Conscript Bagger

Looks like a KV-2(?) behind an armored car.

Crap - Yahoo's "save as draft" apparently doesn't preserve attachments, so I don't have access to the .cmb file right now. I'll send it tonight when I get home. [ April 05, 2002, 01:19 PM: Message edited by: Offwhite ]

Depends on what your friends like in games - if they're micromanagers and control freaks, show them the QB generator, setup phase, orders, and so forth. If they're impatient with that stuff, show them a replay of a particularly intense turn from one of your games. And if all else fails, show them one of the racetrack scenarios.

Well, east of St. Vith to be precise. I've recently finished roughing out a map of the Pruemerberg working from one of Moon's topo maps. I'd appreciate it if someone who's actually been/lives there would take a look at the map and let me know if there's anything outrageously wrong with it. Reply here and I'll shoot you an e-mail. TIA.

Did they change the bmp numbers between the demo and the published disk? Assuming not, you could at least preview your mods for the units in the demo while you wait for your CD.

LOL - Smiler, your post was the highlight of my day and fodder for a new sigline.

I apologize to all your PBEM opponents for pointing that out. I'm surprised you didn't know - since you've been a member of this board longer than I have, I thought you'd just misspoken in your post. Makes me wonder how many things I still have to learn about CM! :eek:

This is potentially confusing, as there are two concepts being discussed at once. With on-board mortars there are two ways to fire out of LOS: 1. While in command of a HQ unit that can see the target you're firing at. In this case, both the mortar and the HQ are free to move wherever they like before and after the mortar fires (except, IIRC, mortars can't fire from inside a building). 2. While targeting a Target Reference Point (purchased under the "Fortifications" category, and not available in all scenarios). In this case, it's not necessary so far as I know for the mortar to be in command. However, it cannot have moved from its game-start position before firing on a non-LOS TRP. Once it has moved, the only way to fire out of LOS is using method #1 above.

You can call it the Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy if you like, but that won't make it so. The point is to surprise the opponent with the sudden appearance of troops where he isn't looking for them; to do so you'll have to move up fairly quickly, yes - but "quickly" doesn't have to be "recklessly." By doing this, you contact him while his troops are on the move as well, not deployed for attack, which removes some of the attacker's superiority. If he knows what he's doing, he'll be advancing in a formation that is resistant to ambush, but you will still inflict damage, and force him to react to the threat. At any rate, you'll note I made a point of cautioning against being caught in a protracted fight. Maybe all you do is whack his scouts - fine, now he's got to split some squads he'd planned to use in the main attack. You've forced a change to his plan, his timetable, and his mindset, which - while intangible - is still of value in the battle. Intel is a byproduct of this tactic, not a prerequisite for it (and there's nothing saying there's no room for recon in such a tactic). You certainly don't get information on his force by sitting in your foxhole on the MLR and letting them come to you, or when you do, it's too late to be of much use. What I was saying is that with a battalion, you have enough troops to use a significant number (a company) for the maneuver described while still having a strong force for the rest of your defense. Granted, that depends on terrain, number of VL's, troop quality, whatever. If you felt that all you could devote to forward defense was a platoon, I'd suggest a different approach (perhaps recon alone) because they're not going to be as robust as a company for harassing work. Perhaps I should have made it more clear that the forward force is not meant as an attack that will break the enemy's combat power, nor is it a blocking force, nor is it a sacrificial lamb. You will need those troops later in the battle, which is why I said don't let them be fixed, overwhelmed, and destroyed. Hit and run once, twice, as many times as you think you can get away with, then pull back before they're trapped.

Jason - I don't either; that's why I didn't suggest "charging." Frankly, I'm amazed that one so prolific as yourself could misinterpret my brief entry

Two things to try: 1. Make sure there is snow on the ground (yes, it's obvious, and you may kick me for suggesting it). 2. After applying mods, you'll have to re-enter the scenario. In other words, if you started a battle, minimized CM to apply mods, then maximized CM, you won't see the mods because the game has already loaded the graphics. Save the game (alt-S), then exit the battle (alt-A), then load the saved game from the menu and the new graphics should appear.

Since you've got an entire battalion at your disposal, place part of your force (up to a company, maybe more if you're aggressive?) well forward, and immediately move them toward the enemy - with so much wooded terrain you should be able to do this without being spotted right away. If his lead elements are suddenly in contact with an unknown number of your troops long before he expects it, he might panic a little bit. Bloody his nose for a turn or two, then pull back into the woods before he brings up enough units to pin you down (use the Withdraw command if necessary). Shift to the left or right and repeat; flank him if you can. He'll be forced to break off part of his attack or bring up the reserves to deal with these guys, and you'll probably delay him as well. Just don't allow him to decisively engage you, because he'll have the advantage in numbers. There's an old AAR (with screenshots) of "The Sunken Lane" at CMHQ (I think) that shows this tactic. If it's a QB map, there are usually enough openings that you can get decent LOS to the VL's, so that might be a way to use your arty spotters (preceding a counterattack if he took a VL.) Whatever you do, be sure to let us know what happens!

Agreed, hopefully this will disappear with the panacea we call "The Rewrite."

Hmm, IIRC this doesn't always work as planned. :eek: Michael</font>

I always start by organizing the infantry into platoons and companies, setting the heavy weapons and spotters aside. Once I decide which infantry is going where, then I dole out the support (including vehicles) based on where it'll be needed.

I'm looking forward to scenario designers providing us with "Russian counterattack" opportunities; they didn't just sit there after being encircled, I hope. ...or take a shower in Bill's bathroom? (apologies if you don't watch King of the Hill; just ignore it and keep moving)

Hey, if it ain't broke...

That sounds like it would hurt.

Right - that's exactly why I suggested leaving them off the board to begin with. Or placing them without ammunition and using the corresponding spotter. True... although I suspect it's usually going to be more trouble than it's worth. But with clear LOS on the Russian steppes, I'll concede the point. I take your point here too; I think you're saying the same thing I was (but from a different perspective): a scenario designer should carefully consider what size map is most appropriate to the action he wants to depict. But preparatory bombardments will be available to the attacker. It doesn't sound like I'm convincing you, which is fine, since I'd like to see the changes you suggest in CMBB too (I'm just explaining why I think the value of making the changes wouldn't justify the time it would most likely take). I do disagree that these issues are quite as crippling as you're presenting them right now; after all, just because gamey shelling is possible doesn't mean you're obligated to do it.

4 km is a pretty long map in CM. I ask again what is the chance that on-board mortars will ever play any part in the battle except indirect fire? In other words, how likely are they to be spotted and fired on by the enemy? It's not going to happen very often, so leave them off the map in the first place. This raises the range issue you mentioned. Sure, the abstraction makes unrealistic shelling of the far reaches of the map possible, but how often will you have any reason to do so? The fact that my opponent can call down a blind bombardment anywhere he likes is more than offset by the sheer size of the map; if he wants to waste his ammunition, I don't care if it's at a realistic range or not. I have a suspicion that a lot of us, myself included, use bigger maps than necessary. Why have, say, an 8 sq. km map if the fighting's only happening in a 4 sq. km area? Just so we can put mortars on-board and watch them shoot? If you do put them on the board anyway, there is already a way to direct their fire, like I said earlier - lots of TRPs.

And why did amazon give it an "11" rating? I'm still trying to figure out which of these are in the game. We all know there's no Blood or Gore... despite all the noise about it in the early days. Cartoon Violence is the most likely, although you can bet I'll be spending more time at view level 1 looking for Offensive Gestures.

I like to make and play on large maps, so I have sometimes thought it would be cool to see an FO's battery on the map. However, as I've read this thread and one or two previous ones discussing the same issue, I've reluctantly come to believe that in the vast majority of cases, there's really no reason to depict on-map indirect fire (more than it already is). Consider a map that is 2 km wide and 5 km long(and thus one of the hotly-anticipated "10 km maps"), with the line of battle about in the middle of the map. How much of your artillery support would even be close enough to the extreme front line (within 2.5 km) to be shown on the map in the first place? Mortars, yes. Tube artillery, much less likely. If the map were instead 1 km wide and 10 km long, you might be in the window for placing more types of artillery on the map, although 1000m is a fairly narrow slice of land. But assuming for the moment that there are one or two batteries of artillery directly east (or west, etc.) of your position to fall within that 1000m slice, how likely are they to ever play a part in the battle except through indirect fire? If the enemy starts 3500m away and has to fight your defensive line in the first place, chances are he'll never get within sight of your artillery (if he's even trying). It's much more likely that he'll never even realize your guns were on the map to begin with, so if all they're going to do is fulfill an OBA role, why bother putting them on the map? "The attacker might destroy my defenses and advance unopposed" you say... okay, maybe, but if that happens do you want to sit around for thirty turns while he comes to find your helpless guns? No thanks. Alt-U and challenge him to a rematch. A scenario may be representing some rear-area raid where artillery is itself the main defensive force, but in that case you shouldn't be making such a large map that indirect fire would even be possible, since the whole point is that the artillery were surprised by a nearby enemy before they had a chance to limber up and retreat. And as for a 10 km long map, how many of those do you want to see in the first place? "Oh boy, another chance to develop my waypoint placement skills." The only reason I can think of for a map that long is for a delaying action, during which your artillery would be scrambling to get off the map before the enemy reached them anyway, not taking calls for indirect fire missions. Another thing - I've probably spent upwards of 30 hours creating a 2 x 2 km map, and it's still not done. I don't even want to think about how long it would take to make a map more than twice that size - yet another reason I think 10 km maps will be rare. I mentioned mortars earlier, and they can of course fire indirect at TRPs. This works fine, as long as the scenario designer gives the defender enough TRPs to cover the battlefield sufficiently. If you really want to represent onboard mortars being directed by an FO, then buy a normal spotter, place a battery of mortars of corresponding size on the map with no ammunition, and if they get destroyed or forced to retreat, don't fire your spotter anymore. Sorry for the long post; I'm not usually so effusive. Anyway, like I said at the beginning, I don't think it's a bad or dumb idea to have enhanced on-board indirect fire, in fact I'd love to see it too. I'm just not at all convinced it's necessary. [ March 01, 2002, 11:49 AM: Message edited by: Offwhite ]

How were they fixed for AT guns in the early hours/days? I'd think they lost a lot of them in glider crashes too.

LOL Gyrene, ICS wasn't that bad!

Oooh, somebody's thinking today (more than I can claim after a late night of CM). And Vader, the EULA also states you can make a backup copy of the game, in case little Janey decides to see what Daddy's CD-ROM does when you put it in the microwave.