to low supply but they can move the one hex needed to destroy the oil/mines. Russian AI spends money to create 3 or so corps to defend cities and such in south. this is a bonus as the forces are not on the front lines where my german forces are pushing/surrounding/ and destroying russia's forces. I have watched as russia will continue to occasional spend additional money for corps as it attacks my weakend italian units who by now have accompplished their objectives and reduced the Russian mines/oil. Over all, it really makes my push into russia a lot easier. considering that you knock russia down about 50-60 dollars from the start, AND all of the money it spends on Corps to defend, AND the fact that those corps arent holding up your main German army, it really makes for a nice operation against russia. I play on the standard setting. I actually find this pretty challenging but as you can tell from my lack of naming cities and such, I am no wargaming grognard. Great Game Hubert! I need to change my Sig since I preporderd the other day Cant wait! --An Old Man

I check the boards in lulls at work or at lunch. Woot! -- An Old Man

Thanks SuperTed and Hubert! Anychance we can download the pdf manual if we preordered? Woot! - AOM

Hey Aloid, I like it. Great combination of some other great MODs. I would like to see the tanks given as much cammo/metal attention as the planes as a suggestion from someone with no art skills. Woot! -- An Old Man

Hey Aloid, I like it. Great combination of some other great MODs. I would like to see the tanks given as much cammo/metal attention as the planes as a suggestion from someone with no art skills. Woot! -- An Old Man

Hmm, I really like the idea of fog of war for me and no fog of war for the AI. Seems like a way to increase the AI without just giving it more units or strength. As a wargaming newb, I personally think the AI is pretty good but *shrug* what do I know. The game is fun and challenging for me even without giving Xp bonus or Difficulty bonus at he options menu. I would really like to see a Fog of War for me, and not for the AI, if Hubert is considering any patches or even a Strategic Command 2...

Also regarding the Attack Equations and such, I noticed that there must also be a random variable included. I replayed 4 or 5 different attacks a number of times and noticed a +/- 1 unit loss variation. I assume the greater the disparity the strengths of the units, the greater the influence the variable of war? Second, how can the readiness value equation you show when divided by 3 yield a percentage? Say for example (10+10+7+?+?)/3? Thanks, --An Old Man [ July 24, 2002, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: An Old Man ]

Hey Panzer Lehr, I like your Mod but I cant get it to work right. ANychance you can get it Strategic Command HQ and have them post it for download there? If not, could you take a minute to email it to me at kshriner@gmu.edu ? Thanks PL, --An Old Man

Two questions: 1. I enjoy Fog of War for my side as I enjoy the realism of not having a God's eye view, but I have heard that selecting this option hinder's the AI? Can someone confirm or deny this? 2. What is the difference between the two difficulty options? I understand the XP bonus side due to SuperTed's helpful attack/defend equation, however what about the Difficulty 50%/100% side? What does this represent? Do either of the settings actually make the AI better or more responsive or does it just strengthen the overall 'power' of the other side's units (Str 11 units to start instead of Str 10 for example)? Thanks in advance, --An Old Man [ July 24, 2002, 02:36 PM: Message edited by: An Old Man ]

A follow-up question. How can I 'see' my expierence? I see the medals fill up but can I ever see the actual value? is the value 1-8? (Colored top worth 1, bottom gold worth 1?) In your Attacker's Loss equation, for the defend_type_value would this be a '4' or a '2' if the defender is a basic Army (2) sized Infantry unit being attacked by a Tank Corps? What would confer a defense bonus? Terrain? I thought terrain only determined the maximum entrenchmant value? Thanks again, --An Old Man P.S. I really enjoy your AAR's SuperTed. They real inspire me to breath life into my own games as I play as well.

Wow, *VERY* Helpful to me Super Ted! Thanks! -- An Old Man

I noticed in my HQ experiment that my units that were at 90% Readiness and 10 Supply fell to 67% Readiness and 10 Supply when the HQ was removed. I noted that there was no increase to readiness simply taking no action for a turn. This could be because the unit was at its maximum readiness already though. Thanks, --An Old Man