CMSF CoPlay - with a twist?

[LongLeftFlank]

Co-play.... with a Twist?

An interesting thought occurred to me while playtesting my Ramadi scenario (I'm not releasing it until I can actually win the damn thing, which I haven't done yet even though I know where the enemy is!).* Basically, I have some Marine squads trapped in the ghetto, and two rescuing platoons (Company QRF and Battalion QRF) entering at opposite ends of the dense urban map.* Radio atmospherics are terrible and so in theory each force doesn't know exactly where the besieged Marines or the other QRF is -- the QRFs must either link up first or do the rescue in separate groups. This situation would be ideal for Co-Play, but alas it doesn't exist yet.

Well, I can provide FOW re the besieged Marines by having them only appear as "reinforcements" late in the game.

But the two mobile forces, being controlled by the same player, DO have perfect knowledge of each other's locations, situation and intent. Oh well, nothing much I can do about that....

Or is there?

*****

Back in the 1970s, there was a strategy wargame whose name I can't be bothered to Google that was based on the fall of Germany 1945.* Not much fun for the bad guys, since the outcome is a foregone conclusion.

But wait!* One player took the Soviet forces + the German forces opposing the Western Allies.* The other player took the Western Allies plus the Ostfront Germans. And whoever did the better job of holding off his "Allies" won the game.

For further precedent, there is the classic American Heritage boardgame (those were fantastic games btw) "Hit the Beach" where up to 4 players played US forces racing to secure a Japanese-held island.... each time they knocked off a Jap defender they could plop it in front of their rivals. They could also "relieve" rival forces, sending them back to start.

So that way, nobody gets stuck playing the lame* bad guy forces to the foregone asymetrical conclusion.* Or rather, everyone is.

******

In CMSF it's easy enough to have both sides equipped with BLUE and RED troops.*

And the Ramadi map is flat and built up enough that with a few extra high walls or no-entry warehouses it's possible to prevent the rival back-to-back RED forces and the rival BLUE forces from coming into direct contact (indirect contact could be ascribed to airpower or friendly fire).

Thoughts welcome.

[BlackMoria]

Battle for Germany - Simulations Publications Inc (1975).

Ah, the memories. A very novel game mechanic and one that rarely gets seen. It would be interesting concept to explore though it will be a challenge to implement. I wouldn't like to see some 'artificial' high wall running through the map to separate the city into 'zones' to avoid mixture of forces. It would be a real shame to have such a gamey artifice put in make the concept work, particularly given the work you have put into the map so far.

[LongLeftFlank]

An alternative which has tempted me given the map size is to split the scenario into a mini-Campaign. Scenario 1 is the Battalion force making the fundamental call: link up first via the main highway or try to effect the rescue from the west? A Win means he relieved the besieged Marines (campaign over). A Lose means a linkup and scenario 2 with a combined force pushing from the east.

[Erwin]

I recall that game, I probably have it stored away someplace. And yes, I think it's a great model. Even as a conventional game with the existing CM2 technology I think it's very entertaining to have one force besieged and defending while another force (the rescuing cavalry usually) is attacking.

[gibsonm]

Yes but that doesn’t quite work on the very small maps we are limited to (unless the forces involved are very small too).

[LongLeftFlank]

Except for the ugly 2 story Berlin Wall running down the center, it will work perfectly on my Mulaab map -- a densely built up residential area with very few commanding buildings (3 stories max). It will not of course work at all well in a mech-centered game in open desert with lots of ranged weapons. I'm thinking of infantry games in closed terrain.

CM:A's Alpine environment, for example -- two "rival" platoons of desantniki approach a hilltop compound at night from opposite sides. Lousy communications, difficult to tell friend from foe in the darkness. Game ends once one player overruns his objectives.

The players would need a gent's agreement not to deliberately target the other guy's RED forces with your own -- self-directed TacAI shots can be ascribed to FOW. And perhaps it would be best simply not to move the muj forces at all, or only within a delimited zone, so they don't massacre each other either. Again, accidents will happen.

That would make a really trippy little RT online game.

[LongLeftFlank]

... But after getting my poor Golf Company pixelMarines monkeyhammered yet again tonight by the relentless AI counterattack, I am going to focus on finishing up the plain vanilla 1 player BLUE vs AI version first.

[Erwin]

"A Helluva Road Opening" is a good example of the one force attacks while a 2nd is besieged. Map seems big enough.

[abneo3sierra]

Quick question..

You mentioned it being easy to have both red and blue units o n the same side...how is this possible? If choosing "blue vs blue" no red units are given as options, and the same with red vs red, not allowing any blue options. I have tried to put this into a scenario I am making to allow for "ANA" type units to fight against "Red" with a small detachment of blue providing backbone to the ANA.

Beyond that though, your idea sounds quite intriguing.

[LongLeftFlank]

As soon as you switch it from BLUE vs RED to RED vs RED, the RED forces become available to both sides. Or you can go to BLUE vs BLUE. You can then switch it back and save.

I have no idea how the current ANA is kitted out, but you might want to take a look at the Iraqi Army and Police mods by M1A1TC (aka VladTemplar), available on GreenAsJade's site. You can then reskin the Syrian Special Forces troops as "good guys" -- they can split squads too!

[BlackMoria]

In fact, the scenario Joint Venture (in the repository) does just that. It is British advisors/trainers and ANA vs Taliban with American Marine and Brit reinforcements coming in to assist the beseiged blue force.

[abneo3sierra]

Very cool LongLeftFlank and BlackMoria...thank you both!