gredeker

Hey BTS - How about allowing captured weapons use, but only in the realm of designed scenarios? That is, allow the Russkies to have German LMG or HMG or panzerschreck teams (and vice versa), but the team would have a lower ammo level, possibly lower rate of fire, and possibly higher chance of jamming. None of these units would be available for purchase in a QB, but they would be available to scenario designers. As a cross-pollination from the ASL nostalgia thread, captured weapons use is one of the fun aspects of ASL which is a lot easier to implement than it is in CM. In the Pegasus Bridge campaign I'm playing, my Brits now have two German LMGs and a Pak38 to use against the counterattacking Germans. There's even an SSR specifying that the weapons aren't subject to captured use penalties because the Ox and Bucks trained on them in England before the battle.

Check out this thread: http://www.battlefront.com/cgi-bin/bbs/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=023023 It should answer your questions.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Kingfish: Trust me, they hit a lot sooner than you think.<hr></blockquote> Nah, it'll take me a week to finish these last AARs. Treeburst, since I can't do anything else to affect my tourney outcome, can I have a copy of the spreadsheet? Pretty please?

The last orders in my last game of the tourney have been sent off to pixelmaster. No more thought is required on my end that will alter the outcome. It's actually quite liberating. Of course, I still have to wait for the resulting moveie, and I give myself a week before the withdrawal symptoms hit.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Enoch: Well, if you never take your CM CD out of your CD drive it would never get scratched. Duh.<hr></blockquote> Unfortunately, some of us have to share our CM computer with a five-year old who wants to play Reader Rabbit...

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Georgii2222: HA! Any "in the know" ASL player would know that you only need to take a PAATC (pronounced "patsy") when advancing into close combat with an AFV or when participating in reaction fire! NOT when firing a PF! MUAHAHAHAHA! Georgii<hr></blockquote> Right! You, uh, er... passed the test! Yeah, that's it! {Note to self - never attempt to post anything about ASL without the sacred Book of Rules in the same room}

Upon further reflection, I can say that CM has affected my ASL play in a profound way - I never play any more standalone western front 44-45 scenarios. It's all early war, PTO, eastern front, or campaign games. I just started a campaign game of Pegasus Bridge, a lot of which CM can't simulate - gliders, campaign game format, water towers, starshells, captured equipment use, etc. CM also lacks the arcane "insider" acronym usage of ASL... "This CX HS will make a PF dr then take a PAATC..."

{Sniff} That's beautiful, man... I still play both, but my playtime in ASL is become more limited. You forgot to mention the time spent in counter sorting, clipping and organizing (I noticed all the Plano ) as well as the setup/takedown time - where CM beats it hands down. The place where ASL definitely wins is in the face-to-face, back-slapping beer-drinking camaraderie.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by jloco: I agree with you about cities, most scenario designers tend to lay out Cities/Towns straight and even, if you have ever been to Europe this is hardly the case. In Europe streets are narrow and and very rarely run straight for long distances. I have had some luck creating some realistic European type towns, but it's hard to do this quickly within the curent game. [ 01-13-2002: Message edited by: jloco ]<hr></blockquote> I've never been to Europe, but a lot of the pictures I've seen have included odd-shaped buildings to fit odd-shaped intersections. Does anyone know if BTS plans to include more oddly shaped buildings, such as an "L" or a triangle/wedge?

And another boost - I just finished my game with Jukka-Pekka, and no huge surprises. There isn't much left of a certain town, however. I've also sent off the movie for the next-to-last turn in my game with pixelmaster. Only one more turn to do and then I'll be done with the tourney! I'll also have to write my last three AARs - I suspect they may be a wee bit shorter than my previous ones.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by CombinedArms: The question is--are you sure 15 moves will be enough? That seems like an awfully short game, unless the map and forces are very small.<hr></blockquote> With a panel of judges determining the real outcome, 15 turns sounds fine to me. Heck, make it 10 so the eventual winner will be determined more quickly! Putting time pressure on the players in certain situations might even be classified as "historical". [shudder] Seriously, the length of the game is one of the not-as-well-known but very effective ways to achieve scenario balance. I'm reminded of all those Banzoic-Nixon arguments in the ASL annuals where they list the pros and cons for each side, which often included a time component, e.g. "defender needs to hold out for two more turns than he realistically can" or "attacker is under severe time pressure, so has to either risk taking casualties and moving quickly in the open, or going through the woods and risk not making it to the objective in time". OK, this half-squad is going to double-time and get CX'ed...

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by redwolf: You made a slight mistake in choosing constant distance. IIRC, the 75mm L/70 penetrates the front of a Churchill VIII turret at 500m and below. So obviously a distance that is slightly more than that (20%), but still quite close maximizes the Churchill's success chances by keeping the hit chance as high as it can get outside the Panther's effective range. <hr></blockquote> OK, someone run the tests again at 200m, 400m, and 800m to provide comparative data.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by KwazyDog: I was testing recently and played out a battle against two T-34's with a platoon of Pz-38's. [ 01-09-2002: Message edited by: KwazyDog ]<hr></blockquote> Quick - update the CMBBFAQ! Pz 38's are definitely in!

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Madmatt: Next museum is in Dayton Ohio (54 miles North of Cincinnati) and is IMHO the best military museum I have ever been to (yeah that includes Bovington, Kublinz and the Imperial War Musuem) and that is the Wright Patterson Air Force base. Awesome displays, hundreds of exhibits and every plane is in flyabale condition! http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/ Neat Attractions: ME-262 (with 30mm cannon in its own display case!) SR-71 A-10 Thunderbolt II (you used to be able to climb into the cockpit) Multiple Simulaters you can ride in. SAM-2 [ 01-06-2002: Message edited by: Madmatt ]<hr></blockquote> I'll second the endorsement for Wright-Patterson - it's the Air Force's equivalent of Aberdeen, so a lot of captured, unusual and one-of-a-kind aircraft ended up there, including: the XB-70 Valkyrie; the MiG-15 which was defected in by a North Korean pilot, subsequently put through its paces by Chuck Yeager; Bock's Car, the B-29 that dropped the bomb on Nagasaki; a B-36 (the thing is HUGE), including the XF-85 Goblin parasite fighter designed to fit in the bomb bay; most of your standard WWII fighters; a Fiesler Storch; a Ju52; a B-25 (with the 75mm gun removed and put in a separate case for close inspection); and lots of other neat stuff. I felt like a kid in a candy store - four hours wasn't nearly enough.

Another update to keep the thread at the top of page 1 - The die is cast in my game with Scot - I plotted my turn and sent the resulting movie file to him last night. That one is really, really close, and could go either way. Interesting new developments in my game with pixelmaster have us both scratching our heads, trying to figure out what on earth is going on. Two turns left to go. My game with Jukka-Pekka is... well, let's just say that I'm hoping his tanks run out of HE soon. Three turns left to go.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by busboy: Hello! The yellow line means the unit that it is attached to has been spotted by the unit it is attached from (the highlighted one) but is not targeted. You may see multiple lines like this if the unit sees multiple targets. Also, the line may mean that the unit isn't firing on the one with the yellow line going to it because it is pinned down, or the unit doesn't consider it prudent to open fire (like a bazooka trying to hit a kraut jeep at 1.5 KM) Hope this helps, welcome to CM! Also, there's a dandy little FAQ floating around here somewhere too, that'll answer lots of questions for you, often before you have 'em!<hr></blockquote> Whoops, I'm afraid it means a little more than that. If you click on a unit, and there are yellow lines emanating from that unit, the unit(s) at the other end of the line are actively targeting the selected unit. They may not always get a shot off, but yellow lines mean that your unit is or will shortly be shot at. Yellow lines are BAD... unless they're coming from your units. And to add - the thick red line occurs when two units are shooting at each other. A thin red line (sounds familiar) indicates fire that is one-way. [ 01-09-2002: Message edited by: redeker ]</p>

I believe that the Brummbar is in for CMBB. If not, there's always the SturmTiger.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by CombinedArms: In my case the grey hairs were multiplied because I was crazy enough to make this tourney my introduction to PBEM play. Yikes! <hr></blockquote> Ditto here. I had only ever played one game of CM via PBEM before, and that one broke down on my opponent's end.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Splash: The Stuart has three MG's bow, coaxial and flexible isn't it? How are these arranged and how are they coordinated?<hr></blockquote> I'm not sure your question was answered, so here goes... The bow machine gun is fired by the co-driver/radio operator. It's mounted on the front hull of the tank, and can be swung in a limited arc side to side and up and down. Thus, it is limited to firing the same general direction the tank is pointed, much like a Stug's main gun. The coaxial machine gun is fired by the gunner, who also aims and fires the main armament. This gun is mounted in sync with the main gun (i.e., coaxially) so that the gunner can use the same sight as he uses for the main gun - he just pulls a different trigger if the target in the crosshairs is a truck instead of a tank. The flexible (or AA) mount is on the top of the tank, and is fired by the tank commander. On most tanks, this can only be done when the tank is unbuttoned, thereby making the tank commander vulnerable to return fire. On many tanks, this machine gun has a 360 degree traverse and significant elevation, facilitating its use as an anti-aircraft weapon. On most American WWII era tanks, this gun was a .50 caliber browning, whereas the other two MGs were both .30 caliber. Thus, an unbuttoned Sherman can engage three targets simultaneously: one with the bow MG (but it can fire only in the same general direction that the tank hull is pointed); one with the main armament and coaxial MG (but only in the direction that the turret is pointed, and note that these two weapons are "slaved" together so they must fire at the exact same target); and the flexible or AA machine gun can fire in any direction at any target, but only at the risk of the tank commander getting hit and making the whole crew shocked. I hope this helps. P.S. Wait until we get to CMBB, where there are multiple "sub-turrets" housing additional machine guns (T-28), or machine guns mounted in the rear of the turret (KV-1). Of course, these might cause so many coding difficulties that these vehicles might not be correctly modeled until the engine rewrite...

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Sledge59: They can be handy as decoys. Set them up to fire first and draw arty fire while your real forces get into position. The AI will identify them as "infantry?" unless your opponent gets too close. And before anybody asks, yes, this is gamey!<hr></blockquote> Doesn't sound terribly gamey to me - it sounds like a perfectly reasonable way to use them on attack. On defense, you can use them to drive your opponent to attack where you want and/or make him waste a bunch of arty or DF HE trying to take them out. At long to medium range, a LMG looks and feels like a HMG, and you can buy three times as many of the LMG as the HMG. Example: Imagine, as an attacker, that you have to cross open ground. When your scouts break from cover and run across, suddenly what looks like six machine guns open up. Most people's reaction will be one of three - avoid the area and try to flank it; sit tight and start a firefight (with defenders in foxholes/woods, buildings, etc.); or call in the heavy firepower to blast the area to smithereens. Whatever happens, you're causing the attacker to REACT to your setup. He'll either avoid the area and head toward another area (where you've hopefully deployed your main force), waste a lot of time in a firefight, or waste a lot of firepower taking out this decoy force. Will this always work? No. Will you sometimes lose that LMG position to a well-coordinated attack? Yes, and that's why that FO you have behind the lines is looking at that big fat TRP in the middle of your group of LMGs... Is it another trick to pull out of your hat and keep your opponent guessing? You betcha.

Another update - I'm almost done with my last three games, with each having three or so turns still to go. I think all three will go the distance. My game with Jukka-Pekka is particularly brutal; death and destruction abound. The game with pixelmaster is up in the air, and Scot and I are playing hide-and-go-seek with our remaining armor.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Mattias: I has nothing to do with US guns. In order to avoid confusion the shortened version of the 17lb cannon mounted in the Comet tank was called 77mm. M. [ 01-04-2002: Message edited by: Mattias ]<hr></blockquote> I stand corrected. I knew it had to do with differentiation somehow!

All units can surrender - I've captured depleted squads, MG crews, bailed out tank crews, etc. I once captured an entire AT gun crew - the tank appeared behind the gun at a range of 30m, the gun started to rotate, the tank blasted the gun, and the crew surrendered. My impression is that whenever the TacAI would ordinarily "break and run" but it can't draw a "run" line internally (similar to not being able to get a valid "withdraw" line when manually giving the order) it will then either surrender or stay hunkered down in place, with the chance of doing each dependent on things like command, experience, and global morale.

I've also seen some references designating the gun as the "77mm" (even though its true caliber is 76.2mm) to differentiate it from the American 76mm. It doesn't appear to have caught on, however, and most people just refer to it as the 17-pounder. [ 01-04-2002: Message edited by: redeker ]</p>

SuperTed is running some Newbie tournaments right now - look for some threads that have been started by him. You might also try posting in the opponents wanted section. I'm not the most knowledgeable about mods, but CMHQ at combatmission.com is a place to start.