Marlow

As far as conditions to use for a balanced game, anything other than flat, open maps should be fine.

I find that neither Germans or the Allies have any signinficant advantage in the point value department. Obviously the Americans can rairly stand up to German heavies in a slugging match, but you would be foolish to use them in this manner. Utilizing the proper tactics for the tools you have is the key. I personally play the Yanks more often than not, and have done OK.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by busboy: To my knowlage, the M8 was designed around the U.S.'s entery into WW2 as a recon vehicle, not a tank destroyer. At the time it was designed, we were upgunning because we knew the 37mm was obsolete. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The M8 was the ultimate result of a 1941 US Army request for a new wheeled Gun Motor Carriage as part of its new Tank Destroyer Force. The requirements for the vehicle included a turret mounted 37mm gun (the standard anti-tank gun at the time). The prototype was designated the T22 (I think), and the production model the M8. Once deployed, the gun was found wanting as an anti-tank weapon, and the M-8 was re-deployed in the more traditional armored car role.

In another thread, rexford proposed that the 37mm was not powerful enough based on existing balistics data: http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/Forum1/HTML/014560.html

Opps. Sorry, wrong thread. [This message has been edited by Marlow (edited 01-09-2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Fernando: Too many Allied players use it as a sort of effective, cheap panzer hunters. They launch them in droves to the rear of the German lines hoping to knock out some slow turreted German panzers with a side or rear shot. Do you think real M8s were used in the agresive manner as most M8s are used on CM? I don’t. If players do it and it works then IMHO perhaps something is wrong. Maybe they are too cheap or its gun is too accurate.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Not that I necessarily disagree that U.S. players tend to use them too aggressively (after all, their recon/screen role is not well modeled in the game); however, they were originally designed as tank destroyers, and only resigned to the recon role when it became clear that the 37mm was not up to the task.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jshandorf: Hmmm..... Species: Hiram Sedai Description: A peculiar omnivore in its own right. The Hiram Sedai roams the African Seringetti in search of prophylactics and stray cats. Its diet consists of cold pizza and stale, flat MGD but any cheap beer will suffice. Hirams have been known to attack humans on sight but because of their enormous girth and sloth like speed they present no real danger. Jeff <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> That would be Genus and Species, and it should be underlined or italicized, with the specific epithet in all lower case: Hiram sedai You could also put in a parenthetical common name ("Loseto<font color="blue">Giants</font>Boy") ------------------ This message brought to you by Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, Proud Sponsor of The Cesspool aka The 'Meeks currently exists as Polar Bear excrement' Memorial Thread [This message has been edited by Marlow (edited 01-09-2001).]

Burrrrp! Excuse me. [This message has been edited by Marlow (edited 01-09-2001).]

Sir Lorak, A report from the front. Another loss to Marlow for the famous crew of the fabled PT212. Marlow: WIN Shandorf: LOSE In a glorious triumph for the forces of freedom, Herr Shandorf surrendered his force of decimated troops to My attacking Yanks. After an iffy beginning, with the lose of a Jackson on the first turn, the Amercians executed a picture perfect attack on Jeffy’s defenses, resulting in: Allies (attacker) Total victory, 89 77 Casualties (18 KIA) 2 vehicles knocked out (M36 and M3 scout car) men OK 312 Axis (defender) 11 146 casualties (36 KIA) 65 captured 2 vehicles knocked out (Tiger and Stug III) 2 mortars destroyed 1 gun destroyed (75mm AT) ------------------ This message brought to you by Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, Proud Sponsor of The Cesspool aka The 'Meeks currently exists as Polar Bear excrement' Memorial Thread

As we are now nearly two-thirds of the way to the probable Apocalypse Peng - Version IV, I thought it would be a good time to resurrect the question of who should start the next iteration of the Mutha Beautiful Thread, and what it should be called.

Arguments in support of BBs from people who know more on the subject than anyone on this board: http://www.usnfsa.com/

Why not, I'm in. I can tape the pictures up in my attic to scare away the mice and squirels.

I can't believe that no one beat me to this. Time for a little sing-a-long: Alright everyone, and a one, and a two... Immanuel Kant was a real piss-ant who was very rarely stable. Heideggar, Heideggar was a boozy beggar who could think you under the table. David Hume could out-consume Wilhelm Freidrich Hegel. And Whittgenstein was a beery swine who was just as sloshed as Schlegel. There's nothing Nieizsche couldn't teach 'ya 'bout the raising of the wrist. Socrates, himself, was permanently pissed. John Stewart Mill, of his own free will, after half a pint of shanty was particularly ill. Plato, they say, could stick it away, half a crate of whiskey every day! Aristotle, Aristotle was a bugger for the bottle, And Hobbes was fond of his Dram. And Rene Descartes was a drunken fart: 'I drink, therefore I am.' Yes, Socrates himself is particularly missed; A lovely little thinker, but a bugger when he's pissed.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jd: So how would you like the jam spread? Or are going to defer to my rune: ohmygodiamabetagodevenifidraw powers, and let my true evilness come forth. Consider that I have a score to settle........ <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> There once was a lawyer named Morse Who had the brains of a horse When by Marlow defeated "I'll sue you" he bleated But alas, there was no legal recourse Do your worst, TortBoy ------------------ This message brought to you by Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, Proud Sponsor of The Cesspool aka The 'Meeks currently exists as Polar Bear excrement' Memorial Thread

Hey Crodachoo, where's our battle-o-doom? I miss kickin your Pennsylvania hiney all over the battlefield.

RETURN OF THE RIVER RUNT Staring Sean Penn, in his most compelling role since The Thin Red Line, as the daring Capt. Croda With Sandy Duncan as J. Shandorf on the forward .50 This Episode: Wildman's Bluff (or Frankly Mary, I Don't Give a Damn) And now a word from our sponsor: Have you been injured? Has your PBEM opponent won a game through the use of tank crew human waves? Are you offended by ahistorical tactics? Has that gamey recon jeep been keeping you awake at night? Well your troubles are over. Just call me, jd Esq. and I and my crack team of legal weasels will get you the compensation that you are entitled to. Remember, I'm in your corner. (that is unless you don't pay your bills, in which case, I'll sue you for every last penny) [Fade in from black … a melancholy bagpipe tune plays lowly in the background] Dawn breaks over the Schloss Peng. A bleak hopeless light that gives no warmth. A low rumble permeates the air, as around a bend, a tugboat from Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service pulls the half submerged wreckage of PT 212 towards dry dock. Capt. Croda observes the salvage operation from the shore. He turns away in disgust, as he knows that it will take several weeks to repair the damage from the run in with Marlow's dingy (down Bauhaus) Ol' Pisspot. Capt. Croda: Come on Shandorf, nothing to see here. Shandorf: Yes sir, boy did that Marlow kick your ass, I haven't seen and ass kicking like that since … Croda: Shut up you poxy headed pillock. Isn't he administering a topplement of epic proportion to you right now? Shadorf: Well, yea, but you were the first to lose to the newbie git. [Croda smacks Shandorf in the back of the head] Shut up already. [Croda turns away, and begins to saunter off down the road] Shandorf: Where you goin' capt? Croda: To drown my sorrows Shandy, join me if you wish, but don't open your piehole. The pair heads down the road to the Hotel Peng. A rather imposing structure, more medieval keep than hotel. In the dark and drafty hotel bar, Croda orders a couple of Yueglings (or whatever the hell they're called). In the doorway, a stranger appears: vacant eyes listlessly scan the room, drool flows freely from his slack jaw. A regulation USAF cap perches awkwardly on his remarkably pointy head. Wildman(AKA Mary): I know you! You're Croda. I call you out. I know all about the Cesspool, cause I read the past posts. See how smart I am. I can even count to 5. [the brave Capt. yawns and slowly raises his head] *not another one, why do they always go after me? Hey, I've even won a few games now, it can't be my 3 and 10 record, can it?* Who are you, and what do you want [Mary puffs out his chest] I'm Wildman. Didn't you see my posts? You know, I came and taunted, now you are supposed to fight me aren’t you? You staggeringly stupid sack of degenerate flesh. Give me one good reason I should waste my valuable time on you. You say you understand the 'pool, but it’s the understanding of a child, and a dim one at that. A handful of posts, and all in the pool. Even Marlow had the good sense to occasionally venture onto the main board. Now go away and annoy a grog in the 88mm penetration thread. [Mary slinks off muttering] nobody likes me, everybody hates me. Shandorf: Croda, you idiot, He's a Zoomie. There is no way that he can be any good at CM. Easy pickins. The Brave Capt.: You're right Shandy. HEY NEWBIE, SEND A SETUP. Meanwhile in another part of the Peng Marlow pulls ol' PissPot into a bank of reeds growing along the bank of the Schloss and cuts the engine. Pulling his straw rice paddy hat low over his eyes, straps on his chest pouch full of magazines and grenades, grabs his AK, and slips into the waters of the Delta … er, Schloss. He is preparing a new and evil confrontation for our hero … DON'T MISS THE NEXT EPISODE: CAPT. CRODA GETS NEUTERED ------------------ This message brought to you by Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, Proud Sponsor of The Cesspool aka The 'Meeks currently exists as Polar Bear excrement' Memorial Thread [This message has been edited by Marlow (edited 01-05-2001).]

Wildman, May I call you Wild? How about Mary? Your attempt at a deep understanding of the Cesspool is (and I mean this in the best possible way) is somewhat frightening. Your observations show that you have far more interest in the various and assorted inmates of the Peng than anyone in their right mind would care to know. Nevertheless, despite your efforts, the accuracy of your various character sketches clearly demonstrate that you have the brains of an eggplant. A few examples: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Wildman: SEENAPIE: Originator of the thread, but lately seems to be dropping off, his recent posts lack the vitrol they once had. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Wrong-o Mary, Sean-a-chiapet has never had much vitriol in his posts. Just ask Eagleboy Hiram. Seanachia has always been the 'pools semi-official welcoming committee, eager to embrace newcomers (especially the young ones) with as much warmth and affection as is ever seen in the pool (I know, kind of iccy isn't it). <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> GERMANBOY: No better name for the lack of testicular fortitude he has shown lately. Damnit! I want more posts, give me, give me, give me. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Plenty-o-posts O dimwitted one, just look outside of the 'pool. Lots of good stuff for all in the Gamey tactics threat. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> JD,jd,jdmorse: A lawyer. Enough said. I only hope he was not part of that blunder of an airdrop into West Palm Beach. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You forgot the most important part of your analysis of Sir lowercase jd: HE LOST TO ME! <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> HYMAN SEDAI: I can only assume you picked your name from the girly witches in Robert Jordan's books. Which from the tone of the posts was the tactic you used to become a cesspoolian. "I don't know if I could ever be like you Peng, its an honor to be here Seenapie..." You make me want to hurl huge amounts of vomitous mass at you. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You completely miss the point with our little passive aggressive Hiram. He is, perhaps, the most evil of all. Finally Mary, and please don't take this the wrong way. My inner Croda doesn't like you (especially since you failed to stoke his fragile ego by mentioning him in your first post), so you are cordially invited to Get the Hell Out. ------------------ This message brought to you by Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, Proud Sponsor of The Cesspool aka The 'Meeks currently exists as Polar Bear excrement' Memorial Thread

A pox on the Thin Red Line. What a pretentious piece of dog excrement that movie was. Now you want a good war movie? Try Cross of Iron, Go Tell the Spartans, An Odd Angry Shot (for you Sheep Shaggers), Das Boot (didn’t here any college literature dissertations in that one), or Platoon (for all its faults, a far better movie than TRL). Or how about Apocalypse Now … Which reminds me, I see that you are up to your old tricks Kurtz-a-chia: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Seanachai: I shall endeavour to return to leading young minds into the darkness <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Once I’ve disposed of Shandy Duncan, Elvis, Nijis, and dalem, I figure its just about time to finish that little holiday trip up the Schloss.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Los: In SPR they are supposed to be throwing mortar rounds not bazooka rounds. I've never done this but have heard that it's feasible. [This message has been edited by Los (edited 07-09-99).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Another CMH winner using mortar rounds as grenades: KELLY, CHARLES E. Rank and organization: Corporal, U.S. Army, Company L, 143d Infantry, 36th Infantry Division. Place and date: Near Altavilla, Italy, 13 September 1943. Entered service at: Pittsburgh, Pa. Birth: Pittsburgh, Pa. G.O. No.: 13, 18 February 1944. Citation: For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity at risk of life above and beyond the call of duty. On 13 September 1943, near Altavilla, Italy, Cpl. Kelly voluntarily joined a patrol which located and neutralized enemy machinegun positions. After this hazardous duty he volunteered to establish contact with a battalion of U.S. infantry which was believed to be located on Hill 315, a mile distant. He traveled over a route commanded by enemy observation and under sniper, mortar, and artillery fire; and later he returned with the correct information that the enemy occupied Hill 315 in organized positions. Immediately thereafter Cpl. Kelly, again a volunteer patrol member, assisted materially in the destruction of 2 enemy machinegun nests under conditions requiring great skill and courage. Having effectively fired his weapon until all the ammunition was exhausted, he secured permission to obtain more at an ammunition dump. Arriving at the dump, which was located near a storehouse on the extreme flank of his regiment's position, Cpl. Kelly found that the Germans were attacking ferociously at this point. He obtained his ammunition and was given the mission of protecting the rear of the storehouse. He held his position throughout the night. The following morning the enemy attack was resumed. Cpl. Kelly took a position at an open window of the storehouse. One machine gunner had been killed at this position and several other soldiers wounded. Cpl. Kelly delivered continuous aimed and effective fire upon the enemy with his automatic rifle until the weapon locked from overheating. Finding another automatic rifle, he again directed effective fire upon the enemy until this weapon also locked. At this critical point, with the enemy threatening to overrun the position, Cpl. Kelly picked up 60mm. mortar shells, pulled the safety pins, and used the shells as grenades, killing at least 5 of the enemy. When it became imperative that the house be evacuated, Cpl. Kelly, despite his sergeant's injunctions, volunteered to hold the position until the remainder of the detachment could withdraw. As the detachment moved out, Cpl. Kelly was observed deliberately loading and firing a rocket launcher from the window. He was successful in covering the withdrawal of the unit, and later in joining his own organization. Cpl. Kelly's fighting determination and intrepidity in battle exemplify the highest traditions of the U.S. Armed Forces. (emphasis added) From http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/Moh1.htm BTS, I demand that this be modeled in CM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Croda: What's this retired crap you filthy sack of filth? You'll be lucky to have any of your men live long enough to retire in our next installment. You heard of Andersonville? That'll be nothing compared to the horrors I plan on bestowing upon your gamey buttocks! Don't let your men get captured, because it will be a long road through Hell before they see the light of day again. Ask dalem what it's like. He had a good 20 men surrender throughtout the game, chicken-**** bastiches. So, now that I have killed dalem's little dog, I'll be certain to suffocate you with his steaming entrails. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well now, dog guts. I never done had them 'fore. Anythin liake chittlins? Thar's nutt'n better 'n a steamin mess o' chittlins fer the holly-days. As fer the rest o' your gabberin 'bout how you is a gonna kick my "gamey" britches, bring it on you Damnyankee.

Happy New Year to all you worthless wastes of protoplasm. May all of your opponents have tungstun, and tanks that use it. Lorak, A report from the front: The legaltruppen of Herr Morse will write legal briefs no more. The fine employees of Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, all recent graduates of the charm school in Joliet (bonus points for anyone that can place the reference (no, its not the Blues Brothers). Residents of Chicago not eligible), have removed the illegally parked wrecks of three mark IVs. Appropriate towing and storage fees will be assessed. Any tanks not claimed by the end of the week will be sold off at special auction. Marlow - win (Allied major victory, 70ish to 30ish) JDmorse (or the more streamlined and stylish jd) - lose It was a battle of epic proportions: I laughed, I cried, I kicked his little Axis butt. Two big thumbs up. One word for the defense, however, Tortboy did actually make a game of it after the untimely and negligent loss of his armor, and if he had just a few more men, the outcome would likely have been a draw. I will also note that I have accomplished what my esteemed sponsor, the Author of Pain, the Betagod Extraordinare, rune, could not accomplish: the topplement of Sir lowercase jd. Reports on other battles: Attacks against Shandorf and Nijis continue almost unopposed. dalem has almost unthinkably managed to make a game of our current battle by cheating, and knocking out a M26 with a (much maligned) mark IV. I hates dalems. While this will make no difference in the final outcome, it does make things a little more interesting for now. Eagleboy has finally begun his attack in earnest, and is making some progress, albeit at a high price. Speedy and I are just underway, he minus one tank. Things are just beginning to get interesting with Elvis is everywhere. After 10 turns of "Your doom is imminent," I think we are finally getting down to business. Capt. Croda (ret.) and I are finalizing our contract on a battle to end all battles. ------------------ This message brought to you by Marlow's Salvage and Wrecking Service, Proud Sponsor of The Cesspool aka The 'Meeks currently exists as Polar Bear excrement' Memorial Thread

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Enfors: Bottom line: This millennium started Jan 1st, 2001. A.D. means "Anno Domino" ("The year of our Lord"). Jesus was born in year 1 A.D (and died about 33 A.D, I believe). And for the love of God, "millennium" is spelled with two Ns! And it's "one millennium, many millennia". -Enfors-<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> AD = Anno Domini = Anni Domini Nostri Jesu Christi The current year dating system (AD) used in the west was determined by a sixth-century monk, Dionysius. His system was not based on an accurate date of Christ's birth, which most scholars have determined to have taken place somewhat earlier (4-7 BCE are the figures I remember seeing). In effect, the new millennium started a couple of years ago. [This message has been edited by Marlow (edited 01-02-2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeff Heidman: How about, instead, we compare the typical German tanks *used in panzer Divisions* to the typical opponents they saw? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> From Achtung Panzer! Discussing 1940 Panzer division strength: "Previously existing 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 10th Panzer Division had their Panzer Regiment composed of four Panzer Abteilungs. Each Panzer Regiment as well as each Panzer Battalion had its own Command Company. This company was made up of five PzKpfw II tanks along with other vehicles and towed artillery pieces. Each Panzer Battalion was composed of three companies. 1st company was equipped with five PzKpfw IV and ten PzKpfw I and II. 2nd and 3rd company were equipped with five PzKpfw III and seventeen PzKpfw I and II. PzKpfw I and II tanks, when possible were replaced with PzKpfw III and IV tanks." So each panzer battalion had: 5 mark IIs 5 mark IIIs 5 mark IVs 44 mark I or IIs replaced when possible with mark IIIs or IVs. If Achtung Panzer! is right, and these figures are accurate, then the "typical german tank" used in the Panzer division had either a one or two man turret, and no dedicated radio operator, the same as the French. All other things being equal, I'll take the bigger gun and better armor.

Leaving aside the question of whether the radios and three person turrets of the mark III and IV, even if deployed in sufficient numbers, made up for their deficiencies in armor and firepower compared to the French tanks, take a look at the British. The Matilda II outclassed any German tank of the period in ever category relevant to tank on tank fighting except mobility. This is clearly shown in that the Germans still had trouble with the "Queen of the Desert" in early 1942, long after the early war German tanks were obsolete. As an interesting aside, it will be fun to see how many players who always play the Germans are going to stick with Jerry when its KV1 vs. mark III in CM2, or when the CharBs and Matildas show up in CM4.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeff Heidman: The PzKpFw I was a training tank, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Training tank or not, it, as well as the II were pressed into service for which they were not well suited. The main advantage the Germans had was proper utilization of what they had (i.e. concentration of force at the decisive place and time, proper use of combined arms, etc...) and not superior equipment. However, you are entitled to your own (I believe wrong) opinion. [This message has been edited by Marlow (edited 12-29-2000).]